BYO Double Pipe Wort Chiller

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erikrocks

erikrocks

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This article is in the current issue of BYO, but goes more in depth on the website. Has anyone built one of these? I like the idea for a few reasons:
1.) It's DIY
2.) It looks much easier to clean than my Blichmann Therminator
3.) It's easily modifiable: You can add piping (surface area) to fit your needs

I'm wondering how it would compare with the THerminator. Anyone have any experience?
 
Looks like a pretty cool idea. I like the idea of having a wall mounted chiller. I may even consider making one, but I would make one small change if so. I would make the connectors for the T's uneven so that it zig zags rather than goes straight across to aid in drainage. Seems to me that it would be easier to clean and dry that way. I do like the idea of hard piping for the wort, but would the thicker tubing walls insulate the wort much?

I think the best efficiency changer would be to find narrower internal wort piping for more surface area. and since the internal copper pipe is 1/2-inch ID copper tube type M (5/8-inch OD) tubing that is closer to that which most IC's are constructed out of would provide more cooling. I am going to ponder on this or a modified version to see if it can be improved on.
 
That is a very cool-looking idea, but for my money, I'm going to invest in a plate chiller. Much more effective and smaller... plus, it seems to me that unless you have these materials kicking around that it would cost as much, if not more, than a commercially-produced chiller with a good track record.

Cheers for the find!
 
I really don't know if this setup is better than a much more compact coiled counterflow chiller. The only advantage it has is that it can be brushed out, but the question is, do coiled CFC's really need to be brushed out, ever?
 
I read the article and have been drawing ideas to make a wall mounted version with some tweaks. I like the idea of being able to break it down to brush clean. I currently used a plate chiller and I always have the little wonder in my mind if its totally clean or not. Even after boiling and sanitizing, you could still have something left in there.

Does anyone break down their equipment after each brew and see what is actually in any threaded pieces? There is always something there. I break down everything after every brew to specific components. Looks like a garage sell of brew parts, but its clean!

I havent seen any youtube videos on this either...wonder if it was just an idea or if its is actually being used? It has potentional, but even in BYO it shows it setting there not hooked up to anything, but a very descriptive equation on how it should work.
 
It is an interesting idea, but I don't see this being an improvement over what is commercially available unless you're doing large batch brewing. And even then, I would think if I was doing 15+ gal batches, I'd probably look into a glycol set up before building something like this.
 
Wolfbayne said:
I read the article and have been drawing ideas to make a wall mounted version with some tweaks. I like the idea of being able to break it down to brush clean. I currently used a plate chiller and I always have the little wonder in my mind if its totally clean or not. Even after boiling and sanitizing, you could still have something left in there.

Does anyone break down their equipment after each brew and see what is actually in any threaded pieces? There is always something there. I break down everything after every brew to specific components. Looks like a garage sell of brew parts, but its clean!

I havent seen any youtube videos on this either...wonder if it was just an idea or if its is actually being used? It has potentional, but even in BYO it shows it setting there not hooked up to anything, but a very descriptive equation on how it should work.
Click to expand...
This is why I'm intrigued by this. No matter how long a recirculate hot PBW and flush with water, there's always a load of crap in my plate chiller. I've resigned myself to baking it before each brewday, which just seems like a big hassle.
 
US Plastics has the compression fittings.

This was my weekend brewery project. It went together pretty well. The only issue I had was that the compression fittings have to be drilled out to fit the 5/8 OD. I haven't done a heat test but it was pretty water tight- just a few drips from one or two of the compression fittings.
 
chopilot said:
US Plastics has the compression fittings.

This was my weekend brewery project. It went together pretty well. The only issue I had was that the compression fittings have to be drilled out to fit the 5/8 OD. I haven't done a heat test but it was pretty water tight- just a few drips from one or two of the compression fittings.
Click to expand...

You have any photos?
 
