Can you over-extract with a batch sparge?

[Hwk-I-St8]

Curious if it's something you watch for...

 

[madscientist451]

The last few beers, I heated a few extra gallons of water and did a second batch sparge. The wort came out 1.030. I boiled it down, added some hops and rye LME and fermented it in a gallon jug. It actually came out just as good or better than my original recipe. Not sure if the extra gallon of beer was worth the extra time, but I enjoyed drinking the results!
My plan is to repeat this when I feel like it and use the mini-batch to try out different yeasts and hops.

 

[RM-MN]

Simple answer is yes.

If you do more than 2 batch sparges and don't treat your water you can raise the pH enough to extract tannins if you use hot water for the sparge. However, most people won't do more than 2 sparges because the next sparge will have very little sugar in it and it would need boiled down to account for the extra water. A fourth sparge will be nearly pure water.

 

[IslandLizard]

What they said. ^

When you batch sparge 2x it's difficult to over-extract.

I split the batch sparge into 2 equal volumes. With a 1.5 water/grist ratio 1st running are typically 20-30 points higher than the pre-boil OG. 2nd runnings (=1st sparge) 10-20 points lower than pre-boil OG, and 3rd runnings (=2nd sparge) between 1.015-1.030 depending on the OG. I do add minerals to the sparge water and acidify a little (Bru'n water). As long as the runnings don't drop below 1.012 (a 3rd sparge could do that) and the pH remains below 5.8 you're fine.

I've had times where the volume came up short, and eked an extra gallon from the mash tun with a 3rd sparge. It came in at 1.012/1.014 IIRC. That's pretty watery.

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

OK...sounds like I'm low risk. I typically do only one sparge. I take the first runnings, then add hot water treated with minerals (no specific ph adjustments for the sparge water) add it, stir and let sit for 10 mins. Then drain it and go. I've ad pretty good efficiency this way, so I've not felt the need to do another round.

 

[IslandLizard]

OK...sounds like I'm low risk. I typically do only one sparge. I take the first runnings, then add hot water treated with minerals (no specific ph adjustments for the sparge water) add it, stir and let sit for 10 mins. Then drain it and go. I've ad pretty good efficiency this way, so I've not felt the need to do another round.

Yeah, with one batch sparge load your gravity never gets into the danger zone. You still may need to acidify your sparge water if it has higher alkalinity as there is less buffering at that point.

You don't even need to let it sit for 10 minutes. Good stirring (without beating air into it) is most important to help move sugars absorbed in the grain bits into solution. Then let stabilize for a minute or so, vorlauf and drain. I vorlauf about a gallon, sometimes more, or twice.

 

[kh54s10]

So the real answer is that unless you do something really unusual - like sparging 3 or 4 times, no you will not over extract.

I would suggest that you do not add minerals just willy-nilly. If you don't know the chemical makeup of your water adding things could upset the balance and make things worse, not better.

I apparently have very good water in my town and have only made additions in 3 batches out of 95+. I do not even own a pH meter. I would stack my beers against most commercial beers in the mid price range. I have only made a couple of batches that I didn't feel comfortable sharing with my friends. They tell others how much they like my beers.

I too stir the mash, vorlauf (for me it is usually less that 2 quarts and it is running clear) then drain. Sparge, stir, vorlauf and drain. I usually do a second sparge, but that is only that I can more accurately collect the right preboil amount without leaving anything in the mash tun.

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

So the real answer is that unless you do something really unusual - like sparging 3 or 4 times, no you will not over extract.

I would suggest that you do not add minerals just willy-nilly. If you don't know the chemical makeup of your water adding things could upset the balance and make things worse, not better.

I apparently have very good water in my town and have only made additions in 3 batches out of 95+. I do not even own a pH meter. I would stack my beers against most commercial beers in the mid price range. I have only made a couple of batches that I didn't feel comfortable sharing with my friends. They tell others how much they like my beers.

I too stir the mash, vorlauf (for me it is usually less that 2 quarts and it is running clear) then drain. Sparge, stir, vorlauf and drain. I usually do a second sparge, but that is only that I can more accurately collect the right preboil amount without leaving anything in the mash tun.

I start with RO water and add minerals to achieve a specific profile.

 

[kh54s10]

I start with RO water and add minerals to achieve a specific profile.

Well you have a starting point. You do know pretty close what the water needs. If you were using tap water and adding things......

 

[hlmbrwng]

I split the batch sparge into 2 equal volumes.

Whenever I work on a recipe in Beersmith, the program ends up telling me to do a barge sparge that includes more water in the second sparge.

Eg. 1 gallons for first spage, 3 gallons for second sparge

What is the reason for this? I have considered just splitting it in half, but I'm not sure if there is a solid reason for not.

 

[IslandLizard]

Whenever I work on a recipe in Beersmith, the program ends up telling me to do a barge sparge that includes more water in the second sparge.

Eg. 1 gallons for first spage, 3 gallons for second sparge

What is the reason for this? I have considered just splitting it in half, but I'm not sure if there is a solid reason for not.

There's a checkbox for that in the mash profile you've selected in the mash tab. Yep, there, not where you can choose it as an option in your current recipe's mash tab. So you need to edit that mash profile and reselect it. You need to do that for any of those mash profiles where you want to use that...

That profile also has a checkbox for draining your mash tun before sparging.

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

Whenever I work on a recipe in Beersmith, the program ends up telling me to do a barge sparge that includes more water in the second sparge.

Eg. 1 gallons for first spage, 3 gallons for second sparge

What is the reason for this? I have considered just splitting it in half, but I'm not sure if there is a solid reason for not.

I would think that limits your OG unless got do an outrageously stiff mash or use sugar. My 1.67 OG brew at 1.25 qts/lb has less in the sparge than the mash.