Saison Cottage House Saison

[Zippox]

I wasn't too worried managing the heat, just wondering if I can start and stay at 85 from the get-go, or if a little bit of ramping is needed.

 

[EdMerican]

I wasn't too worried managing the heat, just wondering if I can start and stay at 85 from the get-go, or if a little bit of ramping is needed.

I ramped mine and it turned out a little bit too clean. It was fantastic, really. But as far a what is supposed to be a belgian style it lacked some of the funk I expected and was hoping for. It was a huge hit with everyone including me, but could have used a little more funk. I have never started anything hot ever so I don't know what it would do... but if you start around 65 and ramp a few degrees per day until hitting 85 or so it doesn't seen to add the funk as much as I would have hoped for.

That said I will brew this again and keep ferment temps around 65 for the duration to see what type of super clean awesomesauce I come up with. I suppose I should probably mention that I used safbrew T-58 but stayed true to the original grain bill and hop schedule. Not sure exactly how much that has to do with it but either way this recipe is a winner.

 

[EdMerican]

I wasn't too worried managing the heat, just wondering if I can start and stay at 85 from the get-go, or if a little bit of ramping is needed.

I ramped mine and it turned out a little bit too clean. It was fantastic, really. But as far a what is supposed to be a belgian style it lacked some of the funk I expected and was hoping for. It was a huge hit with everyone including me, but could have used a little more funk. I have never started anything hot ever so I don't know what it would do... but if you start around 65 and ramp a few degrees per day until hitting 85 or so it doesn't seen to add the funk as much as I would have hoped for.

That said I will brew this again and keep ferment temps around 65 for the duration to see what type of super clean awesomesauce I come up with. I suppose I should probably mention that I used safbrew T-58 but stayed true to the original grain bill and hop schedule. Not sure exactly how much that has to do with it but either way this recipe is a winner.

 

[BGBC]

I wasn't too worried managing the heat, just wondering if I can start and stay at 85 from the get-go, or if a little bit of ramping is needed.

Good practice is generally to ramp up to that temp, I believe.

Also just want to note that 3711 and T-58 are cleaner yeasts from what I've heard, compared to 3724 or 3726, in terms of the amount of funk you can get from them.

 

[NuclearRich]

Good practice is generally to ramp up to that temp, I believe.

Also just want to note that 3711 and T-58 are cleaner yeasts from what I've heard, compared to 3724 or 3726, in terms of the amount of funk you can get from them.

Yeah ramping is what reduces the fusel alcohol, 'hot'-ness. You don't want to start hot, but you do want a high end temp towards the end of active fermentation.

 

[Zippox]

I did not know that 3711 was known to be cleaner and produce less funk than others. I already bought the yeast so looks like I'll have to work with it.

Is a ramp of starting at 78 then going up to 85 within 32 hours alright? Or is even 78 too high you think?

 

[Cheesy_Goodness]

I brewed this up yesterday. Missed my OG by about 10 points (probably because of my boil off rate being way off) but I'm optimistic it'll turn out well.

Out of curiosity, how do you all keep your temps consistently in the 70s-80s? We keep our house in the mid 60s during the winter.

 

[Zippox]

Out of curiosity, how do you all keep your temps consistently in the 70s-80s? We keep our house in the mid 60s during the winter.

A 20 gallon storage bin filled with water and an aquarium stick heater. I got my aquarium heater from amazon for about 17 bucks.

 

[bd2xu]

A 20 gallon storage bin filled with water and an aquarium stick heater. I got my aquarium heater from amazon for about 17 bucks.

+1. I got a couple of those plastic laundry tubs w rope handles at Walmart for five bucks each. I always put my fermenter in there w water, if anything it absorbs the heat coming off the fermenter and keeps the temps stable. In hot weather you can add frozen two liter bottles to cool it down.

 

[azscoob]

I brewed this up yesterday. Missed my OG by about 10 points (probably because of my boil off rate being way off) but I'm optimistic it'll turn out well. Out of curiosity, how do you all keep your temps consistently in the 70s-80s? We keep our house in the mid 60s during the winter.

