Bochet GROUP BREW - Solera Style

[MightyMosin]

A couple notes for anyone new to a bochet on the stovetop. No real order to this.

• Your pot shouldn't be filled more than 1/3 to 1/2 the way with honey... the higher temperature you will be using, the less you want to fill the pot as the honey volume will increase if you get it to boiling. When it is hot and you stir is when you will really see the expansion of volume.
• Personally, I go for about 225 with a max of 250 and just keep it on the heat longer. It does change the flavor, but experiment with how you want it.
• I use about 1/8 cup of water per pound of honey in the pot to avoid scorching the honey when it is added to the pot... it will steam off.
• You, generally, want caramelized flavors but not burnt ones so you need to mind the temperature and keep stirring.
• A heat diffuser really helps avoid hot spots as does a thick pan. This translates into less of stirring the honey.
• If you have an open window or a door, make sure you have a closed screens... bees will investigate your heated honey aroma.
• The more raw honey you have, the more gunk will float on the top. It's up to you, but I always spoon off the impurities and don't bring it into my mead. I figure its like when I'm casting boolits and the impurities come to the top and you want to get rid of it for a better product.
• Use extreme caution when using the honey for your mead. Do not pour cold water into boiling hot honey as you will get a horrible reaction when that water vaporizes and send hot honey exploding outward. use either hot water or let your honey cool down some. I usually just let it cool some as the must can't be too hot or you will just kill off your yeast.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

I'm in, just to clarify on the solera process I bulk age everything and do the mixing at the end?

Welcome Barzahl, MightyMosin has it right, make your first bochet and decide if you will do a single vessel aging or multiple.
Age your first then make your second, when your second is ready to age bottle a portion from the first and top it off with the second.
With multiple vessels, let's say 4, you could age 4 different batches in their own vessels without blending. Then when a 5th is ready to age bottle half of 1, top 1 up with 2, top 2 up with 3, top 3 up with 4, and top 4 up with 5.
Planning the size of each generation for your aging vessel is important to avoid excess headspace or leftovers.
There are more ways to solera blend and your imagination is the limit so however you want to try it go for it. If you search solera style blending you will see multiple variations on how to age and blend.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

Correct me if wrong, but this is my understanding.

The intention is to bottle periodically so that your earliest carboy has the longest aging and the most blended mix. If done true to the style you will have a carboy for each generation. If you think of them stacked vertically like this:
6
5
4
3
2
1
At some point, let's say Gen 3, You will bottle a portion out of #1. You will then siphon from #2 to fill #1. You will then siphon from #3 to fill #2.

I've just started to think about batch size management. With my example above, I need to plan Gen3 to be larger so that when I rack into #2 I will have an appropriate sized carboy for Gen3 to sit in without much headspace. In truth, I will rely on a stainless keg for my last batch which I can add CO2 so that headspace isn't quite the issue it might be in a carboy.

You will then continue to brew your next generations and bottle, siphon, refill...
I'll likely use some of the bottled blends to top up the barrel as needed.

Looks like I restated what you already said haha, planning the larger batch to avoid headspace is something I had to figure out after having started blending a while ago but you've got it figured out. With 3 gallon carboys once they are all filled I'll only make 2 gallon batches after that so I'm bottling and transferring 2 gallons across the line.

In your tips for bochet, in case it was missed or you haven't experienced this, Don't transfer the hot honey into the bottom of a cold carboy, I'll add some cold water then transfer into that after the kettle has cooled to about 120. Warm must helps my yeast take off and then I'll slowly cool it down to yeast temperatures over the first 24 hours.

 

[Barzahl]

Welcome Barzahl, MightyMosin has it right, make your first bochet and decide if you will do a single vessel aging or multiple.
Age your first then make your second, when your second is ready to age bottle a portion from the first and top it off with the second.
With multiple vessels, let's say 4, you could age 4 different batches in their own vessels without blending. Then when a 5th is ready to age bottle half of 1, top 1 up with 2, top 2 up with 3, top 3 up with 4, and top 4 up with 5.
Planning the size of each generation for your aging vessel is important to avoid excess headspace or leftovers.
There are more ways to solera blend and your imagination is the limit so however you want to try it go for it. If you search solera style blending you will see multiple variations on how to age and blend.

I understand now thanks. Going to do 5 gallon batches since I've got 5 fermenters that size already, planning to get a 2 or 2.5 gallon and keep juggling the youngest batch into it to take care of the headspace problem.

 

[Barzahl]

Thanks for the tips on Bochet I've never done it before, theoretically will I be able to tell if I've scorched it by tasting the honey or not know until the ferment is done?
I'm planning on caramelizing 8lbs of clover honey then adding 2 more plus 5 lbs of blueberry blossom honey with Qa23 yeast.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

Thanks for the tips on Bochet I've never done it before, theoretically will I be able to tell if I've scorched it by tasting the honey or not know until the ferment is done?
I'm planning on caramelizing 8lbs of clover honey then adding 2 more plus 5 lbs of blueberry blossom honey with Qa23 yeast.

