Careers in Brewing

[BigJefe]

Hey everyone -

So my employer is in all likelyhood relocating to a horrible state which I have no desire to move to. I will not mention where because I wouldn't want those of you living there to be offended.

That being said I knew I didn't want to do accounting the rest of my life and started homebrewing to develop knowledge of brewing to hopefully one day make it a carrer, and if not at least make some good beer.

Earlier this year I reached out to local breweries to hopefully get an apprenticeship (no pay, just experience), but I was unsuccessful largely because I believe having a non-employee in the brewery area would be frowned upon by insurance companies. However, given the upcoming changes to my employment situation, I'm planning on looking for a position at a brewery.

My question is, without any official training what is the likelihood that I could get a job at a brewery? There are several breweries in San Diego (Stone, Karl Strauss, Ballast Point, AleSmith, Port, Coronado, etc...), so I'm in the right place, but might there also be a large population of people with brewing experience?

Those of you who brew professionally, how did you get your start?

I've got a lot of questions, but I'll leave it with that to hopefully get some help.

Thank you.

 

[Scooby_Brew]

I will not mention where because I wouldn't want those of you living there to be offended.


Thank you.

OK, now I'm REALY offended.

 

[whitebirdfeathers]

Is it Indiana? It's Indiana isn't it!?

 

[mlg5039]

Not much chance of finding a carreer. But finding a career might be easier.


Good luck with your endeavor.

 

[doctorRobert]

Ha! You're in socal! Nobody wants to live there... good luck to you.

I dont know many pro brewers on this forum. I know a pro brewers forum exists on the net, but I dont remember the name.

But just like any new career, you just have to be persistent and you'll get in.

Also, brewing is a lot of manual labor. It might be cheaper to teach somebody what to do for low wages, than to have someone who might demand more money but who is also interested. So just a thought, it would be awesome to be a pro brewer, not awesome to clean out mash tuns and fermenters all day for 8 bucks an hour.

 

[pcollins]

I don't currently brew professionally but I did for a chunk of time and worked in a brewery for about a year and a half.

What Doctober Robert said:

So just a thought, it would be awesome to be a pro brewer, not awesome to clean out mash tuns and fermenters all day for 8 bucks an hour.

Made me laugh. That is exactly what the head brewer did!! In the size of brewery that I was in I was trained to do EVERYTHING. Retail, bottling, kegging, cleaning, brewing, weighing, driving forklift... EVERYTHING.

Your best bet? If you are motivated and hard working, go in and talk to the head brewer and see what he/she says. At this point in time what have you got to lose? That's almost exactly how I landed my job. I had no experience working in a pro brewery but some homebrew experience. I'm reliable, do what I say I'm going to do, work hard, get the job done. You don't need much more.

If you want more than a bottom rung position be prepared to work harder and want more than the next person. If you're going into a brewery with no pro experience the head brewer will have to train you and will have to see a reason to train you. In my case I trained up to be the brewer's assistant because a) they had money to do so and b) they saw a need for it.

Go for it!!

 

[RenoDean]

Nevada isn't that bad, we don't pay state income tax.

 

[GDubya]

Is it Indiana? It's Indiana isn't it!?

I was thinking it was probably Louisiana Anyway I agree with pcollins. As long as you work hard and are reliable then as long as there is a spot open I don't see the problem.

 

[slowbie]

I can't speak for how things are 'usually' done in a brewery, but I can say that I've spent some time on New Holland's website and as I recall, about half of their brewers are people who started out doing warehouse/inventory type work and worked their way up.

However, before you get started I would suggest considering why you enjoy homebrewing and what aspects of it you would like to make into a career. If you're like me (and based on my observation, most people who homebrew) you like the recipe design and experimentation. There is little to no room for this as a professional brewer, especially if you're not the head brewer. Most of your time will probably be spent cleaning out mash tuns and fermenters, on the bottling line, and other miscellaneous tasks.

 

[BigJefe]

I can't speak for how things are 'usually' done in a brewery, but I can say that I've spent some time on New Holland's website and as I recall, about half of their brewers are people who started out doing warehouse/inventory type work and worked their way up.

