Cloning New England Brewing Company's Gandhi-bot

[Remmy]

That's a ton of hops. I used 15 oz. total (bitter with 1 oz. Columbus @ 60 min).

 

[m3n00b]

That's a ton of hops. I used 15 oz. total (bitter with 1 oz. Columbus @ 60 min).

Thanks. Where's your recipe?

 

[Remmy]

Thanks. Where's your recipe?

Brewed mine with DME (I'm the cool kid).

http://cdn.homebrewtalk.com/attachm...-england-brewing-companys-gandhi-bot-brew.png

1 oz. Columbus @ 60

1 oz. Simcoe @ 10
1 lb. Corn Sugar @ 10 min

2 oz. Columbus @ 5
2 oz. Simcoe @ 5

2 oz. Columbus (30-min. steep)
2 oz. Simcoe (30-min. steep)

2 oz. Columbus (dry-hop)
2 oz. Simcoe (dry-hop)

 

[m3n00b]

Cool thanks Remmy! My LHBS has this "Extra Pale LME" which really ferments down. My last big IIPA went from 1.087 to 1.013.

 

[nukebrewer]

So, looking at the op; no dry hopping on this? Just a monster hop stand?

Thanks man! I can't find your recipe post in here. The OP doesn't mention dry hopping unless I missed something. Also how long was the dry hop?

He may have modified the recipe on page 1. But I'm pretty sure the original called for dry-hop. I will wait 'til he chimes-in to verify that.

So what's the final recipe? The one in the OP has 20oz of hops after I add 4oz of dry hops. Seems like a lot.

I want to get as close to the real thing since I'll probably never get to try it.

Yes, the original recipe had dry hops, 2 oz each of Columbus and Simcoe for 4 days. For the second version I wanted to try a different hopping technique which why I took the dry hops and added them to the hop stand. If you want to add 20 oz of hops to your brew, that's your call, but mine only has 16 oz in both versions, only difference is when they're added.

As for getting as close as possible, that's you and me both. This beer is still a ways away before I consider it cloned. Nothing in this thread should be construed as meaning brewing the current iteration of the recipe will yield a passable clone.

 

[PrinceOfThePoint]

I bottled up 2.0 today and man does it taste promising. It'll have to wait for carbing to know for sure, but the bitterness is almost assuredly spot on and in any case it's definitely less bitter than 1.0. It got down to 1.009 even with the English yeast, so I hope that doesn't make it too thin bodied. Will report back when I taste a carbed bottle. Hopefully I can find some real GB to do a side by side with between now and then.

Hey! I am a big fan of the DIPA style and am really interested in starting to brew. I love Gandhi-Bot, it's like a dream!

Nuke, I live in Old Lyme. Actually, I don't anymore as of July, but I still visit there on the weekends. If you are interested, I would love to try your clone / see your setup / ask you a couple questions about the process, in exchange for a few cans of real Bot, to help you further.

Great to see everyone trying to clone such an awesome brew!

 

[nukebrewer]

Hey! I am a big fan of the DIPA style and am really interested in starting to brew. I love Gandhi-Bot, it's like a dream!

Nuke, I live in Old Lyme. Actually, I don't anymore as of July, but I still visit there on the weekends. If you are interested, I would love to try your clone / see your setup / ask you a couple questions about the process, in exchange for a few cans of real Bot, to help you further.

Great to see everyone trying to clone such an awesome brew!

That sounds awesome. My setup isn't the prettiest thing you'll ever see, but it works, and that's what counts. I'm actually brewing an all Citra DIPA on Saturday if you want to swing by. Let me know if you can make it.

 

[PrinceOfThePoint]

That sounds awesome. My setup isn't the prettiest thing you'll ever see, but it works, and that's what counts. I'm actually brewing an all Citra DIPA on Saturday if you want to swing by. Let me know if you can make it.

Oh man. That would be like the #1 perfect thing for me to be around for at this stage in my learning, but this weekend is a bad one for me Thank you so much for the offer. I will save some Bot for you.