As you stir you may find honey scorched and stuck to the bottom of your pot, visually the color of the honey will gradually changed and it will be uniform so if a clump on the end of you stir stick/spatula is significantly darker you may have some scorching. I think you will be able to smell and see any issues long before you taste anything off as you would need to cool a taste sample while honey continues to cook. Tasting the must pre/post fermentation will show you how roasty and caramelized the flavor is, if you like dark roasty flavors have a color in mind and turn off the heat a little beforehand to avoid over cooking. A quick search will show you the old paper plate color wheel of honey, this can also help you keep an eye on things.

If it hasn't been said yet, you are not looking for smoke before you finish caramelizing, smoke means burnt and burnt honey is not caramel.

 

[MightyMosin]

Thanks for the tips on Bochet I've never done it before, theoretically will I be able to tell if I've scorched it by tasting the honey or not know until the ferment is done?
I'm planning on caramelizing 8lbs of clover honey then adding 2 more plus 5 lbs of blueberry blossom honey with Qa23 yeast.

Adding on to the above comment, I would say the easiest way to avoid scorching is to bring the heat up slowly and be patient. .. don't crank the heat up because it seems like it is taking too long. Use some kind of thermometer, even if its an Infrared one.

After that, use a thick pan that helps distribute heat. If you don't have that or a heat diffuser, maybe you have a griddle that can be put under the pan as a heat diffuser to try and ensure an even heat distribution without hot spots.

 

[Barzahl]

Adding on to the above comment, I would say the easiest way to avoid scorching is to bring the heat up slowly and be patient. .. don't crank the heat up because it seems like it is taking too long. Use some kind of thermometer, even if its an Infrared one.

After that, use a thick pan that helps distribute heat. If you don't have that or a heat diffuser, maybe you have a griddle that can be put under the pan as a heat diffuser to try and ensure an even heat distribution without hot spots.

Alright thanks, I got a cast iron griddle that should fit the pot as well as a candy thermometer ; I should have it started in the next week or two as I don't have the honey yet.

 

[MightyMosin]

The yeast is pitched and my first generation of the Bochet is ready to start fermenting.

Caramelization with scum coming to the top. So dark with the Buckwheat.



Scum removed prior to cooling off


Pale Clover being added to the bochet honey


and it goes right to the bottom


Mixed, with water and final O2 addition before yeast pitch.



Did some small degassing today... and a lot of cleanup. The fermentation is well underway

 

[Kyzaboy89]

The yeast is pitched and my first generation of the Bochet is ready to start fermenting.

Caramelization with scum coming to the top. So dark with the Buckwheat.
View attachment 838494


Scum removed prior to cooling off
View attachment 838495

Pale Clover being added to the bochet honey
View attachment 838496

and it goes right to the bottom
View attachment 838497

Mixed, with water and final O2 addition before yeast pitch.
View attachment 838498

Looks like a sherry or rich amber color, looks great. Unfortunately I have been taking care of a sick family and now it's my turn, looking like next weekend for me.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

Here we go, feels like -47 outside and everyone has a cold to boot, just over 10 lbs of some very crystalized honey I've been storing for this reason. Bringing up to heat as we speak.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

Heat is at 223, the center of the pot is starting a calm bubble now and again.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

Heat rose to 225 so I turned down my burner a touch until the temperature fell to 219 then returned to the original setting. Only 5 degrees change over 30 minutes is as close to dialed in as this old stove gets.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

just about two and a half hours and I'm loving the flavor right here, also planning to keep the color more moderate throughout the generations. I've gone darker in the past and if I feel like it later on I may do a darker caramel but for now this is good.

Maintained a temp of 220-225 degrees through the whole process using a digital probe and a candy thermometer, didn't need the candy thermometer but in the event of honey boiling up I would pull the probe and leave the thermometer in. I was mainly verifying the accuracy against each other in the event of such a case, however apart from the early bubbling when I initially reached 223 degrees it never boiled. Also when adding the water to cool it, no boil up or violent reaction of any kind. Letting things cool while I prep a fermenter and get some yeast ready.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

Must was cooled with water then transfered and added water to O.G. 1.090, aerated, added nutrients and pitched yeast. Must was at 85 degrees when all was set to rest and will gradually cool to around 62 by tomorrow. Gen 1 is in primary.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

For reference towards how quickly my honey caramelized over time at a controlled heat and below boiling, low and slow traded time for a more controlled and relaxed cook as opposed to the traditional stir constantly and boil over. With time between each sample I was able to cool and taste the honey without multitasking the heat and spoon or worrying about scorching. I went for a rich caramel sweetness and stopped as soon as a toasted flavor became noticable, if anyone wants to see the log for time/temperature I'll be happy to post.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

Checking gravity on my Bochet and we are down to 1.050, temps dropped down to 52-54 some mornings and 64 at the warmest in the evening. How's everybody else doing? Dan0 and Barzahl get a batch going yet or still thinking about things?

