Beer line tests & solution to the "plastic" taste

[JRems]

I recently replaced some bev flex 3/16 line and with my seltzer it has a small amount of taste. The last hose I got was from chicompany and says foxx equiptment on it. It does not impart any flavor. Anyone else using the foxx line? It is also more flexible when cold.

 

[rabeb25]

Can someone help me with balancing my new system?

I scraped the 35ft of trunk line, and glycol in favor of a cheap CL freezer and short runs.

System setup:

CO2:
3/16" shanks
1/4" bevseal ultra 235 (15ft)
3/16 keg posts (if it matters)
From keg to shank about a 1' rise

Nitro setup:
3/16" shank
1/4" bevseal ultra 235 (15ft)
3/16 keg posts (if it matters)
From keg to shank about a 1' rise


I have independent regulators for each keg, and I am going to try to carb at proper levels to style.

Thanks!!!!
Bryan

 

[lmnop]

I'm waiting for some Tygon Silver tubing to come in the mail... Will post a review once I get it and get around to putting it in the keezer.

It's been 3 weeks, any update on this?

 

[spotter]

CO2:
3/16" shanks
1/4" bevseal ultra 235 (15ft)
3/16 keg posts (if it matters)
From keg to shank about a 1' rise

Nitro setup:
3/16" shank
1/4" bevseal ultra 235 (15ft)
3/16 keg posts (if it matters)
From keg to shank about a 1' rise

To balance the CO2 with that setup you'd need around 25' at 12PSI. Add more line, or check out the sticky on swizzles.

The Nitro with a stout faucet doesn't matter, the restrictor in the faucet should take care of it.

 

[garbs]

Don't know about you guys, but I picked up some Tygon b-44-4X and was really disappointed. It doesn't impart any plastic flavor like the bevlex, but instead completely oxidizes any beer that sits in the line for a while (1-2 days).

For the price of this line, I actually think I'm worse off than before.

 

[Ricand]

Don't know about you guys, but I picked up some Tygon b-44-4X and was really disappointed. It doesn't impart any plastic flavor like the bevlex, but instead completely oxidizes any beer that sits in the line for a while (1-2 days).

For the price of this line, I actually think I'm worse off than before.

I thought it was just me. You are right, the beer tastes like butt in a couple days sitting in 11ft of line. I waste a ton of beer, since when we have guests coming over I take a pitcher and dump the beer in the lines out of the 10 taps I have here. Otherwise, I found people were taking a sampler glass of that nasty and thinking that's what I was brewing. If you pull a full pint, it's less noticeable, but still there. So you think it's the b-44-4X and not just a common problem of lines in general? If so.. does anyone want over a 100 ft of this line?

 

[garbs]

I don't remember ever tasting this level of oxidation with the bevlex 200. It might have something to do with the fact that the tygon isn't thick walled, but I'm contemplating ripping the lines out yet again and starting over.

 

[robertvrabel]

I was considering the b-44-4X tubing, but now people are reporting that its not helping and you still have to pour some out? Is this still the case? I really don't want to use this inflexible tubing... seems like its a hassle to work with, and considering i'd need 25' of it per tap (4) that it'll be hard to get me setup on it.

Anyone with experience in changing to this, was it hard to do? Seems like since its not bendable, i'd have a hard time getting it to my taps. I can't believe after reading 19 pages of this thread i'm still confused what to replace! I don't mind dishing out $ for it, i just don't want to have to replace them again... its driving me nuts that there isn't a perfect solution to this!

Side note:
For those not noticing the flavor difference, I never did until I hooked up my german pilsner to it. The first 2-4oz almost made me gag, and the next 12oz pour was perfect. It goes bad fast too, within atleast 12 hours (i'm betting its even sooner i'd need to test). I'm guessing the other beers I did this too were just so flavorful that it didn't impact it as much. With a light lager, its extremely noticeable.

 

[RichBenn]

I recently replaced some bev flex 3/16 line and with my seltzer it has a small amount of taste. The last hose I got was from chicompany and says foxx equiptment on it. It does not impart any flavor. Anyone else using the foxx line? It is also more flexible when cold.

I'm using it, no flavor. But with big IPAs, I'm not certain I could taste it anyway.

