Bruery Societies 2015 Allocations/Discussion Thread

[ASUBeer]

Are they really not doing an anniversary beer this year?

Surprised by this as well. I've always really liked their anniversary beers.

 

[Rau711]

I think the problem with their anniversary beers was that they make way too much so it sits around. They had Sucre up at the shop right up until New Years. I thought I heard that Chrono is the same beer, and the 16.5% ABV would be close enough to think that, and instead of different barrels they are doing different times.

 

[boogercrack]

it'd be interesting if they decided to abandon the whole "solera method" project though.

if it wasn't all used up in sucre there's got to be a glut of the beer left somewhere.

 

[JulianB1]

Remember there's also the "Arbre" series, which is some kind of beer aged in different barrel types. Wouldn't be shocked if that's basically a reboot of the Anniversary series.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't part of the hook on the anniversary series that it was a partial solera of previous years? Perhaps they completely ran out of stock of all the previous years and couldn't keep that going.

 

[johnnyramirez]

Remember there's also the "Arbre" series, which is some kind of beer aged in different barrel types. Wouldn't be shocked if that's basically a reboot of the Anniversary series.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't part of the hook on the anniversary series that it was a partial solera of previous years? Perhaps they completely ran out of stock of all the previous years and couldn't keep that going.

Arbre is different levels of char on an oak barrel. Which honestly sounds kinda awful since American Oak Bois was awful. Haven't had American Oak Sucre but I can't imagine it's that good either

 

[JulianB1]

Arbre is different levels of char on an oak barrel. Which honestly sounds kinda awful since American Oak Bois was awful. Haven't had American Oak Sucre but I can't imagine it's that good either

Ahh yes, I see that I misread the idea. New American Oak Sucre was decent from what I recall. Better than Tequila, worse than Rye.

 

[Rau711]

I really wish they would stop putting things into wine barrels.

 

[3rdto1st1]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't part of the hook on the anniversary series that it was a partial solera of previous years? Perhaps they completely ran out of stock of all the previous years and couldn't keep that going.

Not how Solera works, you can't really "run out" unless you stop producing new batches.

 

[CommanderofAwesome]

Damn didn't even notice the lack of Anniversary beers. Rum Sucre was incredible, probably my favrotie beer they made last year.

 

[DougOLis]

I really wish they would stop putting things into wine barrels.

Said no one ever.

 

[Rau711]

Said no one ever.

I am pretty sure I just said it, let me scroll up and check. Yup, I did, I will say it again too. I really wish they would stop putting things into wine barrels.

 

[JulianB1]

I am pretty sure I just said it, let me scroll up and check. Yup, I did, I will say it again too. I really wish they would stop putting things into wine barrels.

You don't like wine barrel aging on sours?

 

[Rau711]

You don't like wine barrel aging on sours?

In sours I can't really pick up any wine notes. In stouts it just drys them out to me, and I am not a fan. Just to be safe though they should stop buying wine barrels.

 

[Xul1]

Arbre is different levels of char on an oak barrel. Which honestly sounds kinda awful since American Oak Bois was awful. Haven't had American Oak Sucre but I can't imagine it's that good either

NAO Sucre was significantly better than NAO Bois. I had the same expectation going in since NAO Bois was a woody mess, but they had a much better handle on how to work with NAO last year. Doesn't necessarily mean the Arbre series will be good, but there is hope for it.

 

[jtmartino1]

In sours I can't really pick up any wine notes.

This is pretty surprising to me, since the barrels are so pronounced in RR's sours, some Cascade beers and others like Lost Abbey FDA. Maybe you're confusing adjuncts with barrel-aging?

I would probably stop buying expensive beer if I couldn't detect barrel-aging notes in sours.

 

[Rau711]

This is pretty surprising to me, since the barrels are so pronounced in RR's sours, some Cascade beers and others like Lost Abbey FDA. Maybe you're confusing adjuncts with barrel-aging?

I would probably stop buying expensive beer if I couldn't detect barrel-aging notes in sours.

I am not a big sour guy, I just started to get into them. Didn't like the RR sours when I tried them a long time ago, beat/FFAC I liked recently. DDG is the only LA sour I have has, and not sure on any Cascades without checking my untappd. To me most barrel aged sours are more for time to develop the yeast/bugs than flavor impartment.

