Bay Area Thread

[bugdoc]

Eh, isn't that exactly what Arbitrator basically describes doing in that linked post?

Well, that...plus troll the living **** out of his enemies on the forums.

 

[Arbitrator]

THIS.

Simple. You vote with your dollar. Pretty much the loudest statement you can make.

Working as an analyst for an e-commerce site... No, it's not. That's an extremely simplistic statement.

A movie does poorly. Is it attributed to:
- Bad director
- Bad marketing
- Bad script
- Bad CGI
- Bad timing
- External events (e.g. screenwriter is a Holocaust denier, and it went viral)
- ??

There are so many reasons for a missing dollar, that the message is lost without some direction. Feedback is just as, if not more, valuable than the missing dollar. So I do both.

Call me crazy (or docile?) but when I don't like the way a place does business, I simply stop giving them my money.

Most people don't stop giving them their business. Beer geeks are largely the definition of docile; it's pretty telling when you look at the hostility I'm getting for giving direct feedback. That's why we have so many shops willing to do underhanded things for the extra dollar. They know their customers won't mind.

I can't tell you how many conversations I've had with people about Perry's where they said, "Yeah, he's kind of a dick, but..."

Same with City Beer Store.

Arbitrator, Internet warrior! So brave and fierce on the forums!

Hilarious, but what am I supposed to do beyond not shopping there and telling them why? Go punch their lights out?

I'll remember this the next time you're trying to feel my biceps.

 

[rrryanc]

There are so many reasons for a missing dollar, that the message is lost without some direction. Feedback is just as, if not more, valuable than the missing dollar. So I do both.

Hilarious, but what am I supposed to do beyond not shopping there and telling them why? Go punch their lights out?

I suspect that your message would be a lot stronger if delivered in person rather than anonymously via an internet forum. It does come with the risk of being punched, but that's why you lift, right?

I'll remember this the next time you're trying to feel my biceps.

And your calves. Oh wait...

 

[Arbitrator]

I suspect that your message would be a lot stronger if delivered in person rather than anonymously via an internet forum. It does come with the risk of being punched, but that's why you lift, right?

Oh, you were serious. I've told people in person, too. Doesn't get anywhere. It's just the convenience of writing online makes that more common.

Still, I've recognized most people don't give a ****, so aside from mentioning it here and there, I've stopped caring and given up on beer places for the most part.

 

[rrryanc]

Most people don't stop giving them their business. Beer geeks are largely the definition of docile; it's pretty telling when you look at the hostility I'm getting for giving direct feedback. That's why we have so many shops willing to do underhanded things for the extra dollar. They know their customers won't mind.

I'm guilty of this and it drives me nuts. I'm really hoping this market matures to the point where I can ignore the places with ****** service and practices and still get 99% of the taste. Haven't found that consistent Nelson replacement yet.

 

[rrryanc]

Oh, you were serious. I've told people in person, too. Doesn't get anywhere. It's just the convenience of writing online makes that more common.

Still, I've recognized most people don't give a ****, so aside from mentioning it here and there, I've stopped caring and given up on beer places for the most part.

Serious might be a bit of a stretch. I just found the pride in being an internet warrior to be a bit over-the-top when it's a) anonymous and b) largely (completely?) ineffective, so I figured I'd poke fun a bit. The calves comment went too far though, I'll say I'm sorry for that .

 

[AptosBeerDrinker]

Most people don't stop giving them their business. Beer geeks are largely the definition of docile; it's pretty telling when you look at the hostility I'm getting for giving direct feedback. That's why we have so many shops willing to do underhanded things for the extra dollar. They know their customers won't mind.

I can't tell you how many conversations I've had with people about Perry's where they said, "Yeah, he's kind of a dick, but..."

Same with City Beer Store.

People do lots of stupid **** with their money imo but it's not my money so I ultimately don't really care.

 

[Arbitrator]

Serious might be a bit of a stretch. I just found the pride in being an internet warrior to be a bit over-the-top when it's a) anonymous and b) largely (completely?) ineffective, so I figured I'd poke fun a bit. The calves comment went too far though, I'll say I'm sorry for that .

I meant serious as in, “Oh, you actually think I just do this anonymously on the internet.”

Most of the stories I linked happened before you and I met, back in 2009-2011 and maybe 2012. I did my fair share of in-person constructive criticism (which got me banned or otherwise snubbed from cool releases/favors). A beer buyer shattered two [empty] bottles of Cantillon in my face a few years ago at Good Karma. So yeah, I’ve done my in-person stuff.

In the past few years (which is when we’ve known each other), I’ve calmed down a lot. Though you’re right that the 2-3 cases where I mouthed off (like causing Perry’s to lose their Russian River account), it was anonymously. One, because it’s easier to fire off a review during lunch; and two, because I’ve recognized that most beer geeks don’t give a **** if their store pulls a fast one, and if I’m not even that much into beer anymore, why should I?

