Brewie

[Nate R]

Has anyone thought about using Brewie as a skeleton, swapping out proprietary parts with more commonly available pieces, and running their own BrewControl/other automation system??

I’m thinking about buying a 3 vessel system and automating it to do what Brewie currently does...... just don’t know if I could save myself some trouble (and cost) by keeping what I have.

I have thought about that!
I've been using esp-boards to control my fridges for fermentation, using "brewpiless" software.
It's very nice because it's so small, has wifi, and provides a web interface for all the controls.
The guy that coded this also made a version for the brewing/mashing.
It's nowhere near as nice and complete as the brewie software, but it works.
I'm trying to learn c++ programming to mess with these programs, 'cause I would like to try to make an alternative for the Brewie.
For now, another option could be to use the brewpi/brewblox controller. It's possible to make diy version of that controller. With "brewblox" you have the option of putting together your system on a kind of graphical interface, so the software to do the controls are actually there (and it's open source).
For now though, my Brewie has worked pretty flawlessly, so I haven't been in a rush with this project.
But since there's a lot of room for improvements on the Brewie software, I do wish to work on improving it.

Anyways, you could try to compare the cost - with the Brewie you get two kettles with heating elements, two pump and about 10 valves - all put together in a nice tight package. It has it's flaws alright, but if you're looking at it as a platform for messing around with the controllers - I think it could be hard to match.

@Tim H & @Ajes :
Yes- i think we have all thought about this!!
Before we go swapping out controllers... my understanding is the pumps, mechanical items, etc. will fail well before the controllers right?
I wonder about finding replacement parts that will work with the system.

Also, i wonder- if you do swap it out... say you removed the hop cages. Nice, but a lot of extra pieces. Imagine creating a patch for the boil side/ mash side only.
Maybe some more manual type switches? I.e. a thermostat to program the step mash(es) and one for the boil? Maybe a manual switch even for pumps?

I know these ideas are not 'set it and forget it' but to me the best thing about Brewie is the ability to fairly precisely control the mash tun temp. Isn't that the key?

Just thinking out loud here... after getting my wires fixed on the boil side i am so happy to have my baby back! Lol.

 

[applescrap]

What about some sort of sink instead of a fan. Sorry just jumping in here dont know what you are trying to cool. But a copper sink or whatever, idk, maybe cut to fit and thermo pasted to what ever you need to cool. They are used typically in pid boxes for sure. Buy at a computer parts store. A quality sink can do wonders. Best of luck, the support here for one another is awesome.

Good point on the dust.
I can easily remove the bottom cover and clean the screens from time to time.
I think having a higher CFM blown in may help with the high temp issue from before...
I might just try this and report back.

Thanks!

 

[applescrap]

I had a similar thought. Get a pid and ssr and easy boil or whatever. A pump if needed and make it work for you. If you dont feel you can trust the automation and are afraid of ruining the batch anyways, might as well finish on your terms. Make a cool little system out of it somehow. Could a burner work under there somehow. Strip it and put a couple burners? People here could likely help you ipad it too somehow with rasberry pi or whatever. Its a nice compact design.

Homemade automated systems here are around from the wondrous die beerery rig to brundog and others. I just want to be clear, the love there, imo, is partly in the make. And there is expense with it, but for the love who cares. For 299 that mash and boil looks sweet. Like a grain father. Pull a tube, and sparge. Tube latches on rim. Boil. Holds 16 pounds of grain. I would have maybe got one, they werent around. And the gf was like a thousand. Making a touch on the ipad open a valve might not be as easy as just turning a handle. I am amazed at what automation costs. How much would a machine that picks up a pot of boiling pasta to dump cost? Replacing a simple human action. Thanks for sharing your journeys!

Has anyone thought about using Brewie as a skeleton, swapping out proprietary parts with more commonly available pieces, and running their own BrewControl/other automation system??

I’m thinking about buying a 3 vessel system and automating it to do what Brewie currently does...... just don’t know if I could save myself some trouble (and cost) by keeping what I have.

 

[applescrap]

Man that is so good to hear! I am seriously so happy for you. Brew on, and cheers!