I haven't gotten around to paint it yet as I wanted to get through all the wet tests. I'm currently using zip ties to support the sections when it is hanging. I might look at modifying some of the PVC leftovers to make some braces.
IMG_1070.jpg

I also modified the original design to shorten the segments and just add an extra run. I did it because I wanted this to fit on the back of my brew cart and I also wanted to have all the connections on one end so they would be easier to manage. I also added a 1/2" compression to 1/2" FNPT fitting to the in and out sides of the wort line so that I could add my quick disconnections (currently Kent quick disconnects). For the water in and outs, I added 3/4" MNPT to 3/4" MGHT.
IMG_1072.jpg

Overall Parts List:
3 x 10' 1" PVC pipe - Home Depot - $3.49 each = $10.47
3 x 10' 1/2" copper pipe - Home Depot - $10.83 each = $32.49
14 x 1"x3/4" FNPT bushing - Home Depot - $0.96 = $13.44
12 x 1/2"x3/4" MNPT compression fitting - US Plastics - $2.01 each = $24.12
12 x 1" PVC tee - US Plastics - $0.54 each = $6.50 (you could get these at Home Depot but they were cheaper from US Plastics)
2 x 1/2"x1/2" FNPT compression fitting - US Plastics - $3.56 each = $7.12
2 x 3/4" MNPTx3/4" MGHT - US Plastics - $0.52 = $1.04
2 quick disconnects - already had
6' silicone tubing - already had
hose clamps - already had
PVC cement - already had

Total - $95.18

Looking back, I wonder if 5/8" OD x 3/4" MNPT compression fitting would have worked better since you might not have to drill them out.
 
That's awesome! And for under $100, it costs less than half that of a Therminator. I'm excited to read about your first brew session using it!
 
chopilot said:
I haven't gotten around to paint it yet as I wanted to get through all the wet tests. I'm currently using zip ties to support the sections when it is hanging. I might look at modifying some of the PVC leftovers to make some braces.
...
Looking back, I wonder if 5/8" OD x 3/4" MNPT compression fitting would have worked better since you might not have to drill them out.
Click to expand...

Looks nice but I'm not sure those compression fittings are sanitary or food safe on the wort side.

I've also dabbled with this idea and the only way it's an improvement over a CFC is that the inside can be cleaned and mounted flat, that's it. I don't think it's cheaper and it requires more construction time.
 
stamandster said:
Looks nice but I'm not sure those compression fittings are sanitary or food safe on the wort side.

I've also dabbled with this idea and the only way it's an improvement over a CFC is that the inside can be cleaned and mounted flat, that's it. I don't think it's cheaper and it requires more construction time.
Click to expand...

That's a good point - I will have to see if they are food safe. I know they can handle the temp. But, the only compression fittings that would actually touch the wort would be the two I added on the ends. The others have the copper line passing right through them and the silicone tubing connects the pipes. Worst case, I take the quick connect and compressions off and add silicone tubing hose camped to the copper to connect to the boil kettle.

I agree that cost wise, it isn't any cheaper than a CFC. Construction time was few hours so I didn't see it as a large expense in the labor but it was more than a CFC build would have probably taken. I liked the flat aspect of it and the fact there was no soldering.
 
I built something similar back in January, and I can confirm it works quite well. Here's mine for reference:

http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=296442#296442

The only issue I've had was the JB Weld that holds the copper in place in those photos wants to leak during chilling. I've since rebuilt with brass compression fittings on the ends, with o-rings to seal to the copper pipe. Those too had to be drilled out for the pipe to pass through.
 
You could probably form a "water hose" CFC into this shape and still get away with less time and money, still being flat.
 
mrjofus1959 said:
I built something similar back in January, and I can confirm it works quite well. Here's mine for reference:

http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=296442#296442

The only issue I've had was the JB Weld that holds the copper in place in those photos wants to leak during chilling. I've since rebuilt with brass compression fittings on the ends, with o-rings to seal to the copper pipe. Those too had to be drilled out for the pipe to pass through.
Click to expand...

Nice build!!!
 
stamandster said:
Looks nice but I'm not sure those compression fittings are sanitary or food safe on the wort side.

I've also dabbled with this idea and the only way it's an improvement over a CFC is that the inside can be cleaned and mounted flat, that's it. I don't think it's cheaper and it requires more construction time.
Click to expand...

http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=23047&catid=676

I've used these in the past, and the black fittings hold up well at boiling temps.

