Anyone Looking For A Project?

[LakesideBrewing]

Hi,

I've been brewing for over 20 years now but I have never really worried that much about water treatments. I filter my municipal water and just use that. My beers taste great! I mainly brew Belgian styles but have a few great tasting DIPA beers as well. I would like some help with the DIPA's water. I would really like to take the time and understand water chemistry and figure this out on my own, but my head is spinning. I am looking to really 'soften the palate' on my DIPA's (think Hill Farmstead). Here are some vitals:

My water report.

14# Pearl
1# white wheat

Mash temp 150
Batch sparge

Collect 7.5 gallons for boil.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!

-Mike

 

[mabrungard]

That water report is missing the vital components to brewers: calcium, magnesium, and alkalinity (aka: bicarbonate). However since they also provide the typical TDS value, you can get an educated guess about what the values might be. To get the water to balance ionically, the calcium might be around 25 ppm and the bicarbonate around 80 ppm. This is a nice starting point for brewing. For most brewing, a boost in the calcium content and a neutralization of the bicarbonate with an acid addition is needed.

I can see why you can have good results with this water. However, I can also see that a couple of educated modifications to your water would put you over the top.

My guesses are probably helpful, but tracking down the Ca, Mg, and HCO3 values from either the water company or your own testing would confirm things.

Enjoy!

 

[LakesideBrewing]

My guesses are probably helpful, but tracking down the Ca, Mg, and HCO3 values from either the water company or your own testing would confirm things.

Enjoy!

Thanks for the reply! I'll definitely contact my water company and find out the missing info. But, in the meantime, I'd love to hear your guesses...

Thanks,
Mike

 

[ajdelange]

You are trying to transition from beers that are good, even very good, to those that have what I call the 'Ah' factor (that's what the drinker says when he tastes one). You cannot do that without considering the water. There are two parts to this. One is to get mash pH correct. That can be done through science and is the easier part as you can easily measure mash pH and almost as easily control it by addition of or subtraction of acid (adding base is the same as subtracting acid). Once you have pH down you then turn to trying to find the balance of minerals that give you the flavors you want. This is art and requires brewing batch after batch tweaking this and then that. This is where commercial brewers have it all over us. They may brew the same beer a dozen times in a month and can easily make adjustments small enough that there is no risk in ruining a batch while at the same time they are collecting lots of data on the effects of those changes.

We need to recognize that the two parts are not completely independent of one another. Adding flavorless phosphoric acid to liquor for pH control will give a different beer from one in which highly flavored lactic acid was used and if lactic acid is used one does not get the nuanced flavors that he gets of that lactic acid comes from sauermalz. I a brewer decides he wants more sulfate and gets it from gypsum he is adding calcium and calcium has a small effect on mash pH.

Etc. Lots of etc's in fact.

My personal experience, which may be of no use whatsoever, is that keeping the overall mineral content down and controlling mash pH with sauermalz got me the Ah factor but there is more to it than just managing water. I find that now that I am brewing less frequently I am losing my 'touch' even though I use the same water treatment. It is important to stay in practice if you want to keep your skill level up.

 

[LakesideBrewing]

Hi,

Thanks for the info and responses, guys!

Here is the missing info from my water department:

Calcium - 8
Magnesium - 4
Sodium - 12
Sulfate - 3
Chlorides - 3
Alkalinity - 66 (hco3)
PH - 7.6

I'm still reading all these thread on water chemistry but I would really appreciate any help that you guys could give.

Thanks,
-Mike

 

[ajdelange]

Your water is pretty clear save for a little sodium bicarbonate. This modest alkalinity can easily be disposed of by adding 66/5 = 13 mL of normal acid to each gallon of water processed and then treating it as if it were DI. Or you could dilute it 1:1 RO:Tap or 2:1 and have the alkalinity down to 33 or 22 ppm which is not anything to worry about. (Is that 66 really bicarbonate or is it real alkalinity - alkalinity is the more useful number as if you give me bicarbonate I have to convert it to akalinity to use it.) You will want to supplement chloride and possibly sulfate depending on the beer. In any event you will, with 1 or 2 to 1 dilution of 13 mL/N acid per gal have something that is suited for use with the recommendations of the Primer. Or you can use one of the spreadsheets/calculators that are offered on the internet.

 

[LakesideBrewing]

Calcium - 8
Magnesium - 4
Sodium - 12
Sulfate - 3
Chlorides - 3
Alkalinity - 66 (hco3)
PH - 7.6

Wow, I wrote down the wrong numbers! :smack:
Here is the corrected info:
Calcium - 9
Magnesium - 3
Sodium - 33
Sulfate - 21
Chlorides - 40
Alkalinity - 27 (caco3)
PH - 7.7

Does this change your original opinion?

 

[ajdelange]

Only slightly. The biggest number is not as big as it was and it is for an ion with a positive effect in nearly all cases. With an alkalinity as low as 27 you really don't need to do anything to this water, other than augment calcium and, if you want it, sulfate (and add some base as may be necessary for darker beers). Some might argue that 33 is getting up there for the sodium and advise a dilution of 1:1 to cut that in half. This would be a perfectly reasonable thing to do especially if you have a ready supply of RO water.

 

[LakesideBrewing]

Only slightly. The biggest number is not as big as it was and it is for an ion with a positive effect in nearly all cases. With an alkalinity as low as 27 you really don't need to do anything to this water, other than augment calcium and, if you want it, sulfate (and add some base as may be necessary for darker beers). Some might argue that 33 is getting up there for the sodium and advise a dilution of 1:1 to cut that in half. This would be a perfectly reasonable thing to do especially if you have a ready supply of RO water.

Cool! Thanks so much!

-Mike