All, many thanks to all of you!
My 'O.G.' original Brewie B20 is up and running!
Completed a test brew tonight and hit a full 212 boil! (Granted it was 3 gallons but still!!)
Can't express enough how great this community has been!!
Also, to anyone worried about this repair... you can do it! Just read the directions a few times, go slow and take your time!!

Also, a few thoughts on the B20:
-mash side was fine- like no issues (pics above in a post from me).
-the "jumper wire" from the thermo switch to the boil heater needed replacing. The other wires were fine- just needee new ends. I wrapped those ends in the tape that was reccomended above.
-i kept the same 2 fans in the Brewie. I will add an external fan to blow "into" the grate under the boil side (by the drain pause button).

If i was to order these parts again, i could probably spend about $30 or less total for my B20 fix. (Crimpers, 4 ends, 8" wire).

Again, thanks all for the help & support!!
Tomorrow is family day.
Sunday is brew day & football day! Hefe otw!! (Gotta love the step mash!!)
Monday thanks to all the Veterans!!

 

[applescrap]

If that really after your fixes works as simply and well as just hit a button and away it goes, I am interested. If i buy one off ebay how much would you charge me to fix it up!

@Tim H & @Ajes :
Yes- i think we have all thought about this!!
Before we go swapping out controllers... my understanding is the pumps, mechanical items, etc. will fail well before the controllers right?
I wonder about finding replacement parts that will work with the system.

Also, i wonder- if you do swap it out... say you removed the hop cages. Nice, but a lot of extra pieces. Imagine creating a patch for the boil side/ mash side only.
Maybe some more manual type switches? I.e. a thermostat to program the step mash(es) and one for the boil? Maybe a manual switch even for pumps?

I know these ideas are not 'set it and forget it' but to me the best thing about Brewie is the ability to fairly precisely control the mash tun temp. Isn't that the key?

Just thinking out loud here... after getting my wires fixed on the boil side i am so happy to have my baby back! Lol.

 

[Nate R]

If that really after your fixes works as simply and well as just hit a button and away it goes, I am interested. If i buy one off ebay how much would you charge me to fix it up!

Ha!! Very little... it is the shipping that KILLS this thing... 75# for the b20. Maybe 50# for B+?

Also... i should note again... my unit was an old school B20... as i recall these units had more software issues than wires. But the connectors will probably eventually burn?

 

[Tim H]

Death of Brewie.

 

[Still Brewn]

What about some sort of sink instead of a fan. Sorry just jumping in here dont know what you are trying to cool. But a copper sink or whatever, idk, maybe cut to fit and thermo pasted to what ever you need to cool. They are used typically in pid boxes for sure. Buy at a computer parts store. A quality sink can do wonders. Best of luck, the support here for one another is awesome.

I had thought about using a heatsink to remove the heat from ceramic block where the connections are and it is a very good idea but it won't solve the problem if the heat is not removed from the area. This is where the fans come in. Putting the fans in the sides of the case will not solve the issue because the cool air is not directed at the issue (heat buildup at the ceramic block) it would just help the 2 factory fans exchange the air in the the lower enclosure more times. Think of it like this, adding a case fan to a computer will not cool a CPU any better than having a CPU fan blowing directly on it. My advice to anyone trying to take a shortcut is, don't it will still eventually have a failure, direct cooling is much better than passive cooling. The heatsink idea is great but if you try it make sure to use thermal paste and that the sink is in full contact with the ceramic and you will still need airflow directly on the heatsink. And the heat still needs to be moved away from the area, as in getting it to the exchanged air of the lower part of the enclosure. The only reason I have not tried a heatsink is because of the proximity to the electrical connections, adding more screws and a block of metal so close to a high voltage area that is not custom made for where it needs to be attached is risky.

 

[Blazinlow86]

View attachment 652007 Death of Brewie.

A much better choice. The brewie is such a epic failure. Now you can just brew. Cheers

 

[Still Brewn]

Morebeer has Brewie listed on their site again but I searched for pads and bags and they didn't come up.