I see people bitching all the time about how beer was so much better 7-8 years ago, and absolutely no one makes an effort to do something about it — like reporting freshness dates, e-mailing breweries to suggest they expand to CA, getting places like RR to close accounts with ****** stores and start supporting great new ones. These are low-cost ways to get the market moving a bit faster, but instead, people do nothing except, well, bitch about it on the internet. Which is the problem you have with me.

People do lots of stupid **** with their money imo but it's not my money so I ultimately don't really care.

I get that. I think apathy is really common in the beer scene.

 

[AndresR]

There are so many reasons for a missing dollar, that the message is lost without some direction. Feedback is just as, if not more, valuable than the missing dollar. So I do both.

Given the film analogy I'm gonna go with Alvin and the Chipmunks. There are like 3 or 4 of these ****** films, with another on the way. Why? The Feedback has always been just.....awful, to put it lightly. But, the bottom line of the amount of dollars the consumer votes with says they still want more. I have no idea where I'm going with but I'm sure someone can pull some meaning out of it.

God Dammit those films suck.

 

[AptosBeerDrinker]

I meant serious as in, “Oh, you actually think I just do this anonymously on the internet.”

Most of the stories I linked happened before you and I met, back in 2009-2011 and maybe 2012. I did my fair share of in-person constructive criticism (which got me banned or otherwise snubbed from cool releases/favors). A beer buyer shattered two [empty] bottles of Cantillon in my face a few years ago at Good Karma. So yeah, I’ve done my in-person stuff.

In the past few years (which is when we’ve known each other), I’ve calmed down a lot. Though you’re right that the 2-3 cases where I mouthed off (like causing Perry’s to lose their Russian River account), it was anonymously. One, because it’s easier to fire off a review during lunch; and two, because I’ve recognized that most beer geeks don’t give a **** if their store pulls a fast one, and if I’m not even that much into beer anymore, why should I?

I see people bitching all the time about how beer was so much better 7-8 years ago, and absolutely no one makes an effort to do something about it — like reporting freshness dates, e-mailing breweries to suggest they expand to CA, getting places like RR to close accounts with ****** stores and start supporting great new ones. These are low-cost ways to get the market moving a bit faster, but instead, people do nothing except, well, bitch about it on the internet. Which is the problem you have with me.



I get that. I think apathy is really common in the beer scene.

I have a family to be somewhat responsible for so yeah, I only have so many ***** to give about what a bunch of strangers do with their money. I'm involved in the "beer scene" for one reason and one reason only, to enjoy myself. Furthermore, I find that if you go looking for drama at every turn you'll find it so I just don't look for it. If that makes me apathetic, so be it.

 

[bsmithinc]

Prairie events tonight at Caps & Taps! 5 taps, plus bottles (I think a bomb! plus another variant & Eliza5Beth) also theres some other great beer on there if Prairie isn't your thing

 

[Arbitrator]

I have a family to be somewhat responsible for so yeah, I only have so many ***** to give about what a bunch of strangers do with their money. I'm involved in the "beer scene" for one reason and one reason only, to enjoy myself. Furthermore, I find that if you go looking for drama at every turn you'll find it so I just don't look for it. If that makes me apathetic, so be it.

You sound almost irritated to admit something like that.

Yeah, everyone has more important things to worry about. At the same time, we're a group of people who:

- spend almost every weekend at a local brewery
- spend hundreds if not thousands of dollars at releases
- ship beer to people we've never met in person
- argue frantically about trade values
- travel for beercations and beer fests
- rent houses / cars for above
- post on TalkBeer all day
- check into Untappd / review on BA
- have social lives intertwined closely with people we've met through beer

So when someone tells me "It's just beer," I have to bite back a little laughter. No, for the dude who gets 24-packs of Blue Moon at Costco, "it's just beer." For the rest of us, we give some huge *****, even if the relative degree differs a little. My getting into an argument about whether it's ethical to mark up a charity beer or making a few FB posts that cost Perry's their RR account doesn't constitute some extreme increase of effort beyond that list above.

Oh, and it's totally incorrect to say "so many ***** to give about what a bunch of strangers do with their money." It's not like I'm being a beer activist for some store in bumfuck Michigan. I'm actively doing it for stores I'd like to patronize, or stores I won't patronize because they're pulling **** that will put stores I want to patronize, out of business. This directly affects where I can/will spend my money and what beer I can buy. To me, it's natural to get involved in something that matters to me. I can see that's not true for everyone.

EDIT: just added trades in there, too

 

[Sage1]

- spend almost every weekend at a local brewery

That’s all?

 

[AptosBeerDrinker]

- have social lives intertwined closely with people we've met through beer

That's the only one that applies to me personally but I realize I'm in the minority.

 

[tosh1]

You sound almost irritated to admit something like that.

