Bottling beer using wine bottles, a discussion

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yeppers

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I have been utilizing wine bottles for my beer for a few years now. I have never used wire cages or any other tricks for holding the corks in either, and I almost never have corks pop out, and have never seen a bottle explode.

I have brewed allot of IPA's and PA's that I have rather heavily carbonated, along with less carbonated Scottish ales and Brown ales. So, I've mostly covered the board as far as carbonation goes, other than German styled wheat beer or Belgian styles, which i do know use a lot more primer.

I have been noticing the more I talk to other home brewers, along with further reading and study, that no one uses wine bottles to bottle their beer, unless of coarse, they are doing the Belgian style Trips or Quads.

I would honestly say that maybe 1% or so of the bottles I have done have popped a cork, and those I have attributed to the fact the cork didn't completely lodge in the neck for some reason and I left it as was without re-corking it, or possibly a imperfection in the cork itself. And even then, most of the ones that did not have the cork lodge perfectly did not pop, and they lasted just fine.

A time where I did have an issue with about 15-20% of the corks popping (which I'm not including in my other estimate) was due to bacterial infection that I directly caused. I was new to the game, didn't have a siphon starter, or a bucket with the spout, and out of frustration of juggling so many things at once, along with constantly loosing the siphon, i put the tube in my mouth and sucked a siphon...., lol, I hope I'm not the only one who made that immature mistake.:smack:

The only other problem I had was my first Scottish ale that I bottled in wine bottles as well, but used maybe half as much priming sugar as I should have. It was an experiment to do my best to create Belhaven's Wee Heavy, and I wanted a light carbonation like the bottles themselves have, giving it that smooth feeling. Long story short, I made the beer overly rich in infermentables, and actually had to store it for 2 years. it had little to no carbonation by that time, but the beer itself did taste great, me and the little lady downed about 18L of it in around a week, even with it being mostly flat. :drunk:


So, getting to the point, I have been doing more research about my bottling style, and all that I am really finding is infrequent topics on the subject, with most people saying "don't do that," "it will not work," and "your bottle might explode, or at least the corks will just blow out."

I would like to start a topic discussing the use of corked and un-caged wine bottles for brewing beer, and one built on experience or experimentation rather than hearsay.


I use regular 750 mL & 1.5L bottles with #8 corks. For whatever lazy and cheap reasoning, I have not upgraded to the floor corker yet so I can use #9 corks with ease.

I just bottled a heavy all grain honey brown ale that I plan on aging until next Xmas, so I will add the info about how that goes for me, along with a weizenbock I am bottling tonight as well, same way as always.



I would love to hear more from other brewers about experiences regarding this, cheers!
 
I knew a person who bought a (warm) bottle of champagne in TX, put it directly in ice-water in a cooler, had it explode, and put a shard through the pupil of their eye, blinding them. There eye was nasty looking, not that it's really relevant.

Won a big lawsuit as you can imagine.

I know there are people who bottle in carboys, wine bottles are similar in that they're not rated for pressure, it might work the vast majority of the time, but the rare time they fail could be genuinely hazzardous.

I do bottle in champagne bottles, feel no worries doing that.

I have 400+ empty beer bottles and 60+ empty champagne / wine bottles, so other than saving a tiny amount of time bottling, have no issues using "recommended" enclosures.
 
I guess I never really said why I do use wine bottles, and I do it for a few reasons. to save space and to save time. I started out with regular beer bottles, had so many it was a headache. Started up grading to 22 oz bottles, and still found myself dealing with the same problems really. It would take more time and space in cleaning and storing. So I jumped into wine bottles and haven't looked back. I should say I haven't had a full size house to myself with a garage and everything, that would change allot for me.

I'm not directly trying to advocate the use of wine bottles, but I have not found direct info on them exploding on anyone, and haven't had a problem myself.

I have been looking more and more into transitioning into those 1L locking cap bottles, I just really like the look of them, and the convenience of using them. but they run about 45 dollars for a case of them, and I'm sure I'd need about 100 of them, lol.
 