 

[Nate R]

View attachment 652007 Death of Brewie.

@Tim H... I am humming TAPS for you & your machine (I see off to the side).
Is that a B+?
Want to get rid of that expensive paperweight?
Now that I have repaired my original B20 machine, I would love to take a crack at that thing!
Where are you? I am in Cali, shipping would kill but if it helps you get over it... I am all willing!

 

[Nate R]

Morebeer has Brewie listed on their site again but I searched for pads and bags and found nothing.
https://www.morebeer.com/products/b...m_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=ECI - Google Shopping - All Products&utm_term=1100311770639&utm_content=Ad Group %231

Amazon has 4 Amarpods (spelling) left I think

https://smile.amazon.com/Brewie-Adv...&qid=1573417239&sprefix=brewie,aps,204&sr=8-2

 

[Blazinlow86]

@Tim H... I am humming TAPS for you & your machine (I see off to the side).
Is that a B+?
Want to get rid of that expensive paperweight?
Now that I have repaired my original B20 machine, I would love to take a crack at that thing!
Where are you? I am in Cali, shipping would kill but if it helps you get over it... I am all willing!

Just looking at the B+ with the cover off sitting beside the grain father you can just see it was destined to fail. It's just such a overly complicated way to make wort that can be done just as well or in hindsight better with a pot and a grain bag. Cheers

 

[Nate R]

Just looking at the B+ with the cover off sitting beside the grain father you can just see it was destined to fail. It's just such a overly complicated way to make wort that can be done just as well or in hindsight better with a pot and a grain bag. Cheers

I don't 100% disagree...
We have all discussed this so many times...
... yet....
It's Sunday, the Cheifs lost, the Cardinals lost... the 'hawks will lose 2morrow... i've already RDWHAHB a few times today...
....so....

Brewie haters gonna hate. I would too if i spent $2.5k on this thing and had to wait.

My machine was down for the last few weeks. I had to spend about $25 and a few hours (cause i am slow) to fix it.

Now it is boiling my next batch of hefe. It did a 5 step mash, sparge, etc. All on it's own while i watched the chiefs lose.
I ground the grain, added the water/ salts and that is it. Soon it will pump cooled wort unto my fermenter.

THE HARDEST PART OF MY BREWDAY AND THE LONGEST IS CLEANING AND SANITIZING THE FERMENTOR.

I already have my stuff ready to go for the next batch, but may not brew until tomorrow as our friends have invited us all to a Diwali celebration. (Happy Diwali all!!).

So... yes yes yes Brewie did a lot of sh*t wrong.
But they DID make the single most hands off machine that still works even though they company is out. (I.e. not required to have cloud support).

But to each his or her own.
I do agree- it is all just differeny ways to make wort, right?

 

[Ajes]

Brewie haters gonna hate.

Thankfully there's an ignore function in this board.

 

[Nate R]

Actually... i just discovered i was wrong.

Apparantly Diwali was like end of October... our friends are just celebrating it today.

My bad

 

[Blazinlow86]

I don't 100% disagree...
We have all discussed this so many times...
... yet....
It's Sunday, the Cheifs lost, the Cardinals lost... the 'hawks will lose 2morrow... i've already RDWHAHB a few times today...
....so....

Brewie haters gonna hate. I would too if i spent $2.5k on this thing and had to wait.

My machine was down for the last few weeks. I had to spend about $25 and a few hours (cause i am slow) to fix it.

Now it is boiling my next batch of hefe. It did a 5 step mash, sparge, etc. All on it's own while i watched the chiefs lose.
I ground the grain, added the water/ salts and that is it. Soon it will pump cooled wort unto my fermenter.

THE HARDEST PART OF MY BREWDAY AND THE LONGEST IS CLEANING AND SANITIZING THE FERMENTOR.

I already have my stuff ready to go for the next batch, but may not brew until tomorrow as our friends have invited us all to a Diwali celebration. (Happy Diwali all!!).

So... yes yes yes Brewie did a lot of sh*t wrong.
But they DID make the single most hands off machine that still works even though they company is out. (I.e. not required to have cloud support).