 

[Dan O]

Checking gravity on my Bochet and we are down to 1.050, temps dropped down to 52-54 some mornings and 64 at the warmest in the evening. How's everybody else doing? Dan0 and Barzahl get a batch going yet or still thinking about things?

Hoping to get mine going this weekend. Life happened & messed up my plans to make it last weekend. It's only going to be my second bochet & I'm still trying to decide whether to use the stovetop, crock pot or sous vide method.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

Hoping to get mine going this weekend. Life happened & messed up my plans to make it last weekend. It's only going to be my second bochet & I'm still trying to decide whether to use the stovetop, crock pot or sous vide method.

Completely understand, family traded head colds since new years and battling weather has made work a bit sporadic. No pressure to get started, and I've never done sous vide but as long as you can monitor the temp any option works, I use stove top because it's the most consistent heat regulation I have available. Best of luck.

 

[Barzahl]

Checking gravity on my Bochet and we are down to 1.050, temps dropped down to 52-54 some mornings and 64 at the warmest in the evening. How's everybody else doing? Dan0 and Barzahl get a batch going yet or still thinking about things?

I've still gotta start mine

 

[MightyMosin]

I'm still trying to decide whether to use the stovetop, crock pot or sous vide method.

Stovetop works well if you have a big enough pot and you just let it slowly take its time. Once again, a heat diffuser or griddle under the pot helps make it an even heat.

Since the spouse is asking for me to make another Marshmallow bochet, I won't be using that oak barrel. I ended up getting another used whiskey barrel and dumped about 3 liters of Costco Scotch in it to condition it and swell it up... it will also provide some flavor for my Solera Gen 1 and maybe Gen 2.

 

[Dan O]

Since the spouse is asking for me to make another Marshmallow bochet, I won't be using that oak barrel.

Did you ever post your final recipe for this? I remember being very intrigued by the ingredient list.

 

[MightyMosin]

Did you ever post your final recipe for this? I remember being very intrigued by the ingredient list.

I haven't while I'm tinkering with it and this 3rd batch will be different and probably use cacao tincture in place of the actual toasted nibs. I'm trying to work it all out.

The first batch was too light on the nibs. The second a bit too chocolate heavy, though that has faded back a bit and closer to my liking. I'm thinking that the tincture might provide a finer level of control though I haven't tried it before. I'll post the first version soon.

 

[Dan O]

The second a bit too chocolate heavy, though that has faded back a bit

I noticed chocolate does eventually tend to fade.

I'm thinking that the tincture might provide a finer level of control

I really like the tincture idea. Now that I have those flip top bottles you shared, I want to do different tinctures with different toast levels of chocolate.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

I've still gotta start mine

No worries, join in whenever y'all feel like. Any questions or clarification and we're glad to help.

 

[MightyMosin]

My bochet is sitting at 1.030. At the rate it has been fermenting, I have 10 to 14 days for it to go dry unless it stalls.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

Just checking on the Bochet and noticed it has cleared significantly over the past few days, still off gassing steadily if not finishing fermentation, I'll plan on checking gravity tomorrow most likely. Tiny and medium bubbles are still floating up from the yeast cake which has settled nicely, looking like vertical stripes in the pics, looking forward to checking on this tomorrow.

 

[Kyzaboy89]

We are at 1.000 gravity with a clean, sweet caramel aroma in the hydrometer, off gasing is even slower today. I need to prep a carboy and rack this for clearing and spices, very happy with how clean this ferment has gone and will definitely be using temperature control in the future.

 

[MightyMosin]

Bochet for Solera project was racked from two separate 5 gallon carboys off the lees.

I'm not sure but there might have been a bit of a pellicle haze in each. Both were racked under the haze and I sacrificed more than I wanted to try and avoid it.

I have about 6 gallons of it to go to an oak barrel if it doesn't start up with some kind of pellicle in the carboys it was racked to. The two plastic carboys that they were racked out of have been cleaned and marked to note possible pellicle contamination.

Time will show.

 

[Dan O]

@MightyMosin ..

Where did you get the nozzle for the pure O2 tank?
Also, how long do you purge the must or starter with pure O2? Seconds? Minutes? Hours?

I currently just use an air pump meant for adding O2 to a fish tank with (two) 0.5 micron SS diffusion stones, just using the same air we breathe, but never stepped it up to pure O2.
I'm just curious how much of a difference it would make for my ferments.

Thank you, in advance, if you do reply.
Happy meading