Bottle Cleaning: Negligent, lazy, or both?

[KRASHED]

Hi all,

Pretty new to this. I'm just short of ten batches and learning lots along the way.

When it comes to bottles, the swing top style, I had started cleaning and sanitizing using unscented bleach.

Recently purchased some Starsan and I am loving the stuff.

I have sterilized two batches of beer in bottles with it so far and have had zero issues with it.

That being said, I'm wondering if my method is leading me down to a path of disaster or off flavours.

My method of cleaning at the moment involves using a tap bottle washer and spraying down each bottle with hot water once I pour the beer into the glass. When it comes to bottling day I have only used starsan at this point before bottling.

I have inspected each bottle and have never found any sort of built up gunk or solids and I think this is due to me immediately spraying out the bottles as they are used.

On bottle day I have used starsan in two ways. One way using the proper ratio to water and submerging the bottles in the bucket before drying. The second way (albeit lazy way) is using a spray bottle of mixed starsan and spraying down the neck of each bottle before drying.

I feel like this is a lazy way of doing things but so far it has worked without any issue at all.

Should I be taking a step back and adjusting my cleaning/sanitizing methods?

Thanks

 

[PADave]

That's almost exactly my bottle routine. As soon as I pour a beer, bottle gets rinsed, 3-4 times, shaking the water each time. Bottle then goes on Fastrack to dry. Bottling day they get a soak in Starsan and dumped out, nice and foamy inside. Then I give them a quick spray with Starsan on the neck before filling and pour out any remaining Starsan. Never had an issue, filled hundreds that way. If I feel the need to do a better cleaning on the bottles, like if someone gave them to me, they get a PBW soak.

 

[Northbank]

Yup, when I pour a beer I rinse it out really well afterwards so there is no debris inside and just Star San on bottling day. It doesn't need to be any harder than this IMHO unless the bottles get dusty or something wherever they are stored before botting day ...

 

[AZCoolerBrewer]

I rinse my bottles after pouring as well. Before the Starsan, I soak the bottles in oxiclean and hot water for about 20 minutes then scrub the bottle with a bottle brush for 10-15 seconds. It seems like a lot of extra work, but even though I look through my bottles and they look crystal clear before washing them, I always have stuff floating around in my oxiclean water after I bottle brush them. Seeing that stuff floating around in there makes me want to keep whatever it is out of my beer. After washing, I submerge in Starsan and let air dry on my plastic drying rack.

 

[kh54s10]

Rinse out the bottles after poured, inspect up to a light source and scrub any that are not clean, store until brewing day, use Starsan for a full soak inside the bottle and at least the neck on the outside.

Be aware that Starsan does not sterilize. It only sanitizes. That is most often plenty, as long as the bottles were clean when sanitized.

Do not let the Starsan dry before filling with beer. Starsan is a wet contact sanitizer, if it dries it is no longer effective.

Don't worry about any sanitizing after use then storing, this is just a waste of Starsan, time and effort. Sanitize right before bottling.

I have never seen any gunk when bottling as stated by AZCoolerBrewer. Seems a waste of time to me.

 

[dwhite60]

I keep a spray bottle of iodophor in the brew closet. After rinsing I give the bottle a few shots of iodophor and shake it around. Does it help? Don't know. Does it hurt? Probably not.

All the Best,
D. White

 

[AZCoolerBrewer]

Do not let the Starsan dry before filling with beer. Starsan is a wet contact sanitizer, if it dries it is no longer effective.

It seems so strange to me that the majority of homebrewers don't follow the directions on the back of the Starsan bottle.

I have never seen any gunk when bottling as stated by AZCoolerBrewer. Seems a waste of time to me.

If you don't wash your bottles with a bottle brush, why would you see any gunk?

 

[unionrdr]

Even if you do rinse out your newly emptied bottles right away, they can still cause gusher infections over time. Mine need to be soaked for an hour in PBW solution, then scrubbed, rinsed & dried before storage every 6 brews or so. Otherwise, they can gush a foam geyser in your face when you pop the cap to pour it! So get some PBW to soak the bottles every so often, especially if you don't get to rinsing them out right away. A bottle brush will also be needed. It's just something we bottlers must put up with for peace of mind, if nothing else. I'm sure SWMBO likes it...

 

[Sadu]

I got my first gusher bottle recently and it wasn't fun. So now I'm a lot more methodical in my process.

