Bulk aging

[thejuanald]

Hello,

I have two chest freezers, one for fermentation and one for serving, but my fermentation chest freezer is smaller and can only really hold 3 carboys. I was thinking of switching to using cornies for bulk aging my bigger beers (my next couple of beers will be a RIS for next winter and a barleywine), but my question is where should I age them? The options I really have are in the fermentation chamber, in the keezer attached to CO2, or just in my basement. There are problems with each location, though:

-If I age in my fermentation chamber, I would need to keep removing the kegs to hit it with pressure it to maintain the seal.
-If I age in the keezer, they will be sitting at around 38-40F which isn't great for bulk aging (I think?), but it will be on constant CO2
-If I age in my basement, they won't take up precious space, but again I will still need to continue attaching a CO2 line ever so often to maintain the seal.

Which option is best? I feel like the keezer would be best, but the temperature won't be great for aging. What do you guys do? I was considering a second CO2 tank for the fermentation chamber (or just in the basement I guess), but that will also take up space.

 

[helterscelter]

Hello,

I have two chest freezers, one for fermentation and one for serving, but my fermentation chest freezer is smaller and can only really hold 3 carboys. I was thinking of switching to using cornies for bulk aging my bigger beers (my next couple of beers will be a RIS for next winter and a barleywine), but my question is where should I age them? The options I really have are in the fermentation chamber, in the keezer attached to CO2, or just in my basement. There are problems with each location, though:

-If I age in my fermentation chamber, I would need to keep removing the kegs to hit it with pressure it to maintain the seal.
-If I age in the keezer, they will be sitting at around 38-40F which isn't great for bulk aging (I think?), but it will be on constant CO2
-If I age in my basement, they won't take up precious space, but again I will still need to continue attaching a CO2 line ever so often to maintain the seal.

Which option is best? I feel like the keezer would be best, but the temperature won't be great for aging. What do you guys do? I was considering a second CO2 tank for the fermentation chamber (or just in the basement I guess), but that will also take up space.

I like to bulk-age my stuff in cornies. I'm no expert however, so salt to taste.

* more CO2 is more better.. I definitely recommend getting additional tanks. just because co2 is so useful to have around.. I use it for moving beer around more than I thought I would when I started this hobby.. it's almost as big a game changer as getting pumps during brewday was (lifting buckets or carboys or whatever, sucks)

what I would recommend you do, (again, not an expert) would be to chill/crash in the cornies and fully carb your beers.. then take them out, stash them in the corner and age once they are fully carbed or mostly carbed.. bringing the keg up to room temp after carbing will ensure they stay sealed. you can reasonably forget about them for a very long time without really worrying too much. aging with co2 (afaik) is no different than aging without.

you can ofcourse carb at room temp, but you need to set your co2 psi appropriately.. and you'd need another bottle/regulator/etc unless you want to take the one out of your keezer for the duration.

(just get another bottle already! lol)

 

[thejuanald]

I like to bulk-age my stuff in cornies. I'm no expert however, so salt to taste.

* more CO2 is more better.. I definitely recommend getting additional tanks. just because co2 is so useful to have around.. I use it for moving beer around more than I thought I would when I started this hobby.. it's almost as big a game changer as getting pumps during brewday was (lifting buckets or carboys or whatever, sucks)

what I would recommend you do, (again, not an expert) would be to chill/crash in the cornies and fully carb your beers.. then take them out, stash them in the corner and age once they are fully carbed or mostly carbed.. bringing the keg up to room temp after carbing will ensure they stay sealed. you can reasonably forget about them for a very long time without really worrying too much. aging with co2 (afaik) is no different than aging without.

you can ofcourse carb at room temp, but you need to set your co2 psi appropriately.. and you'd need another bottle/regulator/etc unless you want to take the one out of your keezer for the duration.

(just get another bottle already! lol)

Yeah, I guess I can get an extra tank, like you said having a backup is always a plus. I do use my 10lb tank to transfer from the carboy to the kegs anyway so it would mean I don't have to disconnect the 10lb from the keezer to do this. The best solution is probably what you suggested, just carbonate it for a week or two in the keezer with the extra line I have in there for 'on deck' beers and then pull it out and let it hang out at room temp for some months with the extra tank there as an option if needed.

 

[Bombo80]

If you are set on bulk aging in kegs, and tying them up for a long duration, I would just hit them with enough CO2 to seal well, then disconnect the CO2. Check them periodically and top up the CO2 as needed. Otherwise, I bulk age my big beers in carboys. I have way more carboys than kegs. Either way you will be checking them periodically. Either for CO2 pressure or air lock sanitizer level.

 

[Nemanach]

You shouldn’t need to keep adding co2 to maintain the deal on a keg. I regularly leave kegs for months and they stay sealed.

 

[Morrey]

I agree with @Nemanach above in that if you need to keep hitting the keg with CO2, it may be time to change out the seals in your keg. For a Ball Lock keg, you'll use 5 O-rings and possibly a new pressure relief valve. That valve can be a source of leaks and it can easily be overlooked. Use keg lube on all seals and on the bottom of the PRV as it screws into the lid.