 

[franch]

nao bois was infect-y. nao sucre isn't.

also i have too many ******* anniversary beers does anyone want any.

 

[drgarage1]

nao bois was infect-y. nao sucre isn't.

also i have too many ******* anniversary beers does anyone want any.

Not infected, but I hated how NAO sucre tasted.

 

[ASUBeer]

nao bois was infect-y. nao sucre isn't.

also i have too many ******* anniversary beers does anyone want any.

<------ this guy

 

[DougOLis]

also i have too many ******* anniversary beers does anyone want any.

Ditto

 

[DougOLis]

I am not a big sour guy, I just started to get into them. Didn't like the RR sours when I tried them a long time ago, beat/FFAC I liked recently. DDG is the only LA sour I have has, and not sure on any Cascades without checking my untappd. To me most barrel aged sours are more for time to develop the yeast/bugs than flavor impartment.

If you don't think a wine barrel changes a sour, you should do a side by side of La Vermentoise and Le Sarrasin. Night and day. One is a pretty mediocre saison (and substandard for HF) and the other is heavenly. I don't disagree that a lot of that is just aging and letting the bugs do their work, but if you compare RR's Sanctification and Temptation there is quite a bit more depth that you get in the Temptation versus the stainless aging of Sanctification. Additionally, new oak barrels are way too harsh for most sours and spirit barrels add/change/dominate too much as well for most. Saying that no value (or detrimental value) is added from wine barrels is pretty ridiculous.

I'm a little more indifferent on no stouts in a wine barrel, but I don't have a problem with any of The Bruery's big sweet beers being dried out a little. I don't love Wineification but I do think it is substantially more drinkable than Black Tuesday on its own.

 

[Rau711]

If you don't think a wine barrel changes a sour, you should do a side by side of La Vermentoise and Le Sarrasin. Night and day. One is a pretty mediocre saison (and substandard for HF) and the other is heavenly. I don't disagree that a lot of that is just aging and letting the bugs do their work, but if you compare RR's Sanctification and Temptation there is quite a bit more depth that you get in the Temptation versus the stainless aging of Sanctification. Additionally, new oak barrels are way too harsh for most sours and spirit barrels add/change/dominate too much as well for most. Saying that no value (or detrimental value) is added from wine barrels is pretty ridiculous.

I'm a little more indifferent on no stouts in a wine barrel, but I don't have a problem with any of The Bruery's big sweet beers being dried out a little. I don't love Wineification but I do think it is substantially more drinkable than Black Tuesday on its own.

I have no idea how wine and Saisons work. The 2 sours you mentioned are completely different beers. 1 is 100% brett while the other is brettanomyces, lactobacillus, and pediococcus. Not really comparing apples to apples. I have no idea how the Bruery handles wine barrels, but if they clean them as thoroughly as other breweries do, then the wine flavor is all but gone and you are at a basically used plain oak. I never said wine barrels made sours worse, I just don't taste wine on most wine barrel aged sours.

 

[drgarage1]

I have no idea how wine and Saisons work. The 2 sours you mentioned are completely different beers. 1 is 100% brett while the other is brettanomyces, lactobacillus, and pediococcus. Not really comparing apples to apples. I have no idea how the Bruery handles wine barrels, but if they clean them as thoroughly as other breweries do, then the wine flavor is all but gone and you are at a basically used plain oak. I never said wine barrels made sours worse, I just don't taste wine on most wine barrel aged sours.

Though it's called a "100% Brettanomyces" beer, Sanctification is made with lacto and pedio, just not sacchromyces. The comparison matters, because one is wine-barrel aged and one has no oak at all.

Wine barrels tend to have lots of surviving microbes in them, which spirit barrels don't, which is why wine-aging a saison tends to turn it into a sour -- vielle style.

 

[Rau711]

Though it's called a "100% Brettanomyces" beer, Sanctification is made with lacto and pedio, just not sacchromyces. The comparison matters, because one is wine-barrel aged and one has no oak at all.

Wine barrels tend to have lots of surviving microbes in them, which spirit barrels don't, which is why wine-aging a saison tends to turn it into a sour -- vielle style.

