Bay Area Thread

[Wino1]

I was in 3 WF's today, did not find a single beer to buy. ****, times change.

I did learn, Friday is one of those 20% sale things. Might be worth it if your store actually has stuff.

Swung by Bevmo Van Ness today. The 8 Cuvee renees there last week were gone.

 

[tosh1]

You gotta find the equivalent of Bine & Vine up there. I always go into that store expecting to buy a six-pack or a bottle and always leave with over a full case of beer… (and I’ve had equivalent experiences as you with going to WF and walking out with nothing)

Plenty of other places, I guess I was just lamenting WF of yesteryear. When they still had good stuff.

 

[JTC28111]

What are decent whole foods to hit around here, anyway? Since moving here from dc (where one in particular was one of the best bottle shops in the city) I have been looking for the right kind of whole foods. So far Lake Merritt and Fremont have both disappointed

 

[AndresR]

What are decent whole foods to hit around here, anyway? Since moving here from dc (where one in particular was one of the best bottle shops in the city) I have been looking for the right kind of whole foods. So far Lake Merritt and Fremont have both disappointed

There doesn't seem to be a "The Whole Foods" for beer in the bay. But some are better than others. WF on Ocean can be really solid for such a small beer area. Really though, Redwood city seems to get damn near everything that drops. San Mateo was really getting solid for a while there. But it's been 6 months since I've been in.

 

[CommanderofAwesome]

What are decent whole foods to hit around here, anyway? Since moving here from dc (where one in particular was one of the best bottle shops in the city) I have been looking for the right kind of whole foods. So far Lake Merritt and Fremont have both disappointed

New WF in Berkeley is the best WF in the East Bay in my opinion, but it's not wroth a special trip for. The Bevmo in Albany (right down the street) is better as is Berkeley Bowl. Being a DC transplant myself, I've come to terms that the west coast just pales in comparison to anything the East Coast has to offer in terms of beer selection, brewery quality, and sandwiches. We get weather, nature, and burritos in their place.

 

[rrryanc]

Being a DC transplant myself, I've come to terms that the west coast just pales in comparison to anything the East Coast has to offer in terms of beer selection, brewery quality, and sandwiches.

Huh?

DC's laws are particularly nice, but it's far from representative of the East Coast. Even trying to buy beer in a grocery store in half the states on that side of the country is illegal.

And better breweries? I think San Diego alone has better breweries than the entire east coast.

I'll give you sandwiches, though you have to be particularly found of extra grease and generally ****** ingredients.

 

[pen15clubmember]

New WF in Berkeley is the best WF in the East Bay in my opinion, but it's not wroth a special trip for. The Bevmo in Albany (right down the street) is better as is Berkeley Bowl. Being a DC transplant myself, I've come to terms that the west coast just pales in comparison to anything the East Coast has to offer in terms of beer selection, brewery quality, and sandwiches. We get weather, nature, and burritos in their place.

Yeah, pretty much the same except maybe brewery (edit: quality) . In the Philly area, there were a number of stores that always had several interesting options, albeit at an absurd markup, where as out here, I can easily walk out of stores empty handed. Whole Foods' beer selections do feel more homogenized in recent months/years in my experience here, too, which sucks.

A big factor is simply that our out-of-state distribution sucks here. I don't know why (size of markets, fear that people are more than happy with just drinking California beer, regulatory barriers, taxes...it's probably some combo of all those things plus some stuff I'm missing) but it's not good.

 

[CommanderofAwesome]

Yeah, pretty much the same except maybe brewery (edit: quality) . In the Philly area, there were a number of stores that always had several interesting options, albeit at an absurd markup, where as out here, I can easily walk out of stores empty handed. Whole Foods' beer selections do feel more homogenized in recent months/years in my experience here, too, which sucks.

A big factor is simply that our out-of-state distribution sucks here. I don't know why (size of markets, fear that people are more than happy with just drinking California beer, regulatory barriers, taxes...it's probably some combo of all those things plus some stuff I'm missing) but it's not good.

