Black Barley (Help put this to rest)

[Sriniker7]

OK... This is my first post even though I have been lurking here for a few months . But I have a question that has been very hard to find an answer too. So I have found many discussions on "black malt/barley" but non have answered my question directly here or elsewhere on the web (which is rare anymore). So .... from my research I have determined the following, and if I am wrong on some of these points please correct me....

"Black patent malt": is barley that has been Malted then Roasted
"Patent Malt": Same as above
"Roasted Malt": is NOT Malted but Roasted (to different degrees)
"Black Malt": is NOT Malted but Roasted but is at the darkest end of roasting

I hope I have that right...

Now my question, with some background info:
I am a chef and am just getting into brewing. At work we got some Black Barley that according to the source hails from Egypt. So before I knew about all grain brewing I decided to malt this barley which I accomplished with decent success(sun dried it). It smells wonderful like bread not like roasted barley at all!! So now I have this malted Black Egyptian Barley.

My Research: Black Egyptian Barley is a hulless
Here is link to what I have malted

barley.http://www.lentzspelt.com/black-nile-barley.html

It is common is European cuisine and is used typically for cold grain salads and sometime used in hot dishes.
I have tried many times to find info on using it for brewing but have only found the above info on black barley which I assume is a base barley that has been roasted malted or not. Which leads to my question....

1. Does this barley produce the necessary enzyme when malted or did I waste my time.
2. Can I use it for brewing(which I assume I can)
3. What recipe/ ratio would I use it in
4. What style of beer would I use it for (porter, stout, or would this be a hybrid of some sort)

Please help!
Thanks in advance!!
Sam

 

[PupThePup]

From the typical malt analysis on the Briess website:

Black Malt - Flavor: Dry roasted, sharp to neutral — Use in dark beers for flavor; use in all styles for color with little flavor; has little impact on foam color
Black Barley, Roasted Barley - Flavor: Coffee, intense bitter, dry — Provides color and rich, sharp flavor which is characteristic of Stout and some Porters; impacts foam color

 

[Goyagon]

I'm just guessing on this but here's my opinion

1. It should be able to self convert but it sounds like it is a wild strain so I wouldn't count on adding a lot of adjuncts.
2. You can use anything that has starches or sugar in brewing so it will work.
3. A good ratio would be 50:50 with some 2 row as a base malt just to see the effects on flavor. If your roasting it I think it would be similar to carafa special malts which are dehulled and therefore less bitterness since there are no hull tannins. The overall flavor and how much to use if you roast it would depend on dark you roasted or Carmelized it.
4. The best way would be to find out yourself with experimentation.

I doubt this barley will become something amazing to add to your brewing. But it might give unique flavors and a cool backstory for your beers.

 

[abrix]

First thing: black malt is equivalent to black patent malt, though the actual color varies between maltsters and batches.

As you say, your barley is not roasted, so it should be more of a base malt. Being sun-dried, it probably has a good enzyme component. However, being hull-less, I would guess you will have trouble using it for more than 50% of a grain bill without adding rice hulls to keep the grain bed open.

Have you tasted the malted barley? That would give you an indication of how to use it. However, I've never heard of a style of beer that uses it, so you will likely be breaking some new ground by brewing with it.

I would start by making a small batch, lightly hopped (bittering only), with 50% 2-row brewer's malt (or pilsner) and 50% of your black barley, with some rice hulls for insurance against a stuck sparge, and a neutral yeast strain. See what sort of flavor you get out of the black barley and decide where to go from there. After all, you are the chef!

 

[Sriniker7]

Thanks again for your suggestions and clarification on these malts. So I decided to brew this like a porter and with help from all of you and a little from my local brew shop this what I did. I used a brown porter recipe posted by Orfy as a base recipe that I modified for this. As a side note I did find something in the forums about this barley but under the name purple barley which is it also know as. Aperently someone has used in on thies forum with decent results.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f36/anyone-try-purple-hulless-barley-156759/

I also found out in my research that Dogfish Head Craft Brewery does use it in their English Barleywine which get pretty high reviews.

Type: All Grain
Date: 1/8/2013
Batch Size: 3.00 gal
Brewer: Sam Riniker
Boil Size: 3.43 gal
Boil Time: 60 min Equipment: 4 Gal Brewpot
Taste Notes:

Ingredients

Amount Item
4.00 lb Pale Malt (2 Row)
1.30 lb Egyptian Black Barley (also known as purple high prairie barley)

0.75 oz Kent Goldings 60 min
0.25 oz Kent Goldings 15 min
1 Pkgs Nottingham (Danstar #-) Yeast-British Ale



Beer Profile

Est Original Gravity: 1.042 SG
Measured Original Gravity: 1.045 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.011 SG Measured Final Gravity:
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 4.16 % Actual Alcohol by Vol:



Mash Profile

Mash Name: Single Infusion, Medium Body, No Mash Out Total Grain Weight: 5.3 lb
Sparge Water: 1.75 gal Grain Temperature: 72.0 F
Sparge Temperature: 168.0 F TunTemperature: 120.0 F

Single Infusion, Medium Body, No Mash Out Step Time Name Description Step Temp
60 min Mash In Add 6 qt of water at 165.9 F 154.0 F

Thanks again to everyone for their input. I will follow up with tasting notes.
Sam

 

[SVB]

I have used purple hulless before, I used it in the first dark IPA I made (Primarily as a colorant) and it was excellent. I have since had some difficulty finding it.