I guess I never really said why I do use wine bottles, and I do it for a few reasons. to save space and to save time. I started out with regular beer bottles, had so many it was a headache. Started up grading to 22 oz bottles, and still found myself dealing with the same problems really. It would take more time and space in cleaning and storing. So I jumped into wine bottles and haven't looked back. I should say I haven't had a full size house to myself with a garage and everything, that would change allot for me.

I'm not directly trying to advocate the use of wine bottles, but I have not found direct info on them exploding on anyone, and haven't had a problem myself.

I have been looking more and more into transitioning into those 1L locking cap bottles, I just really like the look of them, and the convenience of using them. but they run about 45 dollars for a case of them, and I'm sure I'd need about 100 of them, lol.

People say not to carbonate in those as well, BUT I did with my very first batch and at least one bottle for every other batch since and have never had any issues.
 
You're not supposed to carbonate in the locking cap style bottles? Sorry, I don't know the official name of the type, but I'm talking about the Grolsch style bottles. I thought that they were meant for that? Looks like I have more things to read about now.
 
You're not supposed to carbonate in the locking cap style bottles? Sorry, I don't know the official name of the type, but I'm talking about the Grolsch style bottles. I thought that they were meant for that? Looks like I have more things to read about now.

Grolsch style, swing top. Yep we are talking about the same. I've been told, and there is a thread around here somewhere, that its not wise to carb in them. As I said though I carbonated my entire first batch in them and many single bottles since with no problems what so ever. Hell even the guy at the lhbs where I bought my first kit and the bottles didn't try to dissuade me from doing it so id say give it a shot. Just keep check on the red rubber gaskets after using them and replace when needed.
 
Wow great thread.

I've been wanting to start bottling beer in wine bottles myself. I have a few champagne/Belgian style bottles around but not nearly as many as I do regular wine bottles. I absolutely love the convenience and presentation of a wine bottle. I've also been getting into sours lately, these are beers that I would rather bottle age than let them take up tons of space in secondaries all over the place.

Next time I bottle I will try this, but it will only be a couple bottles, I will still keg the rest. I'm thinking 2 carbonation drops per bottle?

I have #9 corks, OP what size corks were you using? Perhaps larger corks would be of benefit?
 
Grolsch style, swing top. Yep we are talking about the same. I've been told, and there is a thread around here somewhere, that its not wise to carb in them. As I said though I carbonated my entire first batch in them and many single bottles since with no problems what so ever. Hell even the guy at the lhbs where I bought my first kit and the bottles didn't try to dissuade me from doing it so id say give it a shot. Just keep check on the red rubber gaskets after using them and replace when needed.

Are you confusing swing top with growlers? You can definitely carbonate in swing top/easy cap bottles. In fact they are rated for higher volumes then stander bottles, I believe they are good to around 4 volumes.
 
I have #9 corks, OP what size corks were you using? Perhaps larger corks would be of benefit?

I'm using #8's still, I've heard using 9's without a floor corker is a nightmare.

But #9's are the type I would rather use, my theory was that that would make the very flew blow outs I have had cease.

I'm trying to get some time to dig around and find some verifiable information on the use of wine bottles, and good or bad, I plan on adding it to this. If for nothing else, it would be a thread with some complete information for anyone else later researching this same idea.
 
I'm using #8's still, I've heard using 9's without a floor corker is a nightmare.

But #9's are the type I would rather use, my theory was that that would make the very flew blow outs I have had cease.

I'm trying to get some time to dig around and find some verifiable information on the use of wine bottles, and good or bad, I plan on adding it to this. If for nothing else, it would be a thread with some complete information for anyone else later researching this same idea.

I may be in deep doo doo because I only have a plunger style corker and #9 corks, maybe I should go ahead and order some #8s, as I plan to bottle in a few days. There must be some way to use them or they wouldn't sell them. I was also wondering what if there's a special type of cork used for champagne, if so, that would be the type to use in the wine bottles.