 

[JRems]

I'm using it, no flavor. But with big IPAs, I'm not certain I could taste it anyway.

I switched back to the foxx brand line. The bev lex just tasted too plasticy. Especially with seltzer it was very noticeable.

 

[robertvrabel]

So I purchased 100F of bev-seal ultra. I installed 27FT of 1/4" lines since thats all I could get... my setup is 10PSI at 37F which I caculated way over to start. The beer FLIES out so fast... its worse than my previous setup of 12PSI at 40F with 8FT lines 3/16"

I did this change for the non-plastic taste (still waiting for the beer to sit in the lines for more than 24 hours), but i'm really disappointed in the flow now. What the heck am I doing wrong??

 

[weirdboy]

Well you could get those little spiral thungs and insert one or two into the dip tube.

 

[robertvrabel]

Well you could get those little spiral thungs and insert one or two into the dip tube.

I've already ordered those to test it out... should come in soon. I just find it crazy how difficult it is balance a system. It makes me wonder if my temperature and pressure is not reporting correctly. It seems correct to me though, and i've entered beers into competition and haven't had problems with carbonation before.

 

[whoneedsabeer]

I too use 1/4" Bev-Seal Ultra, and I put ~30' line on each tap after reading here how little resistance these lines offer. I'm glad I did, because at 44F and 8psi, my beer pours very quick, but acceptable. Good luck getting it dialed in.

 

[BigdogMark]

I've read through this thread again and didn't find an answer to thoughts on the gas tubing. There seems to be this perception that it has to be bigger - meaner tubing because it is gas, but pressure is pressure. My gas tubing smells/tastes like crap and I can't believe the CO2 isn't picking up some of that.

Other than identification purposes, why is the gas side always a different hose? I can understand in a commercial setting where the beer is already carbonated. There would be minimal infusion of the potentially tainted gas. But many of us homebrew folks are carbing up from the CO2 system.

 

[msa8967]

So is there a general recommendation as to which brand and dimension of beer line will work the best?

I have read about people using polyethylene plastic tubing for their soda lines and I want to know if I can also use it to replace my beer lines in my keezer. I have tried "googling" for an answer but many of the responses refer a generic type of "poly" tubing and not specifically polyethylene plastic.

McMaster-Carr carries this tubing (as referenced in a thread about soda) for 15 cents/foot. It is not a clear type of tubing that I am use to for kegging.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#5181k42/=d90lzr

Any idea if this material is appropriate for homebrew? Thanks

 

[outside92129]

msa8967- i'm organizing a group buy of 3/16 bev-seal ultra. See the equipment discussions for info.

 

[ExHempKnight]

It's been 3 weeks, any update on this?

Well, it's been several months, but I've finally got my keezer up and running.

So far, with 12.5 feet of 3/16" Tygon Silver tubing, I have not noticed any off flavors. The longest the beer has sat in the line is roughly 24 hours.

I'll try to let it sit longer, but the novelty (read: awesomeness) of having beer on tap in my own dining room makes it difficult. I'll report back when I've been able to let it sit a few days.

 

[Boleslaus]

I really need to find a solution that works for me. I've had my keezer running for 2 weeks and, like others, I hate pouring out the first few ounces. I really don't want to have 20+ ft. of line to run 10 psi. I also don't want to use thin walled tubing like tygon because I've heard it can cause oxidation.

What are my other options? Is there tubing that looks and operates the same as generic 3/16 line, but has at least less plastic taste?

 

[ExHempKnight]

I'd like proof for your claim that thin-walled tubing causes oxidation.

The Tygon Silver 3/16"ID tubing has been great so far... No discernible plastic (or any other off-) taste at all. The only downside I've come across is that it's expensive compared to other lines.

And regardless of the brand of tubing, you're still going to have to balance the system, so you may well end up with 10+ feet of tubing. You can just stuff it all in the keezer, and have a ball of beer-line spaghetti, or you can take the time and keep everything coiled and wrapped, and it'll be neat and organized. That's up to you.

 

[Boleslaus]

I'd like proof for your claim that thin-walled tubing causes oxidation.

The Tygon Silver 3/16"ID tubing has been great so far... No discernible plastic (or any other off-) taste at all. The only downside I've come across is that it's expensive compared to other lines.

