And this is why im still a Newb!

[HomeDrewBrew]

I bottled my 5Gallon batch of C3C today and i measured a little over 4oz of table sugar for priming but i ended with a little over 4 gallons bottled losing more than i anticipated to trub and so on...
Soo am i in for Bottle Bombs or am i safe?.
Should i wait a week then pop them then bench cap all again?.
Thanks

 

[ZebulonBrewer]

You'll be fine. Cream Ale's usually call for a higher carbonation anyway, and some 'old timers' just do 1 oz of sugar per gallon of beer anyway.

 

[emr454]

I think you'll be fine. Most people use a rule of thumb of 1 oz of corn sugar per gallon of beer. There are also other online calculators that can help you determine how much sugar to use to reach a certain level of carbonation, here are a couple:

http://www.northernbrewer.com/learn/resources/priming-sugar-calculator/
http://www.brewersfriend.com/beer-priming-calculator/

If you're using standard brown beer bottles, they should withstand carbonation to most styles of beer, with the exception of some highly carbed belgians, etc. Seeing that C3C is a cream ale, I think there's nothing to worry about.

 

[MaxStout]

4 oz in 4 gal is not a problem. But going forward, it's best to make calculations based on expected net beer volume, taking trub loss into account.

 

[HomeDrewBrew]

Thanks all for reassurance!.

 

[daksin]

I usually wait until the beer is in the bottling bucket before I measure out my sugar. You can make gallon marks on the bucket and estimate from there!

 

[55x11]

I usually wait until the beer is in the bottling bucket before I measure out my sugar. You can make gallon marks on the bucket and estimate from there!

But then you have a problem of adding sugar water last which may not be mixed well. (Or oxidizing beer by trying to mix it). I think guesstimating your beer batch size is better. If you are 10-20% either way it will still be ok.

 

[MindenMan]

I agree that 4 oz of priming sugar for 4 gallons of ale should not cause bottle bombs. Your beer might end up as fizzy as store-bought yellow fizzy beer, and since that is what most of us grew up on, it should be no big deal, right? I got into the habit of mixing my water/primer into a volume that could be easily divided by 5 or 10, as I have in the past over primed by not calculating for trub loss.

 

[ZebulonBrewer]

But then you have a problem of adding sugar water last which may not be mixed well. (Or oxidizing beer by trying to mix it). I think guesstimating your beer batch size is better. If you are 10-20% either way it will still be ok.

You shouldn't rely on racking on top of the priming sugar solution to solely mix it with the beer. I've had issues with getting uniform carbonation when doing it that way. I always sanitize my paddle and (very gently!!! Oxygen is the enemy!) stir the beer after I've siphoned.

That said, I use a 3/8 inch siphon hose that takes a while to do all of the siphoning. I know people who use 1/2 inch hose that (they say) siphons 5 gallons in like a minute. That much faster flow should mix the solution more homogeneously, but I can't say conclusively that it wouldn't need stirred.

 

[andy6026]

I agree with the above poster that suggested racking to the bottling bucket prior to measuring your sugar. While the usual advice is to rack the beer on top of the pre-measured sugar, I always found it difficult to accurately judge how much beer I'd end up with once I took it off the trub. As recommended, be sure to gently mix it in very well, and, something that hasn't been mentioned in this thread yet:

The measuring lines that are factory printed on fermenters and bottling buckets are notoriously inaccurate - sometimes badly off. Be sure to make your own measuring lines on your fermenters and bottling buckets.

 

[Calypso]

The measuring lines that are factory printed on fermenters and bottling buckets are notoriously inaccurate - sometimes badly off. Be sure to make your own measuring lines on your fermenters and bottling buckets.

:smack: That figures. I know what I'm doing tonight!

 

[daksin]

But then you have a problem of adding sugar water last which may not be mixed well. (Or oxidizing beer by trying to mix it). I think guesstimating your beer batch size is better. If you are 10-20% either way it will still be ok.

If your carbonation is 20% off, your 2.5 volume beer is going to be fizzy like a hefeweizen at 3volumes. Anyway, there's no risk of oxidizing your beer if you stir it gently with a sanitizd spoon. Unless you're whipping air into it with a whisk, the surface contact with oxygen isn't going to change appreciably. I've always done it and never once had an issue with oxygen.

 

[Calypso]

If your carbonation is 20% off, your 2.5 volume beer is going to be fizzy like a hefeweizen at 3volumes. Anyway, there's no risk of oxidizing your beer if you stir it gently with a sanitizd spoon. Unless you're whipping air into it with a whisk, the surface contact with oxygen isn't going to change appreciably. I've always done it and never once had an issue with oxygen.