But to each his or her own.
I do agree- it is all just differeny ways to make wort, right?

I agree if you need to save 15 minutes on brew day but have the spare time to rebuild your brewing device every 6 brews the brewie is a good choice. if you just want to brew beer and have a extra 15 minutes on brewday to lift the grain basket, drop hops in a kettle and connect a hose to a chiller the grainfather is a better choice. We will have to disagree that brewie "DID make the single most hands off machine that still works" as if that was actually the case they wouldnt have gone tits up as they have and in fact if they did come thru with there promise i imagine they would have done very well. cheers

 

[Nate R]

I agree if you need to save 15 minutes on brew day but have the spare time to rebuild your brewing device every 6 brews the brewie is a good choice. if you just want to brew beer and have a extra 15 minutes on brewday to lift the grain basket, drop hops in a kettle and connect a hose to a chiller the grainfather is a better choice. We will have to disagree that brewie "DID make the single most hands off machine that still works" as if that was actually the case they wouldnt have gone tits up as they have and in fact if they did come thru with there promise i imagine they would have done very well. cheers

Well... i WISH brewie came with a set of... oh, well... that's probably not apporpriate.
I have not used the grainfather so i can't make this assumption for sure, but i think brewie saves much more than 15 minutes
.. closer to i think 1-2 hours.
But i dunno... i only use brewie.
Have you used brewie?

Anyone else use both brewie and grainfather wann weigh in?

 

[Tim H]

Man this got heated. I bought my Brewie and picked up the grainfather as a backup. Each are different in their own way.... it’s not a damn apples to apples comparison, so please stop trying to pit them against each other.

Everyone go pour another brew and relax. We aren’t winning hearts and minds on the internet tonight

 

[applescrap]

Wow, man, wow. It really does that. That sounds awesome. Well minus chief fan part, I am really gonna consider a used b20. Fix it up. Dang.

I don't 100% disagree...
We have all discussed this so many times...
... yet....
It's Sunday, the Cheifs lost, the Cardinals lost... the 'hawks will lose 2morrow... i've already RDWHAHB a few times today...
....so....

Brewie haters gonna hate. I would too if i spent $2.5k on this thing and had to wait.

My machine was down for the last few weeks. I had to spend about $25 and a few hours (cause i am slow) to fix it.

Now it is boiling my next batch of hefe. It did a 5 step mash, sparge, etc. All on it's own while i watched the chiefs lose.
I ground the grain, added the water/ salts and that is it. Soon it will pump cooled wort unto my fermenter.

THE HARDEST PART OF MY BREWDAY AND THE LONGEST IS CLEANING AND SANITIZING THE FERMENTOR.

I already have my stuff ready to go for the next batch, but may not brew until tomorrow as our friends have invited us all to a Diwali celebration. (Happy Diwali all!!).

So... yes yes yes Brewie did a lot of sh*t wrong.
But they DID make the single most hands off machine that still works even though they company is out. (I.e. not required to have cloud support).

But to each his or her own.
I do agree- it is all just differeny ways to make wort, right?

 

[Nate R]

Wow, man, wow. It really does that. That sounds awesome. Well minus chief fan part, I am really gonna consider a used b20. Fix it up. Dang.

Think sous vide for wort making.
Exact control over time and temperature.

Did not mean to make it heated... just tired of the same old same old is all (and yes i too am responsible for that!!)

@applescrap if you were for real above... look into it. Even at the current amazon price of $1k, [knowing you will have to manually update the software (once) and maybe change the wires (they caught that issue after the first B+ units failed- not sure what the amazon models have)] it is a pretty cool machine.
Wait say 6 more months... i bet amazon and morebeer will drop the price. Maybe a black friday type sale?

I wonder how many more beer has in stock... may be dozens.

 

[Still Brewn]

Wow, man, wow. It really does that. That sounds awesome. Well minus chief fan part, I am really gonna consider a used b20. Fix it up. Dang.