And regardless of the brand of tubing, you're still going to have to balance the system, so you may well end up with 10+ feet of tubing. You can just stuff it all in the keezer, and have a ball of beer-line spaghetti, or you can take the time and keep everything coiled and wrapped, and it'll be neat and organized. That's up to you.

So if you use the tygon silver at around 8-10 psi for most of my beers, how long would the tubing have to be your think?

 

[Boleslaus]

FWIW 2 people on the previous page have stated that their beer tastes oxidized. I really don't want to spend the $120 on tubing.

 

[ExHempKnight]

Well, according to the calculator I found HERE, I'd say 4-6 feet (I'd go closer to 6', due to the lower internal friction of the Tygon)... It seems people have good luck with the calculations in that spreadsheet, but YMMV.

Personally, I didn't feel like dicking around with tuning line length, and went with what I knew would work for probably 99% of my carbonation/serving pressure needs. I bought a 50' length of the tubing, and cut it into quarters (12.5' each). I coiled the excess line to the same diameter of a keg, and used 2 zip ties to keep each coil together. Each coil of line sits atop it's respective keg.

I currently run 12psi, and have a reasonably fast fill time, with no excess foaming.

 

[Boleslaus]

Well, according to the calculator I found HERE, I'd say 4-6 feet (I'd go closer to 6', due to the lower internal friction of the Tygon)... It seems people have good luck with the calculations in that spreadsheet, but YMMV.

Personally, I didn't feel like dicking around with tuning line length, and went with what I knew would work for probably 99% of my carbonation/serving pressure needs. I bought a 50' length of the tubing, and cut it into quarters (12.5' each). I coiled the excess line to the same diameter of a keg, and used 2 zip ties to keep each coil together. Each coil of line sits atop it's respective keg.

I currently run 12psi, and have a reasonably fast fill time, with no excess foaming.

So do you use the Silver? I was hoping to go with the B-44-3 since it is cheaper. It's gotten good reviews in the past, but the two from this thread mentioned some bad oxidation...to the point that the first 2 oz had to be dumped. I'd rather save the money and just dump my plastic tainted beer if thats gonna happen.

 

[ExHempKnight]

Yes, I use Tygon Silver. No oxidized-beer taste I can detect.

 

[-TH-]

For what it's worth I've been using LDPE tubing 1/4" OD .170 ID (made by Freelin Wade, specs here: http://www.freelin-wade.com/documents/Freelin-Wade_Polyethylene.pdf) with great success. Its cheap ($0.07 - $0.09 per foot), impermeable to gasses (no oxidation issues), works great in push-to-connect fittings which I use a lot of, has a small ID which provides good resistance and therefore does not require long lengths in order to balance, and has no plastic taste that I can detect (my guess is it would be equivalent to #9 in the OP).

 

[Boleslaus]

Has anyone looked into the Tygon E-70-V-CE taste barrier tubing? I'm trying to find someone who sells it to see what size its offered in and how much it costs.

 

[Pyrox27]

Hey guys, I was wondering if someone could steer me towards what lines they think are the best for my application.

I have this tower
http://www.beveragefactory.com/draftbeer/beer-towers/single-double/ebd4743dt-525ss.shtml

An additional factor to my setup is I am running my lines through an inch diameter copper tube that runs up into my tower.


I most definitely have the "taint" that no amount of cleaning gets rid of. Would anyone have a recommendation on the best line for a setup like that ? I was told poly lines would be very difficult to install in the tight quarters of my tower, but I am open to suggestions.

Thanks

 

[kal]

I most definitely have the "taint" that no amount of cleaning gets rid of. Would anyone have a recommendation on the best line for a setup like that ? I was told poly lines would be very difficult to install in the tight quarters of my tower, but I am open to suggestions.

The issue is that poly is harder to bend than vinyl so you wantto minimize really tight turns if possible. You can do this by using a 90 bent hose barb/nipple at the end of the shanks instead of a straight nipple

Like this:

Kal

 

[kal]

Update: 3/16" inner diameter Bev-Seal 235 tubing is now rumoured to be available again after not being available for many years due to lack of interest. Please don't ask me where to get it - I don't know. I've simply noticed people mentioning on this forum that they are purchasing it.

Kal