I'm also wondering if a cage would fit properly onto a regular wine bottle, I understand your not interested in using cages, but it wouldn't bother me to try a few.
 
Are you confusing swing top with growlers? You can definitely carbonate in swing top/easy cap bottles. In fact they are rated for higher volumes then stander bottles, I believe they are good to around 4 volumes.

Nope sure ain't. Now one beer store I frequent uses swing top/easy cap as growlers but I'm def talking about swing tops. Been told a few times they aren't meant for those pressures but mine just keep holding up.
 
Well here's my two cents;

I bottle exclusively in swing top (AKA EZ-Cap/ AKA grolsch Type) bottles. Some are actual grolsch bottles from the 1980s with porcelain caps. Most are used hacker pschorr bottles, and about 40 are EZ-Cap brand swing top bottles.

They work great, though I did once have to tighten the bales to get better carbonation. Once done, the bottles pop like champagne bottles. I little scary the first few times.

I personally would not risk using wine bottles since I like my eyes too much and handling that one bottle the wrong way may end my lucky streak. If I assume there's a 1 % changes it may go wrong, and end up blind, or maiming my family, then I can't afford the risk.

I would strongly suggest the swing caps though since they're VERY convenient. I've used repeatedly for 15 batches or so, and never had to replace a gasket. Though it's safe to assume each bottle was really used 5 times during that period. The Hacker-Pschorr bottles are best IMHO. No fear of skunking and seem to seal better than EZ-Caps, but that's probably a 'user error' on my part. Most came from craigslist where I'd buy a case for 50 cents each. It was a good deal compared to buying the things new.
 
Nope sure ain't. Now one beer store I frequent uses swing top/easy cap as growlers but I'm def talking about swing tops. Been told a few times they aren't meant for those pressures but mine just keep holding up.

Yes, and they will keep holding as they can handle up to 4 volumes vs. 3 for standard bottles. I specifically bought swing top bottles for my saisons as I like them around 3.5 volumes.

And to the O.P. I personally would go with swing top or Champagne bottles. I've never been in a car accident but I always were my seat-belt type of deal. Also if you go with Champagne bottles you can cork or cap them.
 
Ya ever consider 2 liter soda bottles? Good for when the gran kids come over!
 
One issue with using wine bottles is that not all of them are created equal some may be ok but some may not and you have no way of knowing without testing each bottle. If its not rated for pressure I personally wouldn't use them because the risk/reward ratio is way too high. Think of how stupid you will feel if you get injured because you were too cheap to buy proper equipment for a hobby.

Yes you can likely get away with thick heavy high quality punted wine bottles (and I have accidentally made sparkling wine in them) but I sure as hell wouldn't try to carb in a cheap 3 buck chuck bottle.
 
You likely haven't had any explode because you are using a #8 cork uncaged in the wine bottles. Before the bottle would reach burst pressure, the cork will blow out. I would not ever swich to a #9 cork or adding a cage as you lose your unintended pressure relief valve.

Personally I will never bottle in a regular wine bottle. Not worth the risk, no matter what the convenience or cost savings may be. That goes the same for bottle conidtioning in a growler, which works most of the time. All it takes is one accident and you have major regret.

Belgian style beer bottles, swing toppers, or 22 oz bomber bottles work great, why not switch to those? Wine bottle designers have put no thought into pressure limit capabilities because they are meant only for still product. The other three examples above we're designed to hold a minimum pressure safely.
 
I really hope the point of this thread isn't being misinterpreted. So, as a form of disclaimer for anyone, newbies especially:

**Don't do your home brew in wine bottles, unless you're willing to accept the risk.**

Personally, I am going to keep doing what I have been doing because it works, but I do want to switch over to the 1L swing tops, due to my thinking it would be even easier than the wine bottles. (which I can attest to the fact that the wine bottles save time over the 12 or 22 oz bottles)

The point of this thread was more designed for the collective finding of others who are, or have been doing the same thing that I am.