Speaking as someone that is not allowed (unable) to brew without an assistant and is unable to lift a pot of wort let alone a full bag of wet grain the Brewie is by far the best way to get the job done without some help for me. Granted it has had issues and I have figured them all out and with a little time and patience made the appropriate adjustments to the machine and it should be running smoothly for years to come or at least until someone comes up with something that is even close to equivalent.

You don't need a electrical engineering degree to make the proper adjustments.... screwdriver, 8mm socket, (I think it was 8) exacto knife, pliars, 4 new fans, micro JST plugs, self tapping screws, tin snips, 10 gage wire, 18 or 24 gage wire, solder, soldering iron, and some heat shrink and about 2 spare hours.

After replacing the fans and adding 2 new ones and replacing the heater wires I have no problem leaving the machine to do its thing. I have left the house many times and have fallen asleep but I have come back to the machine every time to cooled wort ready to go into the fermenter. Comparing any other machine out there is like comparing a bicycle with a car. Without all the same functions it isn't even in the same category.

 

[kh54s10]

Speaking as someone that is not allowed (unable) to brew without an assistant and is unable to lift a pot of wort let alone a full bag of wet grain the Brewie is by far the best way to get the job done without some help for me. Granted it has had issues and I have figured them all out and with a little time and patience made the appropriate adjustments to the machine and it should be running smoothly for years to come or at least until someone comes up with something that is even close to equivalent.

You don't need a electrical engineering degree to make the proper adjustments.... screwdriver, 8mm socket, (I think it was 8) exacto knife, pliars, 4 new fans, micro JST plugs, self tapping screws, tin snips, 10 gage wire, 18 or 24 gage wire, solder, soldering iron, and some heat shrink and about 2 spare hours.

After replacing the fans and adding 2 new ones and replacing the heater wires I have no problem leaving the machine to do its thing. I have left the house many times and have fallen asleep but I have come back to the machine every time to cooled wort ready to go into the fermenter. Comparing any other machine out there is like comparing a bicycle with a car. Without all the same functions it isn't even in the same category.

At the current prices for the leftover, defective machines that might be a good deal. For the early buyers at full price it was definitely not what I would call a good deal. And now there is no longer factory support.

Agreed that there is nothing on the market now with the same capabilities. Also that once you get it all fixed and working properly you can (maybe) load it up and leave.

I like brewing and don't need or really want the capability of loading the water and ingredients and letting it do everything for me.

But it would be OK for a tinkerer and someone who wants beer more than the experience of making it. More like a microwave dinner than cooking a recipe from scratch. YMMV.

 

[Ajes]

I mostly agree, although I don't think the microwave vs cooking a recipe from scratch is a good analogy.
Earlier I had a grainfather type system, and as I see it, the main differences in the brewing process is pulling up the maltpipe, sparging, tossing in the hops during boil, and cooling.
IMHO those four actions alone hardly qualify for making it less of a beer-brewing experience.

 

[kh54s10]

I mostly agree, although I don't think the microwave vs cooking a recipe from scratch is a good analogy.
IMHO those four actions alone hardly qualify for making it less of a beer-brewing experience.

The analogy is as close as I could come. Taking all the ingredients and sticking them into the micro and just waiting as opposed to cooking something like where you would boil pasta, saute onions etc, add those two together with more ingredients and bake. The results are about the same, but the more involved cooking to me is more fun.

 

[Nate R]

The analogy is as close as I could come. Taking all the ingredients and sticking them into the micro and just waiting as opposed to cooking something like where you would boil pasta, saute onions etc, add those two together with more ingredients and bake. The results are about the same, but the more involved cooking to me is more fun.

I would say it is more like doing what described above (boiling pasta, saute onions, etc) but the difference is between outside over an open flame vs. inside on a range-top/ cook-top. Not a microwave. One way does not use modern technology, the other way does. Dial in precise heat, time, etc.

 

[Nate R]

Ok all supportive Brewie repair friends.... so I got my machine up and running. Boiled at over 213 degrees for a full size batch! Yes!

BUT- when cooling came, the water supply to the heat exchange did not go. (I do get water in to the machine for cleaning, etc.) I assume the valve is not correct, but I just opened it up and cannot find any visible issues,

Thoughts anyone? I am going to scour the repair guides now, see if there is anything there.