My fermentation fridge does double duty, it is a fridge with a dual mode temp controller (eBay fish tank heater control hack) so I can run the fridge to keep things cool, or it can run a small ceramic heater to keep things warm, it works rather well for me

 

[victory4MSU]

What would the extract version be for this?

 

[Zippox]

My stir plate broke. I have 196 grams of DME mixed into 1960 ml (nearly 2L) with the yeast pitched in. Me swirling it periodically wont get the BeerSmith suggested 372 billion yeast cells but will this be alright? I don't need to boil more water, cool it, and add it do I?

I should note I am making a 9 gallon batch.

 

[HBrew71]

My stir plate broke. I have 196 grams of DME mixed into 1960 ml (nearly 2L) with the yeast pitched in. Me swirling it periodically wont get the BeerSmith suggested 372 billion yeast cells but will this be alright? I don't need to boil more water, cool it, and add it do I? I should note I am making a 9 gallon batch.

It will be fine. It may just take a little longer. Keep swirling

 

[Zippox]

So I started the starter this evening. When do I put it in the fridge? Once it's no longer active? And it will be fine to pull it back out Saturday or Sunday (brew day) right?

 

[HBrew71]

So I started the starter this evening. When do I put it in the fridge? Once it's no longer active? And it will be fine to pull it back out Saturday or Sunday (brew day) right?

Yes, put in the fridge when the krausen falls and fermentation dies down. If you started this evening, fermentation may not complete until Saturday ... Thoughts of using it on Saturday may be little too optimistic. You don't have to put it in the fridge at all - you can dump the whole thing in your wert when you are ready.

 

[Zippox]

This recipe describes draining the mash onto the "First Wort Hops" then proceeds with batch sparging. I assume batch sparging drains into the keggle quicker than doing fly sparging. So my question is if I take the time to fly sparge, will the FWHs have a different character because the hops will be in the wort for a much longer period of time while I am draining?

Any other changes I should notice?

 

[azscoob]

This recipe describes draining the mash onto the "First Wort Hops" then proceeds with batch sparging. I assume batch sparging drains into the keggle quicker than doing fly sparging. So my question is if I take the time to fly sparge, will the FWHs have a different character because the hops will be in the wort for a much longer period of time while I am draining? Any other changes I should notice?

When I batch sparge I split the sparge into two seperate ones so I have my dough in volume, that I give a good stir to a few minutes before draining, my mash tun valve is opened about 25-30% because any more and I cannot get clear runnings (I crush my grain at a rather tight .022 currently) then I split my sparge volume into two seperate sparges, adding, stirring and letting sit 10-15 minutes, stirring again and letting it sit another 5-10 minutes to set the grain bed before slowly draining into the kettle, so between my first runnings onto the first wort hops and my split batch sparges...... with the time I let it rest to pull the most sugars out that I can with my gear, I would say the hops sit in the kettle before I start the boil for a good hour or more typically.

I've never fly sparged but I would imagine the time it takes can't be out of line with my process, I have very good results with the FWH using my turtle speed sparging, in fact I FWH most all of my recipes and always get compliments on the resulting beers.

 

[part16john]

This was one of 3 beers I entered in my first ever competition and I won gold for style and 3rd in BOS. I couldn't believe it! The brewer from moerlein said it was a good beer.

http://www.moerleincup.nkyhomebrewers.org/

This was a hit with my family.

I brewed this last night. I used citra hops, only had access to caravienne instead of caramunich and I couldn't find orange blossom honey at my Kroger so I used some local honey. I went with 3711 and it's bubbling away nicely, I used a blowoff tube after reading some of the posts. I will post a picture when it's ready.

 

[Zippox]

I decided to start fermentation with a higher temperature. It started at 75 for about 12 hours, then bumped up to 78 for another 12, now am sitting at 82 and will leave it there for a bit. -- I wanted to have some funky flavors come out of the 3711 (even though I heard it's not going to give out much).

Should I continue at 82 for the rest of the 4 weeks or bring it down?

 

[zhubbell]

I'm Ganna start gathering ingredients now!

 

[Zippox]

I'm Ganna start gathering ingredients now!