Yeah, everyone has more important things to worry about. At the same time, we're a group of people who:

- spend almost every weekend at a local brewery
- spend hundreds if not thousands of dollars at releases
- ship beer to people we've never met in person
- argue frantically about trade values
- travel for beercations and beer fests
- rent houses / cars for above
- post on TalkBeer all day
- check into Untappd / review on BA
- have social lives intertwined closely with people we've met through beer

So when someone tells me "It's just beer," I have to bite back a little laughter. No, for the dude who gets 24-packs of Blue Moon at Costco, "it's just beer." For the rest of us, we give some huge *****, even if the relative degree differs a little. My getting into an argument about whether it's ethical to mark up a charity beer or making a few FB posts that cost Perry's their RR account doesn't constitute some extreme increase of effort beyond that list above.

Oh, and it's totally incorrect to say "so many ***** to give about what a bunch of strangers do with their money." It's not like I'm being a beer activist for some store in bumfuck Michigan. I'm actively doing it for stores I'd like to patronize, or stores I won't patronize because they're pulling **** that will put stores I want to patronize, out of business. This directly affects where I can/will spend my money and what beer I can buy. To me, it's natural to get involved in something that matters to me. I can see that's not true for everyone.

EDIT: just added trades in there, too

That is a @patrick post if I ever read one. Needs more likes.

 

[burgundysmoke]

Wasn't gonna say it before but after that post...dude sounds like the beer police. And, well, we all know what people say about them.

 

[RyanG1]

Wasn't gonna say it before but after that post...dude sounds like the beer police. And, well, we all know what people say about them.

They like beer, not donuts?

 

[Arbitrator]

They like beer, not donuts?

2edgy4me

Anybody who is happy that Perry's was reselling SARA out the back isn't someone whose opinion I care about, anyway.

/Really looking forward to the movie though

 

[litheum94]

I know I could probably Google search this, but I'm lazy: are Pizza Port cans in the North Bay yet? I have a request to bring some back with me when I visit in July.

 

[RyanG1]

I know I could probably Google search this, but I'm lazy: are Pizza Port cans in the North Bay yet? I have a request to bring some back with me when I visit in July.

They have been. Usually see them at one of the Wine Club location(s).

 

[bdogg1]

I know I could probably Google search this, but I'm lazy: are Pizza Port cans in the North Bay yet? I have a request to bring some back with me when I visit in July.

I do believe beer craft carries some of them. Not all though

 

[litheum94]

I do believe beer craft carries some of them. Not all though

Perfect. Since I probably won't have time to actually go to Cellarmaker (stupid extended family wanting to spend time with me), I was planning on stopping in to see what they have on tap anyway.

 

[Arbitrator]

Perfect. Since I probably won't have time to actually go to Cellarmaker (stupid extended family wanting to spend time with me), I was planning on stopping in to see what they have on tap anyway.

Where are you staying and what dates will you be in town? If you're close to me, I can goandpickupCellarmaker for you. Bro.

 

[bdogg1]

Where are you staying and what dates will you be in town? If you're close to me, I can goandpickupCellarmaker for you. Bro.

Perfect. Since I probably won't have time to actually go to Cellarmaker (stupid extended family wanting to spend time with me), I was planning on stopping in to see what they have on tap anyway.

I can probably help out as well. If you are looking to just drink CM, i would suggest Beercraft. They ALWAYS have CM goodness on.

 

[litheum94]

Where are you staying and what dates will you be in town? If you're close to me, I can goandpickupCellarmaker for you. Bro.

Couch surfing, spending most of our time with our friends in Santa Rosa. I'll be there July 21-27 (or somewhere around there). Thanks for the offer, but don't go out of your way or anything.

 

[litheum94]

I can probably help out as well. If you are looking to just drink CM, i would suggest Beercraft. They ALWAYS have CM goodness on.

My above post was kind of vague, but I was trying to say that I was planning on stopping by BC for Cellarmaker anyway, since they always seem to have it on tap.

 

[Arbitrator]

Couch surfing, spending most of our time with our friends in Santa Rosa. I'll be there July 21-27 (or somewhere around there). Thanks for the offer, but don't go out of your way or anything.

Ah, bummer. I work close to Cellarmaker. If you were in East Bay then it would be no issue (on my way home). Santa Rosa is unfortunately out of the cards. But hey, you'll get to drink more Pliny than I've seen in a year...

 

[bdogg1]

My above post was kind of vague, but I was trying to say that I was planning on stopping by BC for Cellarmaker anyway, since they always seem to have it on tap.

AH gotcha. Yeah they usually get their new releases and put them on the same day as CM.

 

[abecall98]

Prairie events tonight at Caps & Taps! 5 taps, plus bottles (I think a bomb! plus another variant & Eliza5Beth) also theres some other great beer on there if Prairie isn't your thing

I believe next week they are having a Perennial tap event too. Should be another good night out there. Gotta love Caps.

 

[litheum94]

Ah, bummer. I work close to Cellarmaker. If you were in East Bay then it would be no issue (on my way home). Santa Rosa is unfortunately out of the cards. But hey, you'll get to drink more Pliny than I've seen in a year...

I'm going for Row 2. I'll be crushing that all week.