On a plus side, I was able to save the brew! Transferred the near boiling wort to my "cornical"- which can hold PSI up to that of a keg. I put a ton of c02 into it, stuck it into an upright freezer for a few hours, then let it sit out overnight (about 50 degrees or so). Kept it at a positive c02 pressure the whole time. This was something I have always thought about doing, so we will see how it turns out. But this is not the area to debate the merits of doing that. I am just happy I (hopefully) saved the batch.

So, any pointers on the water valve issue are much appreciated! Thanks all!

 

[kh54s10]

I would say it is more like doing what described above (boiling pasta, saute onions, etc) but the difference is between outside over an open flame vs. inside on a range-top/ cook-top. Not a microwave. One way does not use modern technology, the other way does. Dial in precise heat, time, etc.

I don't agree at all. Your analogy only changes heat source.

 

[sharpbeer]

Hey guys,

I reached out to Brewie tech support about 1.5 months ago after their website came back up, and I haven't heard back. I have an issue where my system, after 5 or 6 brews, doesn't work anymore. I'll start a brew but it will not progress. It will start and stay at '0%, Preparation - 0%, 1/3 step', count down for about 6 hours. I let it run for an hour one time but nothing happened, it does not heat the water. I normally brew with auto water inlet, I tried calibrating the machine and manually adding water, but still does not progress. It seems it does not want to heat?

I just need some advice of where to start, as I said I reached out to Brewie, submitted a ticket, described the issue and submitted a photo to them, and yet, I haven't heard back from them. I purchased this machine from morebeer.com in March, I also reached out to morebeer.com but they need to reach out to Brewie, so I haven't heard back from the either.

I am at a loss of what to do, and I blame only myself, I wish I had done some more research on this machine before purchasing.

 

[Nate R]

Hey guys,

I reached out to Brewie tech support about 1.5 months ago after their website came back up, and I haven't heard back. I have an issue where my system, after 5 or 6 brews, doesn't work anymore. I'll start a brew but it will not progress. It will start and stay at '0%, Preparation - 0%, 1/3 step', count down for about 6 hours. I let it run for an hour one time but nothing happened, it does not heat the water. I normally brew with auto water inlet, I tried calibrating the machine and manually adding water, but still does not progress. It seems it does not want to heat?

I just need some advice of where to start, as I said I reached out to Brewie, submitted a ticket, described the issue and submitted a photo to them, and yet, I haven't heard back from them. I purchased this machine from morebeer.com in March, I also reached out to morebeer.com but they need to reach out to Brewie, so I haven't heard back from the either.

I am at a loss of what to do, and I blame only myself, I wish I had done some more research on this machine before purchasing.

@sharpbeer sounds like the heating element wires are no good. If you are a little handy you CAN fix this yourself! Scroll up the last few pages- i just did it on my B20. There is a parts list, guides, etc.
Take you 3 hours at most and maybe $25.

 

[sharpbeer]

@sharpbeer sounds like the heating element wires are no good. If you are a little handy you CAN fix this yourself! Scroll up the last few pages- i just did it on my B20. There is a parts list, guides, etc.
Take you 3 hours at most and maybe $25.

Thank you for the quick response. I will look at it when I get back from work!
One quick question, is there a way to know/test for sure if it is the heating element wires before I start purchasing parts and opening up the Brewie?

 

[Ajes]

Can you tell us whether it is a B+, or B20?
Also, what version of the software do you have on the machine (3.0.16? 3.1.1? 3.1.2?)
Hang in there - there's lots of help to get here

 

[Nate R]

I don't agree at all. Your analogy only changes heat source.

I agree with you- heat source. Imagine cooking a spagetti dinner outside over a campfire. Limited heat control. Manual movement of pans etc.
Now imagine using a cook-top with technology to keep the temp exact. And it turns off the heat when the sauce is done.
And moves the hot water off of the noodles when they are cooked. And has a built in dishwasher. Etc. Etc.
Technology to help move the process and keep the important aspects (time and temp) dialed in.