Did not know that about Sanctification as their website says its not as sour as a beer aged with lacto and pedio. As for the microbes in a wine barrel I agree, as for the taste of actual wine I just to not pick it up. No grapes, or other wine flavors in sour beers.

 

[stakem1]

Did not know that about Sanctification as their website says its not as sour as a beer aged with lacto and pedio. As for the microbes in a wine barrel I agree, as for the taste of actual wine I just to not pick it up. No grapes, or other wine flavors in sour beers.

I dont mean to add fuel to the fire of this disagreement/debate/derailment or whatever this is but I totally can agree with aspects on both sides of the argument.

There are many sour beers on the market that are advertised as having been aged in a certain type of barrel and no matter how many times I drink them and try to "get it" I just dont get that definitive statement that screams that specific type of barrel flavor. There is a depth of character going on in some wilds and I think you gotta be crazy in tune with your palate and knowledge base to know the nuance of what vinous flavors are and what imparts them. Such as: simply a type of wine varietal barrel verse micro interplay verse a combination of both. Having said that, I dont know if ive had many beers that were aged in freshly dumped, still wet wine barrels. (You know, like spirit barrels there is a crazy difference between a wet barrel verse a dry one.) Im not big into wine but freshly dumped wine barrels doesnt seem like it has the turnaround rate like spirit barrels. It was my understanding that wine barrels get used multiple times until they are deemed no longer useful. Does that mean because they get flawed, defective, etc? I dont know.

Side note: i can only recall 1 sour beer made locally that has crazy wine flavors without actually having grape must/juice added to it and i know that beer was aged in a barrel that was sloppy wet, freshly dumped.

I think we all can agree that there are environmental variables inside any type of barrel that will always and forever make a barrel aged beer different from a non barrel aged beer. The porous nature of wood creates an environment that microbes thrive in coupled with oxidative properties that a barrel introduces at an exponential rate verse stainless.

To keep the focus exclusively on russian river: dont they reuse barrels as least a few times before getting rid of them? It would make sense that their first use would have the most vibrant wine flavor extraction verse the third or fourth usage which certainly at that point has been diluted or become "neutral." A contrasting point to this is that i believe they then blend barrels together so any fresh barrels probably get blended into old, etc to make the flavor they are looking for. To take it a step further, at one time they deemed some barrels so exceptional that they set them aside and didnt blend them.

Holy ****, sorry for nerding out and throwing a book reply at you.

To get back on topic...yah! **** the bruery terreux (unless they have a coolship bruship installation planned

 

[drgarage1]

Did not know that about Sanctification as their website says its not as sour as a beer aged with lacto and pedio. As for the microbes in a wine barrel I agree, as for the taste of actual wine I just to not pick it up. No grapes, or other wine flavors in sour beers.

Sanct gets much more sour with age. My best guess is that the only reason the bacteria aren't evident early on is simply that it has a far shorter production cycle than the other Russian River sours.

The only sour I can think of with extraordinarily prominent wine character is Consecration. Huge Cabernet flavors. HF Art has a big wine barrel flavor, too, but it's a bit different from a sour.

 

[nanobrew1]

Sanct gets much more sour with age. My best guess is that the only reason the bacteria aren't evident early on is simply that it has a far shorter production cycle than the other Russian River sours.

The only sour I can think of with extraordinarily prominent wine character is Consecration. Huge Cabernet flavors. HF Art has a big wine barrel flavor, too, but it's a bit different from a sour.

I think Temptation is very wine forward, especially fresh.


I love Sanctification, I especially love using the culture for homebrews. Results are typically more tart as the bugs have time to catch up to the brett.

 

[FishPondManager]

I pick up a lot of wine as well in Temptation and Consecration. Those both stick out in my mind. The most wine forward beer I've ever had was the first batch of Figaro. Hated it because I'm not a big fan of chardonnay.

 

[robert1]

I'm pretty sure I read that RR blends the fresher wet barrels with the older multiple use barrels. Eventually they retire them to Beat.

 

[tcblack4d]

Does anyone know which months we can expect Chocolate Rain and Grey Monday? I've heard different things