Brewing mishap. Thoughts?

[IslandLizard]

“ You can brew extract beers with a fairly small pot. You just top up with water in the fermenter.”

yes you can but not ideally and there are a couple things you need to know. (1) your color is always going to be darker when you do a concentrated wort boil. (2) your hop utilization suffers and you will actually need to use more hops in a concentrated boil to achieve the same bitterness.

That said, many of us started out doing concentrated extract boils. The first time I ever made beer I thought I could make a clone of Molson Golden. That was one of my favorite beers back then. It was redder than Killians and the flavor was awful. But I was happy then just to have made beer.

Extract doesn't need to be boiled, it has been boiled sufficiently at the maltster already before it was condensed to LME or DME. Pasteurization will suffice, but may not even be required.

Therefore, most modern extract brewing instructions (e.g., How to Brew) and various threads here on HBT and elsewhere, will tell you to boil with only half or smaller amount of extract, and add the balance at flameout. That's to reduce caramelization, which reduces wort darkening, while making for a potentially more fermentable wort and fresher tasting beer in the end.

Boiling lower gravity wort also increases hop utilization (bittering reactions), creating the same or higher IBUs at lower hop dosages and/or shorter boil times.

 

[bwible]

Extract doesn't need to be boiled, it has been boiled sufficiently at the maltster already before it was condensed to LME or DME.

It does if you want hops in it

 

[IslandLizard]

It does if you want hops in it

No, extract itself doesn't need to be boiled. The hops do need to be boiled or at least heated above 150-170F,* if you want bitterness (IBUs).

But you can do that in plain water, then add all your extracts at "flameout."

* The higher the temp the faster the alpha acid isomerization reactions, the more bitterness gets generated.

 

[bwible]

No, extract itself doesn't need to be boiled. The hops do need to be boiled or at least heated above 150-170F,* if you want bitterness (IBUs).

But you can do that in plain water, then add all your extracts at "flameout."

* The higher the temp the faster the alpha acid isomerization reactions, the more bitterness gets generated.

You are entitled to your opinion, even though you are wrong

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

Therefore, most modern extract brewing instructions (e.g., How to Brew) and various threads here on HBT and elsewhere, will tell you to boil with only half or smaller amount of extract, and add the balance at flameout. That's to reduce caramelization, which reduces wort darkening, while making for a potentially more fermentable wort and fresher tasting beer in the end.

FWIW, Chapter 9 of HtB, 4e covers full volume boils of extract.

 

[IslandLizard]

FWIW, Chapter 9 of HtB, 4e covers full volume boils of extract.

I was referring to partial boils. That's brewing method the OP is following currently.
Pre-hopped extracts should never be boiled, AFAIK.

 

[MayBrew]

Hi all,

So yesterday I attempted my 1st ever brew. Im using a beer brewing kit with hops and barley extract. In the instructions it says that a minimun size pot of 5L should be used(stainless steal), which I have (next time im going to buy a larger pot).

I placed 3L of water to boil and then added the 1.5kg Ale kit and 1kg of brew hancer, lowered the temp to bring boil to a simmer. Everything was going well then all of a sudden a huge amount of foam from the boil appeared and the liquid started to boil over, not wanting the thick liquid to spill all over my stove and kitchen i threw an amount of the boil into the sink, im not sure of how much but maybe around 700ml to 1L.

Off to a bad start. The way i tried to compensate was to fill my fermention bucket to around 21L instead of the recommended 22L.
My OG was 1033 (ideal for this kit was 1036). This morning I woke up at 5am and i wanted to check the temp and noticed that my airlock was bubbling (im assuming thats a good sign considering what happened).

What do you think the affect of this will have on the final outcome? Any thoughts?

I can't really give any advise, but it seems like we using the same product from the same seller, luckily I didnt have the same issue but another one. Hope your brew comes out right, I have noticed that the brewers instructions is quiet strict, but from the bat I always used my own common-sense. From the sounds of it, its going ot be all right

 

[Brulian]

I can't really give any advise, but it seems like we using the same product from the same seller, luckily I didnt have the same issue but another one. Hope your brew comes out right, I have noticed that the brewers instructions is quiet strict, but from the bat I always used my own common-sense. From the sounds of it, its going ot be all right

I got my supplys from NFP in Johannesburg. Yeah hopefully it comes out alright and drinkable, thats the main thing
How long do you leave it to ferment because on the instructions it says 7 days however most info i see on the internet says to leave it for at least 2 weeks so im not too sure.

Goodluck with your brew, how much time do you have left on it?

 

[MayBrew]

I got my supplys from NFP in Johannesburg. Yeah hopefully it comes out alright and drinkable, thats the main thing
How long do you leave it to ferment because on the instructions it says 7 days however most info i see on the internet says to leave it for at least 2 weeks so im not too sure.

Goodluck with your brew, how much time do you have left on it?