I should be in Old Lyme from 12/20 through 12/25. Maybe you'll be free the 21st or 22nd. I envision my future brewing-self to be a master of the DIPA style! So to have someone in Groton trying to clone Bot... it would be ridiculous for me not to reach out! I will be in touch.

 

[nukebrewer]

Oh man. That would be like the #1 perfect thing for me to be around for at this stage in my learning, but this weekend is a bad one for me Thank you so much for the offer. I will save some Bot for you.

I should be in Old Lyme from 12/20 through 12/25. Maybe you'll be free the 21st or 22nd. I envision my future brewing-self to be a master of the DIPA style! So to have someone in Groton trying to clone Bot... it would be ridiculous for me not to reach out! I will be in touch.

I should be free one of those days. I don't know if I'll have any time for brewing that close to Christmas, but at least we could meet up and have a couple pints while talking shop.

 

[LoloMT7]

Not carbed yet but already it's pretty tasty! Not a clone but the aroma is close to the real thing!

 

[LoloMT7]

Oh and the color ? NAILED IT !!! Thanks again Brian for the real thing for the side by side. Saving another for when it's carbed up. I used 1 lb 2 oz of crystal

 

[finsfan]

Oh and the color ? NAILED IT !!! Thanks again Brian for the real thing for the side by side. Saving another for when it's carbed up. I used 1 lb 2 oz of crystal

Remmys always got some gandhi on hand I will have to try this recipe sometime this spring, hopefully someone will have it nailed down by then. Congrats on the great DIPA Clint!

 

[LoloMT7]

Remmys always got some gandhi on hand I will have to try this recipe sometime this spring, hopefully someone will have it nailed down by then. Congrats on the great DIPA Clint!

Thanks.. already have a great idea of what to change to nail it next time

 

[Remmy]

One thing is for sure. If you follow this recipe or slightly alter it, you will still end up with a fantastic beer.

 

[LoloMT7]

One thing is for sure. If you follow this recipe or slightly alter it, you will still end up with a fantastic beer.

Yup can't go wrong with Columbus & simcoe!

 

[nukebrewer]

Doing a head to head with the two Gandhi-bot clones I've made so far. I like 1.0 the best between the two, though 2.0 is still very good. Neither are Gandhi, though I believe I hit the nail on the head with color on 2.0. At this point, I think it may just be a matter of finding the right yeast, because they are both close, but not close enough for me. Also, and call me crazy, but I might dial down on the late hops to see what happens next time.


20131216_202600 by aaron.j.lott, on Flickr

 

[JohnnyO]

Stupid cold. I've been sick with a head and chest cold since Saturday. I want to pull a sample of this. It's in the fermenter since the 8th, and (even with a cold) it smells amazing.

 

[nukebrewer]

Based on the latest results from Gandhi-bot 2.0, I'm beginning to think I was going in the wrong direction with the hops. For the next brew, sometime around New Year's, I'll be keeping the grain bill essentially the same, except I'm adding an extra pound of base malt but the hop schedule is going to undergo a major overhaul. First, I think the ratio of Columbus to Simcoe is not right, so instead of 1:1, I'll be shifting to a ratio of 2(Columbus):1(Simcoe) and I'll be dialing way back on the amount of hops. It's going to be 8.5 oz of hops with no steep and 3 oz of dry hops. I don't know why, but I also have a sneaking suspicion that the FG of real GB is a bit higher than I originally thought, so I will be mashing at 152 F instead of 148 F. I welcome any comments on this. Cheers!

 

[wobrien]

I don't know why, but I also have a sneaking suspicion that the FG of real GB is a bit higher than I originally thought, so I will be mashing at 152 F instead of 148 F. I welcome any comments on this. Cheers!

How was the mouthfeel on your clone? Was it too thin, is that why you are changing up the mash? My feeling is that 148-152 is a big jump, maybe try 150? That's where I like to mash my IPAs for the best balance between being dry, but not too thin.

 

[LoloMT7]

How was the mouthfeel on your clone? Was it too thin, is that why you are changing up the mash? My feeling is that 148-152 is a big jump, maybe try 150? That's where I like to mash my IPAs for the best balance between being dry, but not too thin.