I have been trying to do some searching as to the amounts of pressure that regular wine bottles can with stand. And so far, I haven't found any information.

Yes, that may be due to these bottles having not been thought of for the style in which I use them, but I have also found at least one thread, on one site or another, that talks about a good old boy having been using my method for along time. I should say that I never use bottles from cheap wineries, all of mine are from good wine with thick bottles.

I in no way want to contribute to someone hurting themselves or others, nor am I down playing any risk.

That said, I still feel comfortable doing what I am doing, and am going to continue to do so, until I upgrade to the 1L swing tops.

And I am still more than interested in any input from another brewer who is doing/has done what I am doing.

Thanks all.
 
I really hope the point of this thread isn't being misinterpreted. So, as a form of disclaimer for anyone, newbies especially:

**Don't do your home brew in wine bottles, unless you're willing to accept the risk.**

Personally, I am going to keep doing what I have been doing because it works, but I do want to switch over to the 1L swing tops, due to my thinking it would be even easier than the wine bottles. (which I can attest to the fact that the wine bottles save time over the 12 or 22 oz bottles)

The point of this thread was more designed for the collective finding of others who are, or have been doing the same thing that I am.

I have been trying to do some searching as to the amounts of pressure that regular wine bottles can with stand. And so far, I haven't found any information.

Yes, that may be due to these bottles having not been thought of for the style in which I use them, but I have also found at least one thread, on one site or another, that talks about a good old boy having been using my method for along time. I should say that I never use bottles from cheap wineries, all of mine are from good wine with thick bottles.

I in no way want to contribute to someone hurting themselves or others, nor am I down playing any risk.

That said, I still feel comfortable doing what I am doing, and am going to continue to do so, until I upgrade to the 1L swing tops.

And I am still more than interested in any input from another brewer who is doing/has done what I am doing.

Thanks all.

You and I are cut from the same cloth, in which we don't necessarily believe something won't work, when the people telling us that haven't tried it in the first place.

Hopefully some others, with the interest of a practical discussion on this subject, will join us. Until then, I fear we are doomed to read numerous posts, telling us that which we already know; like we may end up with some exploded bottles or popped corks.

Now ON the subject...

I have loaned out my digital caliper, but when I get it back I will break a wine bottle, beer bottle, and champagne bottle and measure the thickness, just for the sake of discussion. I was also wondering if they make corks small enough for regular 12/22 oz bottles, if so I'd like to order some, I have a limited number of wine bottles, and would be able to experiment more using regular beer bottles as well. Again, I also just like the presentation of a cork in certain situations, for instance if I gave away a bottle of mead or cider I would rather it be corked than capped, even if it were a regular 12 oz bottle.

I haven't forgotten about trying the #9 corks either, my plunger style corker will not arrive until next week so will update with the results.
 
which I can attest to the fact that the wine bottles save time over the 12 or 22 oz bottles

There are 7 bomber bottles to every 6 wine bottles. You're saying it's faster to fill and CORK 6 wine bottles than to fill and CAP 7 bombers? And that's the reason you're willing to jeopardize the safety of you and others?

This has to be one of the all time most asinine ideas in home brewing.


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Actually BackAlley, I use allot of 1.5L bottles, so if you want to redo your math and continue to throw out insults, I'll await them with bated breath. Thank you for your input and contribution.


estricklin, thanks for your thoughts, at least you understand the what and why of this thread. I'm really interested in reading your findings with the digital caliper. I don't suppose you would also have a 1.5L bottle you could do the same thing with do you? I have been wondering if they are thinner, or the same thickness. My digital brew scale crapped out on me a little while back, and I haven't purchased another one, or I would at least do a preliminary look into that through weights and size differentials.

The comment by solbes did interest me about the use of #9 corks. I think there is credence in the idea that if the bottles themselves are in fact not up to the task of withstanding pressures, perhaps a #9 cork would take away from a almost 'safety valve' property that the cork could have.

And I would still love to see any documented information directly relating to the instability of the bottles when factored with the pressure of carbonating beer.
 