Same here, they selling pretty good stuff, I'll be starting a Windhoek clone some from them, im hoping to leave extracts at my third brew. Looks like it will come out right, looks like NDZ (die doek) has plans for ban till December. I my lager for 8 days at 17 D.Celsius, seems as if I should have left it longer maybe 10-12 days, so two weeks is just about there.

My brew is in the conditioning phase, about 3 days in now and its already way to carbonated (1F wasnt fully done) but I am "burping" now till who knows when

 

[Brulian]

Same here, they selling pretty good stuff, I'll be starting a Windhoek clone some from them, im hoping to leave extracts at my third brew. Looks like it will come out right, looks like NDZ (die doek) has plans for ban till December. I my lager for 8 days at 17 D.Celsius, seems as if I should have left it longer maybe 10-12 days, so two weeks is just about there.

My brew is in the conditioning phase, about 3 days in now and its already way to carbonated (1F wasnt fully done) but I am "burping" now till who knows when

Oh wow...
Banned till December, that is crazy! Hopefully they decide to allow sales again soon, also to help out the economy.
But in any case we will be set with our brews .

Do you think its over carbonated due to the short fermentation time? I reckon ill leave it for 10 days and then add the finings making it 12 days in the fermentation bucket (maybe ill leave it for 14 days total) and then proceed to bottling, hopefully that will sort out any issues.

Is the windhoek clone an extract as well? Do they have Castle & castle lite extract clones?

 

[MayBrew]

I do think that that the extra carbonation is mostly due to the short 1F and thats due to the temperature wasn't optimum for a lager, my priming was exact. Leaving in for ferment for 10-days I think will be best, also it doesn't clear all that well even after finings, so leaving it 4 days is much better than the recommended "48 hours" again. I think I will source my own finings (Isinglass) I think the NFP's directions are for our summer season rather than our cold winters especially highveld winters.

Oh if you have any problems with your capper let us know

 

[Brulian]

I do think that that the extra carbonation is mostly due to the short 1F and thats due to the temperature wasn't optimum for a lager, my priming was exact. Leaving in for ferment for 10-days I think will be best, also it doesn't clear all that well even after finings, so leaving it 4 days is much better than the recommended "48 hours" again. I think I will source my own finings (Isinglass) I think the NFP's directions are for our summer season rather than our cold winters especially highveld winters.

Oh if you have any problems with your capper let us know

Yeah i reckon ill leave it for the 14 days, better be safe then sorry.
I have a cap machine which is in good condition but if anything comes up ill let you know. The only thing is im looking for bottles i need about 65 X 330ml bottles or 48 X 440ml bottles but buying them new is pretty expensive, however if i cant organise the used bottles then ill just buy them new its not terribly expensive.

 

[davidabcd]

Boiling lower gravity wort also increases hop utilization (bittering reactions), creating the same or higher IBUs at lower hop dosages and/or shorter boil times.

Good info. The first batch in which I did use much less DME at 60 minutes, the hops seemed to be too strong in my Belgian for first month of drinking. Before switching to more/most DME at flameout, I didn't have to be very concerned about an extra half-ounce of hops here or there.

 

[IslandLizard]

I have a cap machine which is in good condition but if anything comes up ill let you know. The only thing is im looking for bottles i need about 65 X 330ml bottles or 48 X 440ml bottles but buying them new is pretty expensive, however if i cant organise the used bottles then ill just buy them new its not terribly expensive.

Maybe you can get empties from a bar. Or friends. Be resourceful!

If breweries use returnable empties, you may be able to hoard, or buy them for their return deposit. Pick up some crates as well.
Now twist offs are generally not suitable for recapping, although some have claimed it to work.

Once you start making "production," bottling can become a bit of a chore, that's why many of us are kegging, instead.

 

[Brulian]

Maybe you can get empties from a bar. Or friends. Be resourceful!

If breweries use returnable empties, you may be able to hoard, or buy them for their return deposit. Pick up some crates as well.
Now twist offs are generally not suitable for recapping, although some have claimed it to work.

Once you start making "production," bottling can become a bit of a chore, that's why many of us are kegging, instead.

Yeah that was my idea and would be ideal however alcohol in SA has been banned for the past 3 to 4 months so bars, breweries and liquor stores have been closed, friends and family either dont have stock or dont have an abundance because we drink them wisely as "black market" booze is a lot pricer.

So its not as simple as picking them up used at the moment. I have asked friends so ill get a few bottles but ill probably end up buying.

 

[Shaika-Dzari]

That's not ideal but plastic bottle (PET) could be used.
I would not aged beer in one or keep them for long but it's fine if you can't get glass bottle.

 

[WesBrew]

almost time to pull a sample out of there and tell us how it tastes!
Boilovers typically occurs right as you reach a boil and when you add hops. you can mitigate this by reducing heat at those times and keeping a spray bottle of cool water. Spray to keep foam down.

 

[Brulian]

almost time to pull a sample out of there and tell us how it tastes!
Boilovers typically occurs right as you reach a boil and when you add hops. you can mitigate this by reducing heat at those times and keeping a spray bottle of cool water. Spray to keep foam down.

