bad yeast?

[old rock & roll brewer]

OK, I'm back again with a similar problem I had back in Dec. I'm starting to think it's due to bad yeast. I used the same liquid amber malt & brand of dry ale yeast this time as back then and the result is pretty much the same. I boiled the wort extra long this time, about 1 1/2 hrs, and was extremely meticulous about cleanliness. As then, I used 1 oz of Fuggles for flavoring hops, 1/2 oz of Cascade to finish and ginger root as a spice (ginger ale!). I did this brew a few years ago with great success. The only thing I did differently this batch was I followed the recommendation on the yeast packet for activating it rather than what the brew guide book said to do. As happened ast Dec. it is taking a very long time for the yeast to activate in the wort. In fact, it is now even longer as nothing has happened after 3 days. Last Dec. it kicked in about 48 hrs after adding the yeast but the action was rather lethargic & very brief. I took the advice given here to try & save it but it turned out really bad. I'm fearful that I'll be pouring this batch down the drain too.

FYI, I'm using food-grade plastic carboys (as I have for many years with success) and presently the temp in my cellar is about 60. What about adding different yeast to this batch if nothing happens in another day or two? Would I have to boil it & cool it again? Or is this a lost cause? It is very discouraging to have two bad batches in a row. Any advice appreciated.

 

[Darth Konvel]

If I were in your shoes, I'd throw a couple more packs of dry yeast in there and think about moving it to a warmer part of the house, at least until it gets going.

If you really want to make sure there's nothing alive in there, I guess you could throw a couple campden tabs in there, wait a day, then repitch, but I've never tried it.

 

[Walker]

I'm using food-grade plastic carboys

Where do you find these? I'd be interested in picking up a small one for experimental batches.

-walker

 

[old rock & roll brewer]

I got my plastic carboys many years ago from a home brew supply called BIERHAUS INTERNATIONAL INC. 3723 W. 12th ST. ERIE, PA. 16505. I have no idea if they are still in business or not. They have always worked well for me. I've never graduated to glass, though I have been advised to do so by many more experienced brewers. You tend to stay with what you're familiar with. Plus, I just don't want to spend the $$ when these work great. Until now, of course, but I think it's a yeast problem.

 

[DeRoux's Broux]

if it happens in subsequent batches.............

 

[Mikey]

If your ambient temperature is really 60F, then it's pretty tough for any ale yeast to get going. Try putting it in a warmer place for a while and see what happens

 

[Kaiser]

60F does indeed sound fairly low for ale yeast. And how did you aerate the wort?

Kai

 

[old rock & roll brewer]

Things that make you go "Hmmm..." I decided to move the brew to a warmer climate as suggested here & made an interesting discovery. Though I've seen no action in the air lock, when I took it out of the hole on the lid for the move I was able to look inside & smell it (the plastic carboy is opaque & does not allow exterior viewing). Lo & behold, I was pleasantly surprised to see there is foam on top of the brew (not a lot but it's there), the aroma is delicious and definately smells of alcohol. I also found that the lid was not completely sealed in one spot, which could explain the lack of activity in the airlock. However, one would think there would be at least SOME action. Again, very lethargic like the other batch I made in Dec. The difference, though, is that this batch smells really good. When I checked the gravity, there was quite a head in the vial & it took quite a while to settle down so I could see the reading. Right now it's 1.015. There are a lot of white particles floating around in it, which I assume is the yeast and that it will eventually settle (I did use irish moss & was able to leave most of the trub behind). I was also surprised to see that the color of the brew is much lighter than I expected it to be, again more like a lager than an amber ale.

So, all this raises a few questions. Is it possible that the cool evironment of my cellar has simply caused the brew to ferment very slowly, more like a lager? And, if so, should I leave it where it is & allow it to just finish in that evironment until the gravity stops dropping, bottle as usual & see what the result is? Or should I move it to a warmer place as suggested by Mikey? If I leave it where it is I'm assuming the fermenting / settling will take much longer than an ale usually takes. Would that be a correct assumption?

Thanks again for all the suggestions. It looks like there is hope of saving this batch. It sure is behaving much differently than any other batch I've ever brewed, though.

 

[Walker]

TI was also surprised to see that the color of the brew is much lighter than I expected it to be, again more like a lager than an amber ale.

The color of the beer is always misleading until you get it into a pint glass.

It will appear darker in the fermenter (because you are staring into the depths of a large volume of beer).

It will appear lighter in the siphon hose or sample tube (because you are staring into a very small/shallow volume of beer).

It will appear somewhere in the middle of these extremes once you have it in a glass.

So, all this raises a few questions. Is it possible that the cool evironment of my cellar has simply caused the brew to ferment very slowly, more like a lager?

Yup. The lower temps will cause the yeast to work sluggishly. They will still get the job done, but it will take longer to do it.

And, if so, should I leave it where it is & allow it to just finish in that evironment until the gravity stops dropping, bottle as usual & see what the result is? Or should I move it to a warmer place as suggested by Mikey?

You can certainly move it to a warmer place if you want to accelerate things and get the batch finished faster, but you could also leave it right where it is. Either way, your beer will probably be excellent.

If I leave it where it is I'm assuming the fermenting / settling will take much longer than an ale usually takes. Would that be a correct assumption?

Yes, indeed.

-walker

 

[old rock & roll brewer]

Hey, Walker, thanks for the quick response. I think I'm inclined to leave where it is rather than change the climate & possibly upset the yeast or something. I'm in no hurry. Besides, I don't really have any place else to put it where it's dark most of the time. I'll just keep checking the gravity every few days. It's aleady quite a bit lower than the last batch was at this point so it seems to be heading in the right direction. The last one didn't change much past 1.010 and it was lousy. I am a bit concerned about the yeast settling completely in the chilly environment of my cellar but I guess if I wait long enough it will.