If it's any help for comparison I weighed my Belgian bottles and they were 18.8 oz, my Champagne bottles were 23.4 oz and wine bottles were 14.2.
 
If it's any help for comparison I weighed my Belgian bottles and they were 18.8 oz, my Champagne bottles were 23.4 oz and wine bottles were 14.2.

Thanks!

That definitely adds to the idea of the bottles not being rated or up to the task of being used for beer, especially if I am right in the wine bottle being taller than the Belgian.

And that is quite the difference in weight when looking into the Champagne bottles.

I am interested in the difference in thickness even more now.
 
Actually BackAlley, I use allot of 1.5L bottles, so if you want to redo your math and continue to throw out insults, I'll await them with bated breath. Thank you for your input and contribution.

OK, here's my new calculations. Since energy is pressure times volume, the fact that you're using 1.5l bottles makes this idea twice as reckless.

As far as contributing? Clearly you're bound and determined to continue to play Russian roulette. I just hope others reading this will think twice.




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OK, here's my new calculations. Since energy is pressure times volume, the fact that you're using 1.5l bottles makes this idea twice as reckless.

As far as contributing? Clearly you're bound and determined to continue to play Russian roulette. I just hope others reading this will think twice.




Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew



It's really like you have little to no understanding as to the real point of this thread. And I don't mean that to be some kind of an insult or anything, thats not a game I choose to play.

No where do I advocate what I do, merely bring questions about what I do. And, refresher, until about 6 days ago, I had no idea I should not be doing what I am doing, and have been doing for years.

Will I change what I am doing? Yes, eventually.

Is driving a car down the road more dangerous than what I am doing? Yes. And I'm sure some of the reasons that one may choose to drive down the road are far more frivolous than my reasons behind my bottling technique.

If anyone really reads any of my posts, rather than skimming them, my points are valid. The goal of this thread is not to encourage anyone to really do what I do. It was a hope of mine though to see if others before me have done, or are finding themselves doing what I do.


Think what you want, I do respect your stance, and I really do not want to continue inane arguments.

I do thank you for not adding insults to your last post though, that I can appreciate.
 
Ok I got a chance to use the #9 corks, I only used them on a still Mead but they seemed to work pretty good on standard wine bottles. I used a hand plunger corker, I did tap the corks in softly with a rubber hammer though. I had previously soaked them in water the night before. Though they were a little more difficult to get in, they didn't seem to be very hard to get out, I did 2 test bottles.

Still waiting on my friend to return the digital caliper.
 
I have some sparking elderflower champagne in a brite tank keg that I will be bottling up soon. Half will get plastic corks and hoods, and half will be capped (the capped ones will be aged for a bit).

Most US champagne bottles will accept a European 29 mm bottle cap. If you have a Red Baron capper, you need a $2.99 bell housing 29 mm and just reverse the crimping halves of the capper. This is part of how they make champagne, they use the caps in the middle part of the process after bottle conditioning and before corking.

Just throwing it out there as another option that should be safe no matter how high you carbonate. My 12 champagne bottles are quite heavy duty.
 
my bottles are doing fine still, the only ones that popped are a few I purposely did without fully smashing the cork into the bottle, which is what has been the case before hand.

that said, I am still looking forward to upgrading to 1L swing top bottles sometime soon.
 
I bottled some beer finally in the regular wine bottles, it's been weeks and the #9 corks are holding well. 2.7 volumes.

I have gotten my digital caliper back, but I have to pick up a battery up for it some time this week when I'm in town.
 
bumping an old thread. i just bottled three bottles of braggot in wine bottles with corks, carbed to around 2.5 vols. curious to see if the cork holds. i suspect everything will be fine.
 
I have some now that are right at 1 year old, corks and bottling holding fine. I have a few that were carbed to almost 3 volumes, holding fine too.

I recently switched to synthetic corks, will report with results of that.

I have my digital caliper back, and picked up a new battery for it, so I will measure some bottles soon enough.
 
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