Yeah, this area is FINALLY getting hip to the idea that there are more beer styles out there than IPAs and that 6 pks are > than a bomber. Factor in asinine growler laws/policy and a plethora of mediocre to ****** breweries, northern ca in many ways is pretty ****** for beer. Bay Area can't even get distro right, so many times a beer hits SF way before the East Bay and vice versa. Add in the fact that it is next to impossible to find FSW shelf beer that isn't 4 months old. Last time I was in Ohio/PA I found fresher (within 2 weeks old) stone and FSW hoppy beers. At the local WF Pale 31 is like 6 months old.

OK, great SD has some good breweries, still not NorCal and most of the great SD beers are just now starting to make their way to the Bay Area. So CA does hoppy beers well, big whoop, so does everywhere else.

 

[CommanderofAwesome]

Huh?

DC's laws are particularly nice, but it's far from representative of the East Coast. Even trying to buy beer in a grocery store in half the states on that side of the country is illegal.

And better breweries? I think San Diego alone has better breweries than the entire east coast.

I'll give you sandwiches, though you have to be particularly found of extra grease and generally ****** ingredients.

That is just wrong.

 

[Arbitrator]

Yeah, this area is FINALLY getting hip to the idea that there are more beer styles out there than IPAs

Guilty as charged. I pretty much only like to drink hoppy pales.

Factor in asinine growler laws/policy and a plethora of mediocre to ****** breweries, northern ca in many ways is pretty ****** for beer. Bay Area can't even get distro right, so many times a beer hits SF way before the East Bay and vice versa. Add in the fact that it is next to impossible to find FSW shelf beer that isn't 4 months old. Last time I was in Ohio/PA I found fresher (within 2 weeks old) stone and FSW hoppy beers. At the local WF Pale 31 is like 6 months old.

Fully agreed, especially on the growler laws.

So CA does hoppy beers well, big whoop, so does everywhere else.

My wife worked in DC for a year, so I got to spend a lot of time out there. We absolutely love it and would move there in a heartbeat. But the hoppy beer doesn't compare, IMO -- nothing out there is on the same level as Alvarado, Cellarmaker, Faction, Fieldwork, Altamont, RR (which has admittedly slipped in quality). Supposedly Hop Dogma and Alpha Acid are up there, but I haven't had their stuff in a long time. Outside of hops, I put Moonlight, SARA, and again Alvarado on a pedestal that DC can't reach.

I'd put DC Brau at the level of Drake's, maybe a bit higher. Right Proper was pretty solid. A lot of the stuff I care about (Founders, Bells) makes it to both areas.

 

[pen15clubmember]

Yeah, this area is FINALLY getting hip to the idea that there are more beer styles out there than IPAs and that 6 pks are > than a bomber. Factor in asinine growler laws/policy and a plethora of mediocre to ****** breweries, northern ca in many ways is pretty ****** for beer. Bay Area can't even get distro right, so many times a beer hits SF way before the East Bay and vice versa. Add in the fact that it is next to impossible to find FSW shelf beer that isn't 4 months old. Last time I was in Ohio/PA I found fresher (within 2 weeks old) stone and FSW hoppy beers. At the local WF Pale 31 is like 6 months old.

OK, great SD has some good breweries, still not NorCal and most of the great SD beers are just now starting to make their way to the Bay Area. So CA does hoppy beers well, big whoop, so does everywhere else.

I can't fully agree there. You could literally apply that first bolded sentence to the entire US. There are now over 4,000 breweries in the country and what, maybe 10% of them are good? That's probably being too generous. Sure, some places are better than others but one could make an argument that the overall quality here (or at least the handful of really good breweries) is better than most of the US. When I left Philly, the only good local breweries were Tired Hands, Troegs, and Victory (they make keg several great lagers that don't leave the area).

Distro here is does make my head spin, though. I've also experienced seeing friends back east get FW beers weeks before they come up to the Bay. Like you could literally walk down to Paso and back and have the beer two weeks before

 

[pen15clubmember]

That is just wrong.

Good sandwiches are few and far between in the Bay Area. Back east, you couldn't swing a dead cat without hitting a good hoagie place.