After how many days into the ferment do you reckon i should take a sample?
And the 1st (ive already taken the OG reading) FG hydrometer reading on the 7th day?

 

[Shaika-Dzari]

I personally wait 2 week before bottling. I take a gravity sample at the same time.
Fermentation could technically complete earlier (some complete after just a couple of days) but I prefer waiting 2 week, be sure and reduce oxygen exposition.

 

[Brulian]

I personally wait 2 week before bottling. I take a gravity sample at the same time.
Fermentation could technically complete earlier (some complete after just a couple of days) but I prefer waiting 2 week, be sure and reduce oxygen exposition.

Ive read that taking a SG reading 3 days in a row without it changing means the fermentation is ready. In that case should i start the readings on day 12 (therefore 12,13,14) ?

And hypothetically if i start the sg readings on day 4 to 7 without the reading changing then is there any point in leaving the fermentation for those 2 weeks or just proceed to bottling after just a few days of fermenting?

 

[Cro Magnon]

Hey there. I'm a new brewer as well. Was just reading about your woes with cooling. I can share one fairly primitive method I've used with success so far. I'm assuming you have to top up to reach your final volume in the fermenter? What I do is boil that top up amount the previous day, let it cool, and store it in sealed..and SANITIZED bottles in the fridge to chill. Even better, if you can time it right according to when you need to cool your wort, put it in the freezer till it's just above freezing. Then when your wort is chilling in the ice bath, use this chilled, sterilized water to top up, as well as rapidly cool down the wort. Like I said, primitive, but it's worked for my very basic brew setup!

On that note - to the more experienced brewers out there - you mentioned topping up with extract brews only. I've been topping up even with my all grain brews - is this a no - no?

 

[WesBrew]

After how many days into the ferment do you reckon i should take a sample?
And the 1st (ive already taken the OG reading) FG hydrometer reading on the 7th day?

Ale yeast is done in a week or less. the only reason to leave it in any longer is to cold crash the beer a day or two to get it to clear up more. otherwise you are just wasting time. when airlock activity stops (likely day 4 or 5) you can take a sample out to check it. when it hits the number that yeast ferments to, its done. if the beer keeps fermenting way below that, you've got a wild yeast infection.

 

[Brulian]

Ale yeast is done in a week or less. the only reason to leave it in any longer is to cold crash the beer a day or two to get it to clear up more. otherwise you are just wasting time. when airlock activity stops (likely day 4 or 5) you can take a sample out to check it. when it hits the number that yeast ferments to, its done. if the beer keeps fermenting way below that, you've got a wild yeast infection.

Without chilling equipment how would i "cold crash" im not fully aware of this method and what it entails. Cooling the beer down to how much? How quickly? is it super necessary to do this?

 

[Brulian]

almost time to pull a sample out of there and tell us how it tastes!
Boilovers typically occurs right as you reach a boil and when you add hops. you can mitigate this by reducing heat at those times and keeping a spray bottle of cool water. Spray to keep foam down.

Pulled a sample today and actually tastes like beer, well flat lukewarm beer but beer nonetheless. Still needs a little longer got a gravity reading of 1011 but im glad to be able to see process.

 

[WesBrew]

After fermentation, Gently place fermenting bucket in a tub of ice water for a day. The Sink might work too. Will cause yeast, hop and other particles to drop to bottom. Clear beer.

 

[WesBrew]

...you wouldn’t do this if you plan to naturally carbonate the beer in bottles. If so you’d bottle beer, put in refrigerator and let them condition there for several weeks. And be careful not to disturb sediment at bottom of bottles when pouring in glass .

 

[Brulian]

...you wouldn’t do this if you plan to naturally carbonate the beer in bottles. If so you’d bottle beer, put in refrigerator and let them condition there for several weeks. And be careful not to disturb sediment at bottom of bottles when pouring in glass .

Yeah ill be bottling my beer and storing them for about 2 weeks and then chill them for a few days before drinking.

 

[Brulian]

I can't really give any advise, but it seems like we using the same product from the same seller, luckily I didnt have the same issue but another one. Hope your brew comes out right, I have noticed that the brewers instructions is quiet strict, but from the bat I always used my own common-sense. From the sounds of it, its going ot be all right

Howzit Maybrew,
I was just wondering if you have tried any of the other beer extracts from NFP. I was thinking of trying out the IPA extract, its a more expensive than the other regular extracts but I think it will be great to brew in my next batch or maybe brewing the Real Ale extract.

Any recommendations?

 

[Cro Magnon]

...you wouldn’t do this if you plan to naturally carbonate the beer in bottles. If so you’d bottle beer, put in refrigerator and let them condition there for several weeks. And be careful not to disturb sediment at bottom of bottles when pouring in glass .

So when would you decide to cold crash beer if not when bottling? And if you do cold crash, can you NOT bottle after that? Only keg?

 

[WesBrew]

The yeast is needed to Naturally Carbonate in the bottle. Then bottle condition beers in fridge, but you can do whatever you want