Good luck! Out of curiosity what are you doing about the honey/ where did you decide to pick it up from?

I got a local honey from a guy at work that is mixed flower. It's so tough finding a reasonable price for orange blossom honey that is local.

 

[zhubbell]

I actually am loading up on a bunch of grain, hops sanitizer, & some equipment to make the switch to all grain from northern brewers, so I was just Ganna get theirs - 3# for 19.99

 

[azscoob]

I actually am loading up on a bunch of grain, hops sanitizer, & some equipment to make the switch to all grain from northern brewers, so I was just Ganna get theirs - 3# for 19.99

You are gonna love going all grain!

 

[zhubbell]

I know, I'm already so excited!! I am more of a chef then a brewer at this point, so what I'm looking forward to most is recipe creation & ingredient experimentation, etc, and I was so excited running #s yesterday and seeing I could bring production cost down to $.30/beer for this saison going all grain and buying in bulk! Knowing me I'll have a dozen different renditions thought up, brewed and fermenting within a week of getting all the equipment together for all grain.

 

[zhubbell]

Bringing discuss back on topic (somewhat anyway), I was thinking one rendition I would do on this would be a similar process to a beer a recently tried - Aventinus Ichbock. They freeze the Aventinus, and pick out all the ice chunks, concentrating the flavors of the beer, and giving it the coolest velvety smooth texture. You think this could work on the French Saison as well or am I missing something??

 

[azscoob]

Bringing discuss back on topic (somewhat anyway), I was thinking one rendition I would do on this would be a similar process to a beer a recently tried - Aventinus Ichbock. They freeze the Aventinus, and pick out all the ice chunks, concentrating the flavors of the beer, and giving it the coolest velvety smooth texture. You think this could work on the French Saison as well or am I missing something??

Look into fractional freezing/ice distillation for more info...

 

[zhubbell]

Any suggestions on a good resource for this?

 

[zhubbell]

Ok, I'm almost done gathering everything I need. Grain mill should be here today, hops today or tomorrow. Grain, mash tun, yeast and honey will all be coming from northern brewer. Any suggestions on subs for a couple of the grains?

The 3 I'm looking at are:
For the pilsner malt, what do you think about using the weyermann Bohemian Pilsner instead of the regular pilsner malt? Cool, superior ingredient to use or bad idea that might taste awful??

Cara Munich, which I don't see available here, I was Ganna sub the German Dark munich but also wasnt sure about this vs. a light Munich malt. Any thoughts? Good ideas/bad ideas?

Finally, I have Citra....what about subbing Cascade for the other Hop? I have a bunch, and I know it is a Fuggle Hybrid If I'm not mistaken.

 

[zhubbell]

I know no one has responded yet, but I think I'm Ganna go with the cargill pilsner malt instead of the bohemian, but keep the other two changes.

 

[tagz]

Ok, I'm almost done gathering everything I need. Grain mill should be here today, hops today or tomorrow. Grain, mash tun, yeast and honey will all be coming from northern brewer. Any suggestions on subs for a couple of the grains?

The 3 I'm looking at are:
For the pilsner malt, what do you think about using the weyermann Bohemian Pilsner instead of the regular pilsner malt? Cool, superior ingredient to use or bad idea that might taste awful??

Cara Munich, which I don't see available here, I was Ganna sub the German Dark munich but also wasnt sure about this vs. a light Munich malt. Any thoughts? Good ideas/bad ideas?

Finally, I have Citra....what about subbing Cascade for the other Hop? I have a bunch, and I know it is a Fuggle Hybrid If I'm not mistaken.

I don't think the difference in pilsner malts would be that noticeable unless taken side by side. Certainly won't ruin it.

As for the caramunich, it's actually a caramel malt, so it's different than standard munich. It would be more similar to a caramel/crystal of the same lovibond than it would munich malt. Munich will add maltiness and color without adding any sweetness. That said, many folks add munich to saisons, and many also avoid adding crystal malts to saisons, so you'll make a solid beer either way.

This beer is all about the yeast. If you treat your yeast right, you'll end up with a great saison.