Bottling and aging questions

[dmulligan]

I am currently nearly decided on brown glass 22oz (650mL) beer bottles from my LHBS. The only reason I am holding back is that they want $20 per dozen and my batch is 23L so I would need 3 dozen. I should say that I am planning on priming my cider before bottling for carbonated goodness.

How long should I age carbonated cider for? Next what is the longest I should store my cider? What are the variables I need to consider? I imagine that the temperature is one. What other considerations are there?

 

[Retroviridae]

Hi. I'm making my second batch of cider (well, actually graff since I added some crystal malt). From what I've read, cider can mellow and develop complexity with bottle conditioning, just like beer. Also, you can get malolactic fermentation (if it didn't happen already in the primary ferment) which will convert the "sharp" acidity of malic acid into "softer" lactic acid. But since cider is unhopped, relatively low alcohol, and especially if you used unpasteurized juice, it should be consumed relatively young because wild bugs can take over and make apple cider vinegar.
I defer to others with more cider experience to quote you some actual timeframes.

 

[spaceboi13]

I am currently nearly decided on brown glass 22oz (650mL) beer bottles from my LHBS. The only reason I am holding back is that they want $20 per dozen and my batch is 23L so I would need 3 dozen. I should say that I am planning on priming my cider before bottling for carbonated goodness.

How long should I age carbonated cider for? Next what is the longest I should store my cider? What are the variables I need to consider? I imagine that the temperature is one. What other considerations are there?

I can't answer your cider question (have yet to attemp cider), sorry. However you might want to check craigslist for bottles. I have luck on there scoring free bottles quite often.

 

[Teromous]

Hard Cider can be kept for a long time, provided that it's bottled and stored correctly. You can store it in beer bottles, but if you're looking for any long term storage you might want to consider champagne bottles as they can handle higher atmospheres. Keep it in a cool place and if you’re concerned about it popping, just keep it in a Tupperware container.

There are some things to consider with aging, like was it bulk aged before bottling? How long? What’s the alcohol content? What’s the gravity of the hard cider? How much carbonation do you expect? How long are you intending on keeping it before you drink it?

If it were my choice, I would let it bulk age in a carboy for about 6-8 months then bottle it and let it carbonate. Test it to make sure it’s carbonated to your preference then store it in a very cool location and let it sit for a few months more. Granted I don’t know your specific brew. I normally have a very high alcohol content.

 

[dmulligan]

How cool is cool? Do you mean basement cool or refrigerator cool? How does the length of time it was bulk aged affect the length of time that it can be stored in bottles?

I assume that higher alcohol content makes for a longer keeping cider. My next batch will have a higher alcohol content. I was afraid that sugar would make for a sweeter cider. Silly me.

Thanks,
David

 

[Teromous]

There are a number of considerations. You just have to think, when you decide stuff like this. For one, what temperature does your yeast ferment at? If you give it food and store it at that temperature, odds are that it's going to continue fermentation. Can your bottles handle the pressure that you'll be building up when you carbonate? I'm not trying to scare you, I'm just telling you that you have to think about this stuff. You asked me basement or refrigerator. How cold is your basement? I don't know.

Storing it in the 50F range should be fine, provided that it doesn't overcarbonate. You should break it open every now and then to test it. The problem is that you're making a naturally sparkling hard cider which can be tricky.

Bulk aging allows your hard cider to clear, mellow, and average flavor as a whole. If you do it, I would recommend racking to a secondary carboy to get it off it's lees. This allows you to age the hard cider safely, so you can then carbonate and bottle it for drinking. If you're looking to store a sparkling cider for a long time in a bottle, I would recomment using champagne bottles.

How long were you intending on keeping it before drinking? I can give you more advice if I know this.

 

[LambChop4Prez]

When I made my cider, I used champagne yeast. That seemed to give it a slight carbonation, kinda like it was slightly sparkling.

 

[dmulligan]

Teromous: I think that my basement varies from about 12 to 20 degrees C depending on the season. The yeast I chose was Lavin EC-1118 champagne yeast and if memory serves the package said 18-24c however a web page I just found suggests that this yeast likes 7-35c. I've chosen some 660mL (22oz) beer bottles for my cider as they won't have a problem with the pressure.

Unfortunately my cider has a significant amount of sediment/precipitate/apple sauce hanging around in it. I eliminated 2/3 of the apple sauce when I racked it to the secondary. That also meant that I had lost a significant amount of volume which I replaced with 3.5L of new store bought juice which began another vigorous fermentation. That will mean more lees right? I guess that also means that I will have to rack and filter it again in a couple of weeks. I tasted my cider a couple of days before racking it and found it to be very sour. That means I want to give it as much time as possible to mellow. Fortunately a LHBS set me up with the correct amount of dextrose for bottle carbing at this altitude. I don't really plan on storing my cider for long, especially if it turns out well. Though 23L of cider will take some time to drink. At least a couple of weekends eh?

You haven't scared me. I was just looking for some ideas as to what each of the considerations mean.

Speaking about considerations; I've not seen anyone mention that altitude changes the amount of sugar required for priming.

Thanks,
David

 

[Teromous]

Most people don't live high or low enough to worry about altitude, so it's not a regular consideration. Introducing more apple juice will consequently add more sugar which will in turn produce new lees. You mentioned filtering in your post. If you are going to carbonate, consider filtering a portion of your fermented cider and leaving a portion unfiltered. This will leave some yeast in your bottle so you will have a slower carbonating process. If you’re not talking about storing it for multiple years, then you shouldn’t have a problem. I’m not psychic but your cider should be good for at least a year if not two. Keeping it colder after it’s carbonated will help prevent any bottle mishaps.

 

[dmulligan]

By filtering I meant that I would run it through a cloth or a kitchen strainer. I ran it through a strainer when racking it earlier this week and still had enough yeast left to ferment the new juice I put in. I hope that if I choose to again that the yeast will still stick around.

I took a look at my 23L carboy this morning and noticed that I have a lot less apple solids left, only 1-1.5 inches from the bottom. The way I see it I have a lot of options but none sound too good.
- filter it again and replace the solids with juice
- rack just the clear cider and put in even more juice
- filter or rack it again leaving a large air space above the cider
- leave the cider on the solids and lees as it is now
- rack the cider into a smaller carboy and two 1 gallon jugs. (I don't have the jugs but I do have an 11.5L carboy)
Have I forgotten anything? Is there anything else I can do?

Thanks.

 

[Tusch]

I would never recommend "filtering" through a strainer. You mention this as a separate option from racking, which to me implies a very bad idea of pouring it through a strainer. Even if you are racking it through a strainer somehow, you are taking some serious risk of oxidation. Adding any juice will ferment, creating more lees. I personally would rack to whatever number of carboys necessary to limit the amount of headspace.

 

[Teromous]

By filtering I meant that I would run it through a cloth or a kitchen strainer. I ran it through a strainer when racking it earlier this week and still had enough yeast left to ferment the new juice I put in. I hope that if I choose to again that the yeast will still stick around.

Ah, I thought you were talking about running it through a 1 micron filter or something.