Couple of questions after 1st 5g AG batch

[blastfemur91]

So I brewed my first 5g AG batch yesterday, and it went pretty smoothly (only thing that really went wrong was spilling some base malt, but I had extra). Although I'm not worried that I ruined it or anything I do have a couple of questions for the vets.

Left some head space in the primary, but I am a little worried I left too much. Would it be okay to add water to get it to volume even though fermentation has started?

Also, I'm not sold on going to a secondary (it's a pretty simple IPA), but if I do choose that route I'd like to be clear on the process. Does the sediment from the primary get transferred to the secondary? If not am I just supposed to add water to get it to volume?

Thanks in advance!

 

[alhaxxor]

subbed

 

[SeeMont]

Congrates on your first batch and don't cry over splilled Malt. I just had to type that. I'm no expert but myself, I am not worried about a little excess head space, for me more is better than not enough. As far as secondary, after hanging around this forum, I have stopped using the secondary in my last dozen batches and have had no problem what so ever. As to volumes, I make sure I have plenty of wort in my BK. I know now from experience, with MY bk I need about 6.5 gallons of wort to get 5.5 gal into primary with a 60m minute boil. Good Luck

 

[LLBeanJ]

Headspace in primary is not an issue. The CO2 created during active fermentation will push all of the oxygen out through the airlock. Where it becomes a problem is in secondary (bright tank, actually) where there is no active fermentation taking place to create CO2 to expel the oxygen, which is just another good reason to avoid secondary altogether. If you do choose to transfer to a secondary vessel for clearing, minimize headspace as much as possible, or better yet, flush the vessel with CO2 before transferring. Also, no, you do not want to be transferring any sediment if you can avoid it.

 

[tschafer]

LLBean is correct across the board.

Personally, I always transfer to secondary.

Never used CO2 to flush that carboy and still get wonderful award winning beer.

But if I have a CO2 canister I would defiantly purge the carboy/vessel before racking…Hell, I might as well a CO2 canister this week.

 

[blastfemur91]

Great thanks for the tips!

I boiled about 8 gallons of wort still came up a smidge short. MAYBE a half gallon. I get the feeling from the replies I should just not worry about adding water to get the exact volume. Is that general consesus?

I'll attach a picture of my fermenter for reference.

 

[LLBeanJ]

No need to add any additional water. In fact, in primary, you generally want to leave excess headspace to provide room for the krausen. Speaking of which, good move on the blowoff tube. Hopefully, you won't need it if the headspace is adequate, but you'll be glad you have it if it does blow out.

Edit: Let me clarify... you don't need to add water for headspace purposes. However, if your volume came up short and your OG is high as a result and you would prefer that it be lower, then by all means feel free to add in the missing water to keep the recipe where it should be. Do it, don't do it, it's your call.

 

[kh54s10]

You will need that headspace!! If you are below your volume and your OG was OK or a bit high it would not hurt to add a little to get the amount into bottles that you want. Do not add too much or the blow off will be excessive. I fill to just over five gallons, marked on my Better Bottles and buckets.

If you do a secondary you do not want to transfer any of the trub. Secondary is more accurately described as a bright tank. No fermentation should take place unless you add some fermentables. It is mostly for letting sediment fall out of suspension.

 

[blastfemur91]

Great, thanks. I didn't realize till too late yesterday that I had forgotten to order a hydrometer so a FG would be kind of meaningless this go round.

I think I'll leave it. Rather have a slightly stronger brew than risk introducing nasties.

 

[judsonp]

I wouldn't add water at any stage, unless at the end of the boil you discover that your volume is way too low and your gravity way too high. Better to get a good sense of how the volume changes over the course of the process (you lose some water or beer every step of the way) and adjust your procedure the next time you brew so that you get closer to the right amount in the end.

For headspace, what LLBeanJ said: doesn't matter in primary; in secondary, fill it with CO2. Plus, don't bother with a secondary unless you really want it for clarity or long aging.

 

[dadshomebrew]

I understand the confusion as a recent all grain convert myself. It would seem the way we are taught using partial boils and dilution is part of the problem

For example. For a partial boil brew you are told to dilute your 2-3 gallons of wort to reach a final volume. Usually 5 gallons. Really you should be told to dilute your wort to reach the desired starting gravity.

As all grain brewers we are diluting our wort via evaporation with the goal of hitting the desired starting gravity. Ideally that volume will be what you intended (5 gallons, 10 gallons, whatever), but often it is not.

I guess the question is:
Do you want to make the same amount of beer everytime?
or slightly varying volumes of the desired kind of beer?

 

[pfgonzo]

Agree with the above. Headspace in primary is often essential. Fermentation will shove out any O2/airborn particles that might otherwise infect your beer, and you need room for krausen. Headspace in the secondary/bright tank is a no-no because you no longer have the production of C02. You want to minimize surface area in secondary, which is why using buckets for secondary is such a no-no. Big flat surface of beer that anything can land on when you open the lid is just asking for trouble.

My $0.02 on secondary/bright tanks. If I was planning on bottling a batch, I wouldn't do a secondary. No point. You're getting sediment in the bottles anyway from the carbonation process.

Kegged batches, however, always get one. Racking directly from primary to either a keg or bottling bucket will invariably scoop up some amount of the trub. Not an issue for bottling, as I said. With kegging, I use a bright tank to get the beer off the yeast once fermentation/conditioning is complete, and I give it another 2-3 weeks at 35F for ales, and 6 weeks for most lagers. Yes, I lager my ales, though for a short-ish period of time compared to actual lagers. Even more yeast settles out during this process, and while you can theoretically just leave it in the primary to allow the additional settling to happen, it's been my experience that significantly less trub is sucked up during the second racking (to the keg from the bright tank) because there was less to begin with in that vessel. Also, frankly, it's just easier to see how much more has settled when you've moved it to a new vessel.

By the time I finish a keg, and open it for cleaning, I have practically no sediment at the bottom, and I really don't have the "first pint or two are cloudy/yeasty" issue.

When you secondary, you ARE increasing your risk for infection/oxidation of the beer. This is logical, because you're adding a new vessel and transfer step. Those who caution against secondaries are right to voice this concern, but with proper technique and sanitation, it's really not that big of an issue.

[edit] Saw the above question which came in as I was typing. With my brews, I measure for my mash/sparge and approximate boil off. Whether I end up with 5.5g in the fermentor, or 5.25g or something in that range is all acceptable. The only time I ever had to top off was a crazy hot day where I ended up with only 4.5, and an OG that was way too high for the style I was making.

 

[jmitchell3]

Headspace in the primary won't be an issue.

Also, I'd recommend focusing on achieving the correct OG rather than the correct volume when doing an all-grain batch. With extract kits, they are designed so that when you follow the directions and "top-up" to your five gals, the OG will be at the desired place. With all-grain, your mileage may vary (I.e. Amount of sugar extracted in your mash process). Ultimately arriving at the desired gravity is of primary concern, and after that achieving the correct volume is a matter of dialing in your system.


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