Did you bottle condition this beer? Yes, there are obviously breweries making this style and getting it to last more then two weeks, but even they don't have nearly the shelf life of a more traditional IPA. The canned NEIPAs usually start to "fall off" around the three week mark (from canning date) in my opinion.
The problem as I see it is the process of bottling and/or bottle conditioning this style of beer in the manner we home brewers usually do. I've made beers of this style where I started with distilled water, added CaCl and gypsum to get to about 140 ppm each of Cl and SO4, used phosphoric acid to get the mash in the 5.3 to 5.4 range and brewed a wonderful beer, only to have that beer turn brown and relatively flavorless after two weeks of bottle conditioning. I have brewed the same beer in the same manner and kegged it instead, and it stays wonderful for a couple months.
It is quite clear to me that O2 exposure is the problem here, and this style is more susceptible than others. Anyone denying that or looking for another explanation is barking up the wrong tree.
Nobody disputes that lots of homebrewers are having O2 issues with the style. The "why" is the real question though.
olotti, what was your malt bill for the DIPA?
I found this thread after having a couple of NE IPA attempts go dark and manky within a week in the bottle.
I'm of the opinion the yeast is the problem, well some knock on effect of the yeast, probably the lack of flocculation in combination with the hops. I've made 4 recently, 2 with vermont ale/conan, one with WLP644 and one with US-05, as I wanted to see whether the haze was yeast and/or hop level related.
Process and equipment was the same for all and the recipes near identical, with all pale malt, all 0 minute additions only (200gr for 20L) and 200gr for 20L of dry hops. The 644 and US-05 have no issue and both the vermont had gone dark within a week in the bottle.
Have anybody tried adding antioxidants (SMB, ascorbic acid etc.) at bottling time?
I never made the connection before, but I'm wondering if you might be right. I do recall that the first NEIPA I ever brewed used 1318 and was bottle conditioned. That one never turned brown, but then I tried several batches bottle conditioned with Conan and they all turned brown. That is what caused me to switch to kegs.
I just realized I've done the same thing. I haven't used Conan in prob 6-8 months and prob never will again, I just like what 1318 adds to these beers. I still bottle condition and have never had an issue with oxidation since I switched yeasts. I'm trying one with 007 this week so guess I'll see how this holds up. Wonder what it is with Conan that causes this over other yeasts especially 1318 since that seems to hang in suspension even longer.
Interesting results thanks for posting!.
Did you bottle condition with carbonation drops or with priming sugar?
Looking forward if we would get the same results using purged bottles with a beer gun and oxygen scavenging caps, or test again using a different yeast.
Have anybody tried adding antioxidants (SMB, ascorbic acid etc.) at bottling time?
One fermenter was dry hopped once at day 7.
One fermenter was dry dopped twice, once at high krausen, once at day 7.
Polyphenol oxidase-enzymatic browning
Care to elaborate?
I've bottled another batch after switching to 1318 from Conan and my off flavor and browning have gone away.
Care to elaborate?
I've bottled another batch after switching to 1318 from Conan and my off flavor and browning have gone away.
Is an oxidized polyphenol still a polyphenol? Point 3 implies otherwise.
If a polyphenol can be oxidized it's awkward to state it's an antioxidant...
Cheers!
ftea and madking this is great information! Is there a chance that this oxidizing process with Conan also contributes to why Heady Topper is not as hazy as Trillium, Tree House, and Hill Farmstead beers?
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