I've been thinking about building one of these to act as a pre-chiller.
 
BeerSawks, this is the exact build I want to do some day. I love the idea of it being integrated into the stand. Couple questions -

- How did you do those copper "U" bends on each end?
- I see you're down in Texas, which makes me think you might have some fairly warm ground water. I'm in NC and definitely have problems with that in the summer. How many feet of piping would you recommend for one of these badboys? It would be nice to get wort within a couple degrees of the coolant water.
- You mentioned it's easy to clean - what's your process?

Thanks and props on the build. You did a fantastic job.
 
NathPowe said:
- How did you do those copper "U" bends on each end?
- I see you're down in Texas, which makes me think you might have some fairly warm ground water. I'm in NC and definitely have problems with that in the summer. How many feet of piping would you recommend for one of these badboys? It would be nice to get wort within a couple degrees of the coolant water.
- You mentioned it's easy to clean - what's your process?

Thanks and props on the build. You did a fantastic job.
Click to expand...

Thanks!

1) I just used a tube bender I got at Home Depot
2)I have 48' of the 1/4" ID inner copper tubing. You could probably be fine with less. In the summer I use a recalculate ice water. I can get down to what ever my chill water temp is while running the pump at full speed. It takes about 7-8 min to chill 12 gallons of ~212 degree wort.
3) To clean I run hot water then I just pop off the ends and run a racking cane/dip tube brush through the tubes.

rodduley said:
How much wort do you have left in the chiller with it laying flat like that. Is there a way you can tilt it to recover the last bit of wort?
Click to expand...

There is roughly a little over a (2) pints of wort left in the chiller. I will run either sanitizer or boiling water to push the rest out.
 
biertourist said:
Anyone have any good perf numbers on these things?

Jaded Brewing seems to be selling these now but they don't have any perf data posted yet.
http://jadedbrewing.com/products/the-jaded-cfc

Adam
Click to expand...

I am definitely interested as well. I may end up building one but with hunting season here time is valuable and just buying something is fairly attractive right now. I have a brand new Chillius Convuluted Chiller waiting to go but I live out in the country and am on a well and am looking at every opportunity to decrease the amount or water usage and load I put on my well.
 
Referring back to my post in this thread that links to a similar build I did back in January - https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/byo-double-pipe-wort-chiller-428922/index2.html#post5585395 - here are some numbers I captured at that time. Note that I was whirlpooling as I chilled, so I don't have CFC exit temperarture noted.

CFC Results

46 F cooling water
200 F start with 12+ gal

150 F at 2:25
125 F at 4:30
100 F at 7:20
90 F at 9:00
80 F at 11:05
75 F at 12:25
70 F at 14:03
65 F at 15:48
60 F at 18:18
58 F at 20:00
 
TNugent said:
I am definitely interested as well. I may end up building one but with hunting season here time is valuable and just buying something is fairly attractive right now. I have a brand new Chillius Convuluted Chiller waiting to go but I live out in the country and am on a well and am looking at every opportunity to decrease the amount or water usage and load I put on my well.
Click to expand...

I love the fact that you're back with Derek St. Holmes!
 
For anyone that has made one of these do you just run straight copper pipe? I would think putting something around the outside of the copper pipe to agitate the flowing water would improve efficiency.
 
Docbruw said:
For anyone that has made one of these do you just run straight copper pipe? I would think putting something around the outside of the copper pipe to agitate the flowing water would improve efficiency.
Click to expand...

Rather than agitate the flowing water it should be more effective to agitate the flowing wort, a la the convoluted chillers. There was another setup similar to this in a Zymurgy issue a while back I believe. That setup was implemented with some strips of copper perhaps 4-6" long and just slightly less wide than the ID of the wort tubes. These strips were twisted into a spiral of sorts and inserted into the wort tubes. That would have pretty much the same effect as convoluted copper. I've thought about adding those to my build, but I'm happy enough with its performance that I haven't done so yet.
 
mrjofus1959 said:
Rather than agitate the flowing water it should be more effective to agitate the flowing wort, a la the convoluted chillers. There was another setup similar to this in a Zymurgy issue a while back I believe. That setup was implemented with some strips of copper perhaps 4-6" long and just slightly less wide than the ID of the wort tubes. These strips were twisted into a spiral of sorts and inserted into the wort tubes. That would have pretty much the same effect as convoluted copper. I've thought about adding those to my build, but I'm happy enough with its performance that I haven't done so yet.
Click to expand...