 

[rrryanc]

Good sandwiches are few and far between in the Bay Area. Back east, you couldn't swing a dead cat without hitting a good hoagie place.

Right, but a good hoagie place consists of what? In my experience, generally a lot of meat, a ton of some sort of sauce, really ****** vegetables (nasty tomatoes and shredded iceberg?) and if you're lucky, good bread. They're everywhere, but few actually live up to a good sandwich out here.

 

[rrryanc]

Yeah, this area is FINALLY getting hip to the idea that there are more beer styles out there than IPAs and that 6 pks are > than a bomber. Factor in asinine growler laws/policy and a plethora of mediocre to ****** breweries, northern ca in many ways is pretty ****** for beer. Bay Area can't even get distro right, so many times a beer hits SF way before the East Bay and vice versa. Add in the fact that it is next to impossible to find FSW shelf beer that isn't 4 months old. Last time I was in Ohio/PA I found fresher (within 2 weeks old) stone and FSW hoppy beers. At the local WF Pale 31 is like 6 months old.

OK, great SD has some good breweries, still not NorCal and most of the great SD beers are just now starting to make their way to the Bay Area. So CA does hoppy beers well, big whoop, so does everywhere else.

The real problem here is you're buying your beer from stores instead of direct. And the DC stores I've checked out were similarly ******, with really old beers, so I'm not sure where you were going that was head and shoulders above. Unless you only drink FW which, as Arbitrator can tell you, is a long standing issue.

Growler laws I agree with, 6 packs I don't. Personally, I rarely drink 70+ ounces of the same beer in a row.

 

[RyanG1]

Growler laws I agree with, 6 packs I don't. Personally, I rarely drink 70+ ounces of the same beer in a row.

Never skip can day?

 

[Arbitrator]

Personally, I rarely drink 70+ ounces of the same beer in a row.

Buying your kegerator was a stroke of genius then.

 

[mjl21]

Yeah, this area is FINALLY getting hip to the idea that there are more beer styles out there than IPAs and that 6 pks are > than a bomber. Factor in asinine growler laws/policy and a plethora of mediocre to ****** breweries, northern ca in many ways is pretty ****** for beer. Bay Area can't even get distro right, so many times a beer hits SF way before the East Bay and vice versa. Add in the fact that it is next to impossible to find FSW shelf beer that isn't 4 months old. Last time I was in Ohio/PA I found fresher (within 2 weeks old) stone and FSW hoppy beers. At the local WF Pale 31 is like 6 months old.

OK, great SD has some good breweries, still not NorCal and most of the great SD beers are just now starting to make their way to the Bay Area. So CA does hoppy beers well, big whoop, so does everywhere else.

Transplant go home!!!

 

[pen15clubmember]

Right, but a good hoagie place consists of what? In my experience, generally a lot of meat, a ton of some sort of sauce, really ****** vegetables (nasty tomatoes and shredded iceberg?) and if you're lucky, good bread. They're everywhere, but few actually live up to a good sandwich out here.

That's the thing. It seems so simple, yet so many people suck at it out here. It's crazy. Most don't use back east don't iceberg and I don't eat tomatoes on sandos FWIW. Good bread/roll is paramount.

 

[brokensail1]

Anybody besides joeneugs and I out in the Dublin/Pleasanton/Livermore area (or at least Easy Bay) that are willing to attend and possibly host tastings? Kind of trying to set up a terribly infrequent, unpredictable, informal tasting group. If nothing else, I have a ton of Monkish sour beers that I'd like to open, including some sets like fruited Soul Foudres, fruited Vellichors, etc. but not gonna dome 3 or 4 750ml bottles of 8% beer by myself.

Can probably host some smaller shares in my apartment or slightly larger ones by the complex pool (hopefully no kid's birthday parties going on), or I can probably arrange something with a local beer establishment if it's not too large of a group and you're not all degenerates who will buy some draft beers while we're there.

 

[rrryanc]

Buying your kegerator was a stroke of genius then.

Was before I knew better. The keg of bourbon county was totally worth it though.