While I don't disagree with you (I add sugar after transferring to the bottling bucket and give it a gentle stir), your math isn't quite right, even though it seems like it should be.

The beer already has CO2 dissolved in it, so even if you added 0 sugar, it would not be 0 volumes of CO2. For example, at 70F, a beer is going to have roughly 0.8 volumes of CO2. If you're trying to get it to 2.5, that's a difference of 1.7, which means missing by +20% would put you at 2.84 (0.8 + 1.7 * 1.2), not 3.0 (2.5 * 1.2).

 

[daksin]

While I don't disagree with you (I add sugar after transferring to the bottling bucket and give it a gentle stir), your math isn't quite right, even though it seems like it should be.

The beer already has CO2 dissolved in it, so even if you added 0 sugar, it would not be 0 volumes of CO2. For example, at 70F, a beer is going to have roughly 0.8 volumes of CO2. If you're trying to get it to 2.5, that's a difference of 1.7, which means missing by +20% would put you at 2.84 (0.8 + 1.7 * 1.2), not 3.0 (2.5 * 1.2).

Quite correct Caught me sleepin'

 

[55x11]

Quite correct Caught me sleepin'

well, my experimentation with different levels of priming tell me that you can easily compensate for a pretty substantial differences in carbonation by altering your pouring technique just a bit (height, angle, closeness to the glass). Obsessing over 10% or even 20% variations in priming are not very meaningful. You are NOT going to have a "bomb" all of a sudden because you overprimed by 20%, as OP did.

Also, if you pour sugar into the wort last, you will probably end up with 20% variation in your bottles anyways. Unless you stir really well, which means you have 50% chance of introducing substantial, taste-detectable amount of oxygen to the wort.

If I were the OP, I'd rather overprime by 10-20% than have variability between bottles or oxygenation.

 

[Calypso]

Also, if you pour sugar into the wort last, you will probably end up with 20% variation in your bottles anyways. Unless you stir really well, which means you have 50% chance of introducing substantial, taste-detectable amount of oxygen to the wort.

If I were the OP, I'd rather overprime by 10-20% than have variability between bottles or oxygenation.

I'd like sources on these numbers. Seriously though, do you really believe that gently stirring your beer is going to introduce substantial oxygen? It's getting exposed to far more during the act of transferring it to the bottle.

 

[55x11]

I'd like sources on these numbers. Seriously though, do you really believe that gently stirring your beer is going to introduce substantial oxygen? It's getting exposed to far more during the act of transferring it to the bottle.

to stir properly it's not just swirling it around in the circle. If you just added sugar from the top, you need up and down stirring as well. That's not easy to accomplish with no risk of oxygenation. Perhaps your technique is better than average, but still. And you need to sterilize that wooden spoon real well too.

You are moving liquids around while filling so why not put sugar in first and avoid the whole mixing afterwards thing?

Getting the right carbonation values *precisely* should not be the highest priority for the beer, that's my point.

 

[HomeDrewBrew]

This thread is really booming! Lol
I have been adding priming sugar to bottling bucket first then rack on top and it stirs itself with the bottling wand and have never had problems.

 

[Calypso]

to stir properly it's not just swirling it around in the circle. If you just added sugar from the top, you need up and down stirring as well. That's not easy to accomplish with no risk of oxygenation. Perhaps your technique is better than average, but still. And you need to sterilize that wooden spoon real well too.

You are moving liquids around while filling so why not put sugar in first and avoid the whole mixing afterwards thing?

Getting the right carbonation values *precisely* should not be the highest priority for the beer, that's my point.

I actually used to do what you suggest - add sugar first, let it mix as the beer siphons in. But after two batches had very uneven carbonation (and one of them had too much priming solution, because there was a lot more trub than I expected), I decided enough was enough. Since switching to measuring and adding priming solution after transferring the beer, I haven't had any such problems.

But, to each their own. That's what homebrewing is all about.

 

[m00ps]

wait is this "spoon" really wooden? Or steel/plastic. I would never use a wooden spoon with my beer since there is really no way to sanitize it well. Microbes can hide it wood for years, just look at the barrel aged sours. And some breweries even hand out oak cubes that have been in their beers to give their house microbes out to people. You could boil it I guess but I wouldnt take the risk. Youd need to boil the entire spoon, handle and all

 

[Calypso]

wait is this "spoon" really wooden? Or steel/plastic. I would never use a wooden spoon with my beer since there is really no way to sanitize it well. Microbes can hide it wood for years, just look at the barrel aged sours. And some breweries even hand out oak cubes that have been in their beers to give their house microbes out to people. You could boil it I guess but I wouldnt take the risk. Youd need to boil the entire spoon, handle and all

Haha, nah, I stir with my big plastic brewing paddle, sanitized with StarSan.