Here's a pic of the twisted copper strip from the Zymurgy Jan/Feb 2013 Gadgets Issue.

image.jpg
 
TNugent said:
I am definitely interested as well. I may end up building one but with hunting season here time is valuable and just buying something is fairly attractive right now. I have a brand new Chillius Convuluted Chiller waiting to go but I live out in the country and am on a well and am looking at every opportunity to decrease the amount or water usage and load I put on my well.
Click to expand...

I just wrote a long post and the back button ate it...
Instead of running water straight through on to the ground, set up a little cooling tower of sorts. Something like a "keg" bucket with a small pump independent of your circulation pump, or if you have one large enough "bleed " a little water into the air like a small fountain aimed into something that would diffuse the stream like a piece of metal, plastic or whatever it takes to splash it.
My concept here is like a regular swamp cooler. The water in the pump coming out is usually 50-55 F. So, you have a closed loop system version of a cooling tower, that doesn't use a lot of water (I don't think), and will continue to cool until the water temperature and the wort are in stasis. At that point since I don't know off the top of my head how much water a keg bucket holds, when done brewing use the water to garden with, fill the washing machine, etc. I hope this idea helps you out.
 
Hello guys! Happy to see the construction of this type of chiller has worked well for someone else. I built the smaller all copper version with static mixers that came out in Zymurgy, and later on i constructed the larger pvc frame chiller. The static mixers do help the heat transfer if you are pumping the wort. I use this wort chiller in a 2 stage cooling process as most of the time I am brewing lagers. First, a single pass from the brew kettle into the fermenter running tap water through the outer shell. Then, i use a recirc loop (fermenter-chiller) for wort and a recirc loop with ice-water through the outer shell. That does require the use of two pumps but it allows me to quickly chill down to 50F (or less) for my lagers at the peak of summer in Tucson, Arizona. Cheers!
 
Bwin said:
Hello guys! Happy to see the construction of this type of chiller has worked well for someone else. I built the smaller all copper version with static mixers that came out in Zymurgy, and later on i constructed the larger pvc frame chiller. The static mixers do help the heat transfer if you are pumping the wort. I use this wort chiller in a 2 stage cooling process as most of the time I am brewing lagers. First, a single pass from the brew kettle into the fermenter running tap water through the outer shell. Then, i use a recirc loop (fermenter-chiller) for wort and a recirc loop with ice-water through the outer shell. That does require the use of two pumps but it allows me to quickly chill down to 50F (or less) for my lagers at the peak of summer in Tucson, Arizona. Cheers!
Click to expand...

How long does it take to cool your wort useing your method? Do you have a video? I'd like to see your setup in action.

I have been doing 10 gallon (ale)batches and chilling with my traditional coil wort chiller, it takes about 30-40 minutes to get it to 80 degrees, but I want to do some lagering this spring and dont know if Im going to be able to get it that low.
 
mrjofus1959 said:
I built something similar back in January, and I can confirm it works quite well. Here's mine for reference:

http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=296442#296442

The only issue I've had was the JB Weld that holds the copper in place in those photos wants to leak during chilling. I've since rebuilt with brass compression fittings on the ends, with o-rings to seal to the copper pipe. Those too had to be drilled out for the pipe to pass through.
Click to expand...

...At the risk of resurrecting the dead...

@mrjofus1959, @Chopilot, and anyone else who has made this with pvc: How has it held up over time to this point.

I'm thinking of building one with the following configuration, and I figure it's as compact as I can get it. 26'-8" of copper in 8 sections. Any criticisms? Too long/too short for ~12 gal batches (70F tap water, recirc ice water in the summer)?

IhDvMp0.png

PPDljwS.png

Ep6DxtV.png


I could make this even more compact if I used 3/4" pvc, while the 1/2" copper will fit inside the 3/4" pvc does that restrict coolant flow too much?
 

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