To each his or her own. But this is not the Hungryman tv dinner.
I would argue that extract is the microwave of beer making.
But that is also not fair.

I wish i had time, space, and money for a huge 3 vessel system. But i just don't.

 

[Nate R]

Thank you for the quick response. I will look at it when I get back from work!
One quick question, is there a way to know/test for sure if it is the heating element wires before I start purchasing parts and opening up the Brewie?

Probablu, but based on what you have said i would bet craft beers to seltzer water it is what we have all experienced.
You can do what i did- open it up first then order parts. But i had an open brewie on the kitchen counter for 2 weeks. I have an amazing wife tho!

 

[sharpbeer]

Can you tell us whether it is a B+, or B20?
Also, what version of the software do you have on the machine (3.0.16? 3.1.1? 3.1.2?)
Hang in there - there's lots of help to get here

It is a B20+, 3.1.1

 

[sharpbeer]

Probablu, but based on what you have said i would bet craft beers to seltzer water it is what we have all experienced.
You can do what i did- open it up first then order parts. But i had an open brewie on the kitchen counter for 2 weeks. I have an amazing wife tho!

I will open it this Wednesday/Thursday when I get time. Thank you!

 

[Ajes]

The analogy is as close as I could come. Taking all the ingredients and sticking them into the micro and just waiting as opposed to cooking something like where you would boil pasta, saute onions etc, add those two together with more ingredients and bake. The results are about the same, but the more involved cooking to me is more fun.

I don't really think this analogy is close. In my experience there will be a big difference in taste between these two - that same doesn't apply for the brewie vs grainfather type system I mentioned.
Also, there is a lot more differences in the processes you are describing.
I mentioned the 4 biggest differences I have experienced between the two brewing processes. For me the automization of those 4 doesn't take anything away from the brewing experience. I can choose to do them if I whish - I have that option - but doing those four things wouldn't change anything about how much or how little I enjoy brewing. (My wife still doesn't quite understand why I don't look as goofy-happy when doing the tasks she thinks I should enjoy......)

 

[Ajes]

It is a B20+, 3.1.1

Try to go to developer mode (go to recipes and type "morecontrol" in the search field.
Put some water in the boil tank, and push the boil tank button - check to see whether this starts heating up.
REMEMBER to put in water first

 

[Blazinlow86]

I agree with you- heat source. Imagine cooking a spagetti dinner outside over a campfire. Limited heat control. Manual movement of pans etc.
Now imagine using a cook-top with technology to keep the temp exact. And it turns off the heat when the sauce is done.
And moves the hot water off of the noodles when they are cooked. And has a built in dishwasher. Etc. Etc.
Technology to help move the process and keep the important aspects (time and temp) dialed in.

To each his or her own. But this is not the Hungryman tv dinner.
I would argue that extract is the microwave of beer making.
But that is also not fair.

I wish i had time, space, and money for a huge 3 vessel system. But i just don't.

You fell for the brewie marketing and actually believe that brewing on anything but the brewie has to be a all day affair on a huge outdoor propane 3 vessel system. People have been brewing indoors with heating control for long time before the brewie came along. The reality is the brewie doesn't save much actual hand on time at all. If you literally cannot be near your brew system for a few minutes a few times throughout your brewday and it hadnt failed spectacularly the brewie would have been a great choice. No chance I would trust the fire hazard to run unattended in my house. Cheers

 

[kh54s10]

I agree with you- heat source. Imagine cooking a spagetti dinner outside over a campfire. Limited heat control. Manual movement of pans etc.
Now imagine using a cook-top with technology to keep the temp exact. And it turns off the heat when the sauce is done.
And moves the hot water off of the noodles when they are cooked. And has a built in dishwasher. Etc. Etc.
Technology to help move the process and keep the important aspects (time and temp) dialed in.

To each his or her own. But this is not the Hungryman tv dinner.
I would argue that extract is the microwave of beer making.
But that is also not fair.

I wish i had time, space, and money for a huge 3 vessel system. But i just don't.

You guys are going to extremes to defend a seriously inferior product. I was just saying I enjoy brewing INCLUDING hands on....