However, before you get started I would suggest considering why you enjoy homebrewing and what aspects of it you would like to make into a career. If you're like me (and based on my observation, most people who homebrew) you like the recipe design and experimentation. There is little to no room for this as a professional brewer, especially if you're not the head brewer. Most of your time will probably be spent cleaning out mash tuns and fermenters, on the bottling line, and other miscellaneous tasks.

This is my impression as well... I'm not put off by shoveling and scrubbing for $8 an hour... I'm still relatively young, but the window of willing to accept minimum wage employment is quickly closing.

I wouldn't expect to get a job at a brewery where they put me in charge of anything other than a bucket, and to be honest I wouldnt feel comfortably with anything more at this time... I would however like to get in and eventually play a larger role, and better to give it a shot now, than when I'm 40.

I would still continue to homebrew as a hobby. Actually what I enjoy most is the history, science and creation parts... Starting with the most basic of materials and creating something people all over the world enjoy and have enjoyed for centuries...

 

[robertbartsch]

It is OK, I live in NY and the state and local taxes here are higher than California. I've been a CPA in public practice for 30 years, and I have made a good living and will likely retire 10 years early. It beats sparging tons of grain IMO.

Anyway, yeh, you could get a job at a local brewer but why would you if accounting will pay you a multiple of what you might make toting grain?

If you want to own a brewery, that is different.

 

[mk78]

It is OK, I live in NY and the state and local taxes here are higher than California. I've been a CPA in public practice for 30 years, and I have made a good living and will likely retire 10 years early. It beats sparging tons of grain IMO.

Anyway, yeh, you could get a job at a local brewer but why would you if accounting will pay you a multiple of what you might make toting grain?

If you want to own a brewery, that is different.

Speaking as someone who made a lot of money at a job I dreaded waking up for every morning and then gave it up to make half the pay doing something I actually enjoyed, I'd say a few bucks is a small price to pay for happiness.

The difference here is that you actually like accounting (otherwise you'd be sparging tons of grain, no?), but it doesn't sound like the OP does.

 

[JVD_X]

Just a suggestion... I went another direction... I am learning how to SELL and MARKET beer. We all pretty much have the basics and even some advanced brewing under our belts - and while operations are not a direct scale - IMHO being good at selling beer is the most important if you want to be in the industry.

Just my 2 cents and take it for what it's worth - I have only been doing this for two weeks.

BTW - you make 40 sounds like I am already over the hill and should just put myself out to pasture! It's not THAT bad getting older... puts a lot of crap in perspective.

 

[jpc]

It is OK, I live in NY and the state and local taxes here are higher than California. I've been a CPA in public practice for 30 years, and I have made a good living and will likely retire 10 years early. It beats sparging tons of grain IMO.

Anyway, yeh, you could get a job at a local brewer but why would you if accounting will pay you a multiple of what you might make toting grain?

If you want to own a brewery, that is different.

What state and local taxes are higher in New York than in California? The last I checked, California had a higher income tax, as well as a higher sales tax. Property taxes are generally more in New York.

 

[teej_810]

1. i have no idea what working in a brewery is like but i'm sure its nothing like most people think it is and is as fun as brewing at home. Unless your the head brewer.

2. once you turn something you have fun and enjoy into work, it no longer becomes fun and enjoyable. (most of the time)


but i guess it can't hurt to ask.

 

[PirateBrewer]

Just a suggestion... I went another direction... I am learning how to SELL and MARKET beer. We all pretty much have the basics and even some advanced brewing under our belts - and while operations are not a direct scale - IMHO being good at selling beer is the most important if you want to be in the industry.

Just my 2 cents and take it for what it's worth - I have only been doing this for two weeks.

BTW - you make 40 sounds like I am already over the hill and should just put myself out to pasture! It's not THAT bad getting older... puts a lot of crap in perspective.

You say that you are learning to sell and market beer, which is awesome! I actually want to get into craft beer sales but have been kind of stuck figuring out how. I work part time for Duvel USA/Brewery Ommegang doing tastings but that's really it. I get to talk to people and learn the products. It really has nothing to do with profit margins, actual selling techniques, etc. How have you been going about learning this stuff??

 

[RDWHAHB]

It's got to be TX, right? Maybe Oklahoma, but very close to TX border if that is the case...