Rinse and shake after drinking.
Soak 1 hour in bleach and scrub with bottle brush.
Rinse with warm water.
Spray with Starsan, store upside down to drip-dry.
On bottling day, spray the inside with Starsan again and tip out the excess right before bottling.

This seems like a lot of work, maybe it is, I just don't want any more gushers.

 

[GrogNerd]

rinse after use
stored in FastRack until bottling day
vinator full of StarSan to sanitize
onto bottling tree

 

[kh54s10]

Even if you do rinse out your newly emptied bottles right away, they can still cause gusher infections over time. Mine need to be soaked for an hour in PBW solution, then scrubbed, rinsed & dried before storage every 6 brews or so. Otherwise, they can gush a foam geyser in your face when you pop the cap to pour it! So get some PBW to soak the bottles every so often, especially if you don't get to rinsing them out right away. A bottle brush will also be needed. It's just something we bottlers must put up with for peace of mind, if nothing else. I'm sure SWMBO likes it...

The only time my bottles get any cleaner at all is when one sits out and the crud inside has dried up like cement.

I have had 2 batches that were somewhat gushers. All of the bottles so something else went on there. They were very slow gushers. A small (normal) hiss when popping the cap then foam slowly pours out the neck....

I rinse my bottles then hold up to a light for an inspection, if I see any crud they then get the brush.....

 

[Photopilot]

rinse after use
stored in FastRack until bottling day
vinator full of StarSan to sanitize
onto bottling tree

This is exactly what I do, minus the fast rack. I have convinced the wife it is fun to help out. Between the two of us bottling goes very fast, I will time it this evening and give the results.

http://shop.greatfermentations.com/product/large-bottle-tree-90-bottles/beer-bottling-accessories

http://shop.greatfermentations.com/product/vinator-bottle-rinser-sulfiter/beer-bottling-accessories

Here are the parts GrogNerd is talking about. The Vinator sits atop the tree. Two quick squirts on the vinator and onto the tree.

 

[GrogNerd]

This is exactly what I do, minus the fast rack. I have convinced the wife it is fun to help out. Between the two of us bottling goes very fast, I will time it this evening and give the results.

http://shop.greatfermentations.com/product/large-bottle-tree-90-bottles/beer-bottling-accessories

http://shop.greatfermentations.com/product/vinator-bottle-rinser-sulfiter/beer-bottling-accessories

Here are the parts GrogNerd is talking about. The Vinator sits atop the tree. Two quick squirts on the vinator and onto the tree.

yep

critical pieces of equipment, I'd say. really can't stress how useful they are. saves so much time on bottling day

 

[m00ps]

im a fan of the dishwasher method. Sanitizes ~60 bottles without the labor, functions as a rack to hold them upside down, serves as a very large drip tray, and if you attach a bottle wand directly to your bucket, one handed bottling

easily cut my bottling routine in half. No more dipping all the bottles in starsan before filling

 

[unionrdr]

The only time my bottles get any cleaner at all is when one sits out and the crud inside has dried up like cement.

I have had 2 batches that were somewhat gushers. All of the bottles so something else went on there. They were very slow gushers. A small (normal) hiss when popping the cap then foam slowly pours out the neck....

I rinse my bottles then hold up to a light for an inspection, if I see any crud they then get the brush.....

With mine, I think it's these tiny dark spots inside around the bottom of some bottles that caused the gushers? But yeah, it's when I let them build up to a bunch, like 12 or so, that they get those spots quicker than 6 batches or so. Soak, scrub, rinse & dry at that point. Lately though, I've been getting antsy for something other than the computer my crippled behind can do. So I clean bottles, etc sooner, the brewery, etc for something more physical to do. A little change of scenery, at leas a little exercise? With my limited mobility, that is. Can't wait to get blood clots cleared up so my hip can get replaced.

 

[FrozenOcean]

Once upon a time, I tried the "rinse immediately" method of cleaning, followed by starsan squirts with an vinator. Did that for a couple of batches... was losing about 5% of bottles as gushers/minor infections.

I think they need to be soaked in PBW or oxyclean or something... Just rinsing isn't enough.

Although... A rinse followed by starsan soak might get you somewhere. But man, that's a lot of starsan to use!

 

[kh54s10]

Once upon a time, I tried the "rinse immediately" method of cleaning, followed by starsan squirts with an vinator. Did that for a couple of batches... was losing about 5% of bottles as gushers/minor infections.

I think they need to be soaked in PBW or oxyclean or something... Just rinsing isn't enough.

