Attenuation problems

[WildGingerBrewing]

My attenuation sucks! I have noticed that when I use Safale S-05 I get 73%-77%. But when I use a Wyeast Activator smack pack, I am only getting 63%-65%. What am I doing wrong? What can I do to better it? I do not make starters for either yeast and I do not re-hydrate the S-05. My efficeincy is 74%-76% and my SG and OG come out right where they should, but my FG is always high with a smack pack. I also control my fermentation temps so I know it's not too hot or too cold. Any suggestions?

 

[Walker]

when I use a Wyeast Activator smack pack, I am only getting 63%-65%. What am I doing wrong?

I think you answered your own question.

I do not make starters

Make a starter with the liquid yeast.

 

[WildGingerBrewing]

Could it really be that simple?!?!?! You know I like to make everything much more difficult than it needs to be!

 

[electric_beer]

Could it really be that simple?!?!?! You know I like to make everything much more difficult than it needs to be!

I'd put good money that it really is that simple! Those smack packs are significantly LESS viable yeast then dry.

http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html

 

[WildGingerBrewing]

Well heck. That's easy! I've been saying I wanted to start making starters, so I guess now I truly have a reason. Thanks guys!

 

[ian-atx]

the amount of yeast you are pitching from a 11.5 gram packet of dry yeast is more (roughly twice I think) than what you are pitching from an activator pack (or whitelabs vial).

use the yeast pitch rate calculator on mrmalty.com to know how much yeast to pitch.

EDIT:wow, missed the conversation on that one. took too long to reply =)

 

[Pappers_]

Jason, are you comparing similar strains of yeast? For instance, Fermentis US-05 is comparable to White Labs 001. I don't use Wyeast so can't say which of their products is comparable.

And making a yeast starter when using liquid yeast is always a good practice, as suggested above.

 

[WildGingerBrewing]

Jason, are you comparing similar strains of yeast? For instance, Fermentis US-05 is comparable to White Labs 001. I don't use Wyeast so can't say which of their products is comparable.

And making a yeast starter when using liquid yeast is always a good practice, as suggested above.

Not comparing similar strains, no. I use a different smack pack almost every brew, since I am still a noob and playing with flavors and things. But I have used S-05 on a number of occasions. Keeping track of all of my data made it easy to go back and look. So all of my S-05 beers have been fine and all of my Wyeast beers have had a high FG. i just put on my sherlock holmes hat and figured it out!

 

[Bottenbrew]

I had a similar problem, just started making starters 3 batches ago, HUGE difference. Hopefully that straightens it out for you like it did for me.

 

[Calder]

I love liquid yeasts.

I never trust the instructions that it is OK for an average beer. I always make a starter. You never know how it has been handled, or how viable the cells are. Making a starter, will give every liquid yeast a good start.

Try reusing some of the cake off the beers. It's a good active yeast, a lot more than in a smack pak, and should give you a good ferment.

 

[WildGingerBrewing]

I have never re-used yeast before and am a little intimidated by trying it. I think I will eventually, but probably not in the next couple of months. I will however be making my first starter on the next beer I make! Then in a couple of months, I will post a new thread on how to re-use yeast

Thanks for all of the replies. It's nice to know that a simple solution that I had been wanting to try is probably the fix!

 

[Pappers_]

Not comparing similar strains, no. I use a different smack pack almost every brew, since I am still a noob and playing with flavors and things. But I have used S-05 on a number of occasions. Keeping track of all of my data made it easy to go back and look. So all of my S-05 beers have been fine and all of my Wyeast beers have had a high FG. i just put on my sherlock holmes hat and figured it out!

I'm sure that having more and healthier yeast when you use liquid yeast will help with your problem.

About the strains of yeast, though, US-05 (and WL001) are the most highly attenuating yeast I use. Any other ale yeast will be less attenuating, in my experience.

 

[MikeRoBrew1]

Please explain what term of efficiency you are talking about? Can't be mash effeciency??

There are two Wyeast options, an Activator and a Propegator. Are my simple ales (under 1.06) suffering for lack of a starter? Sure tastes great to me. "Old or mishandled yeast" is not something to be worried about imho. With a normal starting OG they should rapidly multiply to normal levels on their own with no problems.

the Activator™ has a minimum of 100 billion cells of pure, ready-to-pitch yeast, plus an internal nutrient packet. The Activator™ is designed to inoculate five gallons of wort (up to 1.060 SG) providing the pitching rate recommended by professional brewers.

The PROPAGATOR™ has a minimum of 25 billion cells of pure yeast, plus an internal nutrient packet. The PROPAGATOR™ is designed to inoculate a one liter starter* before adding to five gallons of wort (up to 1.060 SG).

 

[WildGingerBrewing]

I am not talking about efficiency at all. Only yeast attenuaion. My beers, using a Wyeast Activator with no starter, finish with a higher than expected FG. The efficiency is fine I was just looking for ways to improve attenuation.

 

[rjwhite41]

Please explain what term of efficiency you are talking about? Can't be mash effeciency??

There are two Wyeast options, an Activator and a Propegator. Are my simple ales (under 1.06) suffering for lack of a starter? Sure tastes great to me. "Old or mishandled yeast" is not something to be worried about imho. With a normal starting OG they should rapidly multiply to normal levels on their own with no problems.

the Activator™ has a minimum of 100 billion cells of pure, ready-to-pitch yeast, plus an internal nutrient packet. The Activator™ is designed to inoculate five gallons of wort (up to 1.060 SG) providing the pitching rate recommended by professional brewers.

The PROPAGATOR™ has a minimum of 25 billion cells of pure yeast, plus an internal nutrient packet. The PROPAGATOR™ is designed to inoculate a one liter starter* before adding to five gallons of wort (up to 1.060 SG).

Although rare I have had one Wyeast smack pack that wasn't viable. And just because it says that is the proper pitching rate on the back of the pack doesn't make it so. For one, everyday that the yeast is sitting on a shelf it has fewer and fewer viable yeast cells. So, the 100 billion they claim may or may not be in there. If you made a starter then you would see that the difference is night and day.

 

[MikeRoBrew1]

I am not talking about efficiency at all. Only yeast attenuaion.

DOH it was in the thread title man how did I miss that. Thanks.