 

[BigJefe]

Speaking as someone who made a lot of money at a job I dreaded waking up for every morning and then gave it up to make half the pay doing something I actually enjoyed, I'd say a few bucks is a small price to pay for happiness.

The difference here is that you actually like accounting (otherwise you'd be sparging tons of grain, no?), but it doesn't sound like the OP does.

Right, I got into accounting because it is something that comes pretty easily for me. I'm pretty talented in math, dig spreadsheets, and have some weird OCD when it comes to balance/symmetry (useful for reconciling and keeping debits and credits in order). When choosing a degree in accounting in college it was because I wouldn't have to study much and I could spend more time watching sports and drinking beer. What I should have been doing is learning more about beer at that time. However, long-long-long term if I ever have an opportunity to start my own brewery, I'll be glad I have a accounting background when it comes to the financial management tasks.

I also see my boss(es) and how much time they spend at work and it is something I NEVER want, and before you say "long days at a brewerey aren't uncommon dude," I'll say yes, that is brewing, something obviously anyone on this board pays money to do and enjoys. I really don't know any CPA or other accountants who will go home and spend money to do accounting as a hobby... Those would truely be some sick people.

Taxes, budgeting, finance... I help all my friends and family with, most I'm willing to help at no cost, some for a couple bombers of AleSmith's Speedway Stout. I don't go over to a friends house and say "oh dude, lets get started on our 2010 returns."

It is like the phrase "A bad day of fishing beats a good day at work." A bad day working at a brewery, beats a good day working as an accountant. To be honest I think the only good days as an accountant are paydays.

If brewing is something you toil over I'm wondering why you would spend your free time doing it.

 

[BigJefe]

It's got to be TX, right? Maybe Oklahoma, but very close to TX border if that is the case...

We have a winner.

 

[NorCalAngler]

This is terrible to say and I hate typing it out, but have you thought about reaching out to one of the macros for a job with your silent intent of learning as much as you can from them to beef up your brewing experience? It's almost like sleeping with the enemy, but more in the gold-digger type role.

 

[BigJefe]

NorCal -

If I lived near one I would... Although it would probably blacklist you from ever working at a microbrew if they saw it on your resume. HAHA

 

[RDWHAHB]

This is terrible to say and I hate typing it out, but have you thought about reaching out to one of the macros for a job with your silent intent of learning as much as you can from them to beef up your brewing experience? It's almost like sleeping with the enemy, but more in the gold-digger type role.

It makes a lot of sense. Switch industries, but keep your profession. Then work on switching professions when you are in the right industry. The double jump is a lot harder.

 

[slowbie]

NorCal -

If I lived near one I would... Although it would probably blacklist you from ever working at a microbrew if they saw it on your resume. HAHA

Not true actually. I heard an interview with a guy who used to work at one of the big guys. IIRC he works at Stone now.

 

[jonalexdeval]

You can try getting into an extension course or graduate program in brewing science... along with an internship or plain old job at some brewery... not a bad combo.

 

[JVD_X]

You say that you are learning to sell and market beer, which is awesome! I actually want to get into craft beer sales but have been kind of stuck figuring out how. I work part time for Duvel USA/Brewery Ommegang doing tastings but that's really it. I get to talk to people and learn the products. It really has nothing to do with profit margins, actual selling techniques, etc. How have you been going about learning this stuff??

I'm starting out in tastings at a retailer and at a winery. I am doing competitive analysis and am starting organizing sales activities in a bootstrap way. I think they call it putting skin in the game. It was luck really.

 

[NorCalAngler]

Move up here to Davis and take the UC Davis Masters in Brewing course. http://extension.ucdavis.edu/unit/brewing/course/description/index.asp?type=I&CourseID=22529

Budweiser has a large factory right up 80 near Fairfield. Pull out some student loans while money is cheap and the economy sucks, get your education and gain experience in a corporate brewery. Then take your show on the road.

 

[PirateBrewer]

I'm starting out in tastings at a retailer and at a winery. I am doing competitive analysis and am starting organizing sales activities in a bootstrap way. I think they call it putting skin in the game. It was luck really.

Ahhh gotcha! I guess I will just have to hope that my tasting job with Duvel starts to blossom and expand into roles similar to what you are doing!