 

[Homercidal]

Don't worry, you don't have to still be a Noob to make mistakes like this. Happened to me recently when I couldn't even remember which batch was the American Lager and which batch was the Saison. Ended up putting the sugar in the wrong batch and putting the wrong caps on.

This is why documenting and labeling are so important.

 

[55x11]

I actually used to do what you suggest - add sugar first, let it mix as the beer siphons in. But after two batches had very uneven carbonation (and one of them had too much priming solution, because there was a lot more trub than I expected), I decided enough was enough. Since switching to measuring and adding priming solution after transferring the beer, I haven't had any such problems.

But, to each their own. That's what homebrewing is all about.

Agreed. By uneven you mean batch to batch, not within the same batch?

I usually can "eyeball" and "guesstimate" the amount of beer I get from carboy pretty precisely - less than 10% error for sure - I have painted lines on the carboy marking the volume.

In my last few batches used from 110g to 140g of corn sugar for ~5-5.5 Gallons of beer and carbonation is consistent and about the same level. Nothing is over carbonated, nothing is under carbonated. I begin to think that (within reason), the precision is overrated - it's more like cooking - while we obsess over exact numbers, experienced cooks just throw "a pinch" of this and some of that, and it all turns out just fine.

I guess if someone wanted to get the best of the two approaches, say you are guessing you will get 5 Gallons of beer and it calls for 120g of bottling sugar. Boil it, then pour about 80% of it in the bucket first, then transfer the beer, angle transfer tube so it mixes well. See how much you got. If you got 4 Gallons, stop. If you got 4.5 Gallons, pour (carefully) 1/2 of remaining solutions. If you got 5 gallons, pour it all. Maybe even make some extra in case you get over your estimate and end up with 5.5 Gallons.

This way most (80%) of your sugar is mixed well thanks to unavoidable transfer disturbance. Yet you can dial CO2 volumes in precisely if that's sort of thing is what keeps you up at night.

 

[andy6026]

Agreed. By uneven you mean batch to batch, not within the same batch?

I usually can "eyeball" and "guesstimate" the amount of beer I get from carboy pretty precisely - less than 10% error for sure - I have painted lines on the carboy marking the volume.

In my last few batches used from 110g to 140g of corn sugar for ~5-5.5 Gallons of beer and carbonation is consistent and about the same level. Nothing is over carbonated, nothing is under carbonated. I begin to think that (within reason), the precision is overrated - it's more like cooking - while we obsess over exact numbers, experienced cooks just throw "a pinch" of this and some of that, and it all turns out just fine.

I guess if someone wanted to get the best of the two approaches, say you are guessing you will get 5 Gallons of beer and it calls for 120g of bottling sugar. Boil it, then pour about 80% of it in the bucket first, then transfer the beer, angle transfer tube so it mixes well. See how much you got. If you got 4 Gallons, stop. If you got 4.5 Gallons, pour (carefully) 1/2 of remaining solutions. If you got 5 gallons, pour it all. Maybe even make some extra in case you get over your estimate and end up with 5.5 Gallons.

This way most (80%) of your sugar is mixed well thanks to unavoidable transfer disturbance. Yet you can dial CO2 volumes in precisely if that's sort of thing is what keeps you up at night.

That's a great idea. If I hadn't switched to kegs, I'd give that a try!

 

[Calypso]

Agreed. By uneven you mean batch to batch, not within the same batch?

...

I guess if someone wanted to get the best of the two approaches, say you are guessing you will get 5 Gallons of beer and it calls for 120g of bottling sugar. Boil it, then pour about 80% of it in the bucket first, then transfer the beer, angle transfer tube so it mixes well. See how much you got. If you got 4 Gallons, stop. If you got 4.5 Gallons, pour (carefully) 1/2 of remaining solutions. If you got 5 gallons, pour it all. Maybe even make some extra in case you get over your estimate and end up with 5.5 Gallons.

This way most (80%) of your sugar is mixed well thanks to unavoidable transfer disturbance. Yet you can dial CO2 volumes in precisely if that's sort of thing is what keeps you up at night.

No no, within the same batch. Some were overcarbed and some were under.

That's not a bad idea. I might give that a try!

 

[sburnt]

Not that you asked for this advice, per se -- but no matter how careful I am in calculating the proper amount of priming solution or how confident I am, I always put my bottled beer in a cardboard case and put something heavy on top until it's complete and I am sure it's not going to explode... just to minimize the likelihood of getting glass shards everywhere in case I happen to get bottle bombs. Sorry if this is off-topic.