If your basement is nicely cool and temperate as one may surmise from your location, I'd personally opt to bulk age right in keg at ambient temps in the basement. Wont take up valuable room, and if you make sure the keg seals are refurbished, you shouldn't have to re-gas the keg.

 

[thejuanald]

You shouldn’t need to keep adding co2 to maintain the deal on a keg. I regularly leave kegs for months and they stay sealed.

I agree with @Nemanach above in that if you need to keep hitting the keg with CO2, it may be time to change out the seals in your keg. For a Ball Lock keg, you'll use 5 O-rings and possibly a new pressure relief valve. That valve can be a source of leaks and it can easily be overlooked. Use keg lube on all seals and on the bottom of the PRV as it screws into the lid.

If your basement is nicely cool and temperate as one may surmise from your location, I'd personally opt to bulk age right in keg at ambient temps in the basement. Wont take up valuable room, and if you make sure the keg seals are refurbished, you shouldn't have to re-gas the keg.

If you just hit the keg with CO2 and then let it go, wouldn't the CO2 just go into solution until an equilibrium is created for that temperature, meaning the CO2 in the headspace will be reduced and can loosen the seal and you'd have to hit it multiple times?

Edit: I just wanted to add I currently am using sanke kegs (of which I have two but have a keezer than can hold 6) but was just gifted 10 ball lock corny kegs so I am switching to that. I do plan on replacing all of the seals for these once I grab them

 

[Morrey]

If you just hit the keg with CO2 and then let it go, wouldn't the CO2 just go into solution until an equilibrium is created for that temperature, meaning the CO2 in the headspace will be reduced and can loosen the seal and you'd have to hit it multiple times?

Edit: I just wanted to add I currently am using sanke kegs (of which I have two but have a keezer than can hold 6) but was just gifted 10 ball lock corny kegs so I am switching to that. I do plan on replacing all of the seals for these once I grab them

Yes, I was incorrectly assuming that you'd have the keg carbed to the level that you prefer prior to conditioning. Uncarbed beer would be problematic in that it would absorb CO2 into solution as you mentioned. If it was my choice, I'd carb it to the proper level while cold, then move to the basement for longer term storage. Unless leaking is occurring, once you re-chill the keg to serve, carb volumes should have remained constant.

That was a heck of a gift to receive 10 BL kegs...way to go!

 

[mj1angier]

I bulk age in kegs. I just hit it with a burst of co2 when I put it in and then just let it sit in basement at 66-70 degrees till I am ready for it. The yeast will do some cleaning up and give off some co2. When I am ready for it, force carb and give it a few days to Settle before I tap.

 

[thejuanald]

Yes, I was incorrectly assuming that you'd have the keg carbed to the level that you prefer prior to conditioning. Uncarbed beer would be problematic in that it would absorb CO2 into solution as you mentioned. If it was my choice, I'd carb it to the proper level while cold, then move to the basement for longer term storage. Unless leaking is occurring, once you re-chill the keg to serve, carb volumes should have remained constant.

That was a heck of a gift to receive 10 BL kegs...way to go!

Okay so that sounds like the plan then I think, force carb them in the keezer then let them age in the basement for long periods.

and yeah, I was surprised he said I could just take them. He said that he stopped brewing awhile back and just has them in storage. It totally changed my plans on future upgrades for the better (obviously). I will be sure to replace all parts that I can and give them a very thorough cleaning.

 

[Morrey]

Okay so that sounds like the plan then I think, force carb them in the keezer then let them age in the basement for long periods.

and yeah, I was surprised he said I could just take them. He said that he stopped brewing awhile back and just has them in storage. It totally changed my plans on future upgrades for the better (obviously). I will be sure to replace all parts that I can and give them a very thorough cleaning.

That's what I would do since cold carbing works best to get the CO2 into solution. Then when the beer warms up slightly in your basement, it would tend to off-gas...but with a properly sealed keg, the gas has no escape route and carb levels are retained.

Those keg O-ring kits are inexpensive and can save you $$ on CO2 if you have leaks. I also keep a few PRV's on hand and have seen them need replacing too.

Sounds like you have a keen plan in mind!

 

[thejuanald]

That's what I would do since cold carbing works best to get the CO2 into solution. Then when the beer warms up slightly in your basement, it would tend to off-gas...but with a properly sealed keg, the gas has no escape route and carb levels are retained.

Those keg O-ring kits are inexpensive and can save you $$ on CO2 if you have leaks. I also keep a few PRV's on hand and have seen them need replacing too.

Sounds like you have a keen plan in mind!

Thanks for the input I will definitely do that.

 

[Nemanach]

Okay so that sounds like the plan then I think, force carb them in the keezer then let them age in the basement for long periods.

and yeah, I was surprised he said I could just take them. He said that he stopped brewing awhile back and just has them in storage. It totally changed my plans on future upgrades for the better (obviously). I will be sure to replace all parts that I can and give them a very thorough cleaning.

You could save co2 and carb naturally. I will put in half the amount of priming sugar as normal, purge a few times and fill to 12 psi. The beer isn’t completely carbonated when it is done but it is close. I have put in the full amount of priming sugar before and found the keg overprimed. I do this because I have more kegs than fridge space and I thought it might help yeast scavenge oxygen.