Although... A rinse followed by starsan soak might get you somewhere. But man, that's a lot of starsan to use!

As I said before I have had 2 batches that foamed, not gushed. Both were dark heavy beers. And all the bottles acted the same way. The problem was not with the bottle cleaning.

Other than that I have had no gushers/infections. About 45 batches have been bottled.

Rinsing has been enough for me.

Why do you think that is a lot of Starsan? I use less than a quart in my Vinator (until it broke). When done I pour the Starsan back into my storage container. In a bucket I use a couple of gallons, fill a bottle, swirl it, empty and set on the dishwasher rack and repeat 55 times.

As long as there is not a lot of debris in the Starsan and the pH is below 3 the Starsan is still good and gets reused.

 

[mattdee1]

A while back my parents offered me this box of 500ml PET bottles they had in their attic, which have been sitting there since the mid-90s when they dabbled with a local U-brew joint. They even attempted to clean them for me, but didn't do a very good job. There was some stubborn visible residue caked on a few of the bottles. One day I was bottling, it was late, I was tired, and ran out of "good" bottles to use. Since I only needed a few more I grabbed these ones from my parents that weren't fully clean, figuring that if a few throw-away gushers happened, oh well... better than dumping the beer out of the bottling bucket and not even giving it a chance. After about 4 months in the bottle, I poured the beers from those "dirty" bottles and they were perfectly fine--no gushing, and zero noticeable flavor flaws.

This dirty bottle experiment pretty much convinced me that a good rinse after pouring, followed by starsan on bottling day is plenty.

And so far, the results support that theory. I've got some glass bottles that have been used for 14 batches straight without a single gusher, and I don't even own a bottle brush

 

[unionrdr]

Consider yourself lucky! Bottles that dirty would blow around here. If for nothing else, just to piss me off! Those little dark spots have done in a few beers over the last couple years. I gotta take the lid seal outta the Cooper's Micro Brew FV & clean it., Just afraid to rip it or something...

 

[Michigan_Wolfman]

im a fan of the dishwasher method. Sanitizes ~60 bottles without the labor, functions as a rack to hold them upside down, serves as a very large drip tray, and if you attach a bottle wand directly to your bucket, one handed bottling

easily cut my bottling routine in half. No more dipping all the bottles in starsan before filling

This is exactly what I do! When I'm ready to bottle, they all go in upside down and put through a hot water rinse cycle and dry cycle.

 

[C-Rider]

I don't use the flip top bottles you do but here is a short video I made showing my bottle handling methods.

 

[filthyastronaut]

Basically just do what I need to do to eliminate any gunk. Try to rinse as soon as I pour, soak bottles in oxygen cleaner of some kind, and after that they are pretty much golden. Barely need to use a brush or anything. Rinse or no rinse depending on the cleaner, and then starsan.

 

[logan3825]

I rinse the bottles as soon as I pour out the beer. If they are not rinsed right away I don't even bother with them. If they are full of gunk, I am sure I will empty another one later.(of course with flip tops I might scrub them) Then I clean them using two 3 gallon buckets and Oxyclean Free.(the stuff without dyes or scent) I soak 12 bottles in one bucket while filling up the next bucket. Then I go back and delabel the bottles in the first bucket. I don't scrub at all. I rely on rinsing well and the Oxyclean soak. On bottling day I use a spray bottle with StarSan solution to spray inside the bottle and make sure the inside is coated. I dip the top in the tray of StarSan solution I have the caps soaking in them put them on the bottle tree.

 

[Brownalemikie]

My buddy has been making beer for 30 years and he told me the "key" is to rinse the bottles immediately after pouring and always drink craft brew from a glass.....not the bottle.

 

[passedpawn]

• Rinse right after pouring.
• Use a bottle tree with a vinator mounted on top, with starsan solution. Don't let bottles dry.
• Put caps in the vintator / starsan to sanitize them while bottling (i.e., no need to boil). In the picture below, you can see the yellow caps.
• Double-fisted bottling FTW.

 

[filthyastronaut]

• Rinse right after pouring.
• Use a bottle tree with a vinator mounted on top, with starsan solution. Don't let bottles dry.
• Put caps in the vintator / starsan to sanitize them while bottling (i.e., no need to boil). In the picture below, you can see the yellow caps.
• Double-fisted bottling FTW.

That's ****ing brilliant and seems like it should have been obvious. Bravo.