I have had good luck mashing at 150 for IPAs as well.

 

[nukebrewer]

How was the mouthfeel on your clone? Was it too thin, is that why you are changing up the mash? My feeling is that 148-152 is a big jump, maybe try 150? That's where I like to mash my IPAs for the best balance between being dry, but not too thin.

It wasn't watery or anything, but I just felt like there should have been more to it based on what I remember of Gandhi-bot. I'll do a little more research on the mash temp and see what I think, but thanks for your input.

 

[nukebrewer]

All right. So I am currently doing a side by side with 2.0 and the real thing. First thing you'll note, obviously, is the clone recipe remains a smidge darker than the real deal. I'll have to back off further on the crystal 40 for the next one. One thing I didn't notice until just now is that Gandhi-bot is carbonated a lot more than I typically carbonate my beers and I think that may be a key factor in getting the bright hop character I'm trying to match. I'll probably carbonate to 2.5 volumes next time instead of the 2.0-2.2 I've been doing. I also think my previous comment about the hop bill is probably right. The hop character in 2.0 seems oversaturated to the point of being muddled, so next brew I will be employing a reduced hop bill with modified schedule to try out the "less is more" concept I just read about in For The Love Of Hops. Right now I am thinking either the steep or the dry hops need to go, but I am not sure which one. Thoughts?


20131227_194000 by aaron.j.lott, on Flickr

 

[mewithstewpid]

I wouldn't ditch either the dry hop or hop steep. If anything I would get rid of later hop additions, similar to the heady clone where hope are added at only 90 min, 5 min, 0 , and dry


Gandhi has such great aroma I would image it has to have both steep and dry

 

[Remmy]

It's also probably one hop added at 0 min and dry hop. My guess is Simcoe only rather than a combination of Simcoe and Columbus.

 

[nukebrewer]

I wouldn't ditch either the dry hop or hop steep. If anything I would get rid of later hop additions, similar to the heady clone where hope are added at only 90 min, 5 min, 0 , and dry


Gandhi has such great aroma I would image it has to have both steep and dry

That's a good point. I hadn't considered that. Maybe I'll give that a try before I try taking one or the other out.

It's also probably one hop added at 0 min and dry hop. My guess is Simcoe only rather than a combination of Simcoe and Columbus.

What makes you say that?

 

[Remmy]

The fact that the aroma is Gandhi is very citrusy makes me think more Simcoe are used toward the end of the boil and at dry-hop as opposed to Columbus, which doesn't smell as citrusy to me.

In my clone attempt, I used 1 oz. Columbus to bitter and 13 oz. of hops (Columbus & Simcoe) for flavor/aroma/steep and dry-hop. 7 of the remaining 13 oz. were Simcoe. Maybe that had something to do with my beer tasting more peach/apricot-like than you guys' clones.

 

[nukebrewer]

Well, that and you used Conan, haha.

You could be right on that, but I don't have a good enough nose to make a credible guess as to which one is used more. My personal thought is that Columbus is used more, but that's just from smelling the beer and the raw hops by themselves, so it's not a very accurate measure by any means. My next try (aside from the bittering hops) is going to use a 2:1 ratio of Columbus to Simcoe and we'll see where that gets me. I have enough Columbus and Simcoe to brew this at least twice more before needing to order more, so if more Columbus doesn't work I will try using Simcoe more on the next one.

 

[LoloMT7]

I think you guys are on the right track and it is not an even mix on the hops. I'm going to do more Simcoe than Columbus for the late and dry additions when I brew it again. I'll have to order more hops so it will be awhile. I need to get a few trades sent out right away and then I'll bottle up some of my clone like attempt I am calling Apollo-bot and I'll send you and Remmy some Nuke. It's not a clone but it is an awesome beer

 

[m3n00b]

So I got everything for the bot. I'm going to use us05 in the high 50s to get that Conan aroma.

 

[jakeasaur]

So I got everything for the bot. I'm going to use us05 in the high 50s to get that Conan aroma.

Make sure you a d rest at those temps.