 

[rrryanc]

That's the thing. It seems so simple, yet so many people suck at it out here. It's crazy. Most don't use back east don't iceberg and I don't eat tomatoes on sandos FWIW. Good bread/roll is paramount.

I don't think you can "throw a stick" and hit a place back east that has good bread and doesn't use iceberg lettuce. And no tomatoes??

Now if you want a bbq sandwich, or a cheesteak, or something that's basically just meat and cheese on a ****** roll - ya those are everywhere out east. And those are good, but I'd take something from Ikes or Woodside Deli any day.

 

[pen15clubmember]

I don't think you can "throw a stick" and hit a place back east that has good bread and doesn't use iceberg lettuce. And no tomatoes??

Now if you want a bbq sandwich, or a cheesteak, or something that's basically just meat and cheese on a ****** roll - ya those are everywhere out east. And those are good, but I'd take something from Ikes or Woodside Deli any day.

Not just steaks, but yeah those are obv great there, too. Jake's in Marina is comparable to Dalessandro's. I would ******* kill for a good roast pork, or really any roast pork. Good delis are everywhere in Philly, which is the only place I can speak for. I'm not talking just Wawa (iceberg for sure), which I would take over a lot of sandwich spots out here and it isn't even that good. Deli Board, Ike's, Lou's, Rhea's are all excellent but damn there should be more places like those, preferably with the average sando being less than 12 ******* dollars.

 

[stupac2]

You people must've been living in sandwich paradises, I had nothing but garbage back home. I've spent time in a lot of places and generally find the concentration of sandwich places to be similar here, though bbq is obviously less present than in some areas. The one thing I'm unaware of anyone out here doing at all is beef on weck, but I doubt anyone cares.

 

[pen15clubmember]

You people must've been living in sandwich paradises, I had nothing but garbage back home. I've spent time in a lot of places and generally find the concentration of sandwich places to be similar here, though bbq is obviously less present than in some areas. The one thing I'm unaware of anyone out here doing at all is beef on weck, but I doubt anyone cares.

Where are you from? Weck is like an upstate NY thing, right?

 

[CommanderofAwesome]

Not just steaks, but yeah those are obv great there, too. Jake's in Marina is comparable to Dalessandro's. I would ******* kill for a good roast pork, or really any roast pork. Good delis are everywhere in Philly, which is the only place I can speak for. I'm not talking just Wawa (iceberg for sure), which I would take over a lot of sandwich spots out here and it isn't even that good. Deli Board, Ike's, Lou's, Rhea's are all excellent but damn there should be more places like those, preferably with the average sando being less than 12 ******* dollars.

Agreed, and they shouldn't take 20 ******* min either (looking at you Ike's). Best sandwich place I've found is Yellow Submarine in the Inner Sunset.

An avg sandwich place in DC/Philly/Cleveland/NYC would destroy SF's finest. EZ

 

[stupac2]

Where are you from? Weck is like an upstate NY thing, right?

I grew up in RI but have family from the Buffalo area.

 

[mjl21]

That's the thing. It seems so simple, yet so many people suck at it out here. It's crazy. Most don't use back east don't iceberg and I don't eat tomatoes on sandos FWIW. Good bread/roll is paramount.

No excuse for piss poor sandwiches. Where do you live? If in SF proper, which neighborhood?

 

[pen15clubmember]

No excuse for piss poor sandwiches. Where do you live? If in SF proper, which neighborhood?

I used to live in the Richmond District, but now Mill Valley. The only good places up here I know are Michael's Sourdough and Davey Jones Deli.

I grew up in RI but have family from the Buffalo area.

Maybe Philly was a safe haven then. I would imagine the have great delis everywhere in NYC, or at least parts of Manhattan...

 

[RyanG1]

Michael's Sourdough and Davey Jones Deli.

Both legit

Vikings in San Rafael has been around for days. Antones in Mill Valley from what I can remember. Perrys in Fairfax. Standard run of the mill but decent spots

Also Cubano at Sol Food. But not your traditional deli.

 

[coldstorage]

Have traveled extensively in my past life (43 states down) and am 100% mystified by this "food and beer sucks in Northern CA" position.