Alright, I need some advice...old DME?

[Evan!]

Well I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't.

I was using corn sugar to bottle carbonate, but I wasn't liking the texture of the carbonation, so I switched back to DME, because a friend gave me like 20 one-pound bags of laaglander DME. He said it wasn't new, but not too old. So I used it to prime my Wit and Hefe a few weeks ago.

It's still uncarbonated as of now.

My only thought is that the DME was old, and thus, it wasn't suitable for bottle fermentation.

Is this plausible? What should I do now? Carb-drops? I've never used them before. I'm just pissed off, and I refuse to lose 10 gallons of excellent beer!

 

[rdwj]

Old wouldn't cause the fermentable sugar to go away.

 

[Cheesefood]

Takes more than a week to carbonate. Wait two more weeks.

 

[the_bird]

Remember, Laaglander isn't nearly as fermentable as most other DMEs (got lots more dextrins by design), so that may be slowing you down and at the end, you'll probably have less carbonation than you expected.

There's no reason for the DME to go "bad" though, unless it's spoiled.

 

[Desert_Sky]

I have DME I keep in the freezer thats over a year now. I keep it sealed and dry and it still works great for my starters

 

[ColoradoXJ13]

Papazian mentions in his second book that yeast have a much easier time fermenting corn sugar due to the non-requirement for oxygen (which fermented beer is low on) versus DME which having oxygen helps, not that you want to oxygenate...just give it more time, they will take care of it, and store at 65*F or so.

 

[Evan!]

I bottled nearly 3 weeks ago. They all have a slight hiss when I pop the top, but no carbo.

Believe me, I wouldn't be asking for help if it had only been a week. I'm just a little alarmed because the level of carbonation has been pretty steady for the past couple of weeks---and in the 30-some batches I've done, the only time beer that wasn't carbonated after 2 weeks was my Wheat Doppelbock, which never carbonated at all, even to this day, 6 or 7 months later. I just want to avoid a repeat of that episode.

So, even old DME doesn't become less fermentable?

I've tried various things, too. I've swirled the bottles to rouse the yeast...upped the temps in that room into the 80's...but it's been the same for a couple weeks now. So, 3 weeks in bottle...how long should I wait before I should start to worry?

 

[Evan!]

Takes more than a week to carbonate. Wait two more weeks.

Cheese, man, this is me, not some "It's my first batch, HELP!" noob. :cross:

 

[Cheesefood]

Cheese, man, this is me, not some "It's my first batch, HELP!" noob. :cross:

I know. And I too used to freak out about carbonation not being there. Then I'd wait ANOTHER week, and voila.

Things that could be your problem:
1. Poorly mixed priming sugar. Are you testing consecutive bottles?
2. Not enough. What did you brew? How much did you use?
3. Weak Yeast.
4. Temps
5. Too good of clarification
6. Colony Collapse Disorder

Are you getting yeast at the bottom of your bottles?

This is why I kegged. Wasn't worth the wasted bottles in my opinion. You can pour a half-beer from a keg to test carbonation.

 

[olllllo]

6. Colony Collapse Disorder

I can't wait till someone parrots this answer in a month or two.

 

[Evan!]

I know. And I too used to freak out about carbonation not being there. Then I'd wait ANOTHER week, and voila.

Things that could be your problem:
1. Poorly mixed priming sugar. Are you testing consecutive bottles?

I'm taking bottles from both cases. They're all the same. I mixed it quite well, as usual, so I don't think this is the issue.

2. Not enough. What did you brew? How much did you use?

1.25 cups per 5 gallons. Standard issue.

3. Weak Yeast.

I suppose that's possible, but since they were wheats, I bottled them straight from primary, so I ended up picking up some yeast from the cake when I racked to the bottling bucket.

4. Temps

I kept it in the 70's, and upped it to the low 80's just to see if it did anything.

5. Too good of clarification

See #3 above. Even if there was too much clarification in the primary after fermentation ended, I purposely roused the trub with my racking cane so that I could gather more yeast.

6. Colony Collapse Disorder

Say who in the what now?

Are you getting yeast at the bottom of your bottles?

Yep, lots.

This is why I kegged. Wasn't worth the wasted bottles in my opinion. You can pour a half-beer from a keg to test carbonation.

Yeah, I know, but I just can't afford the investment right now.

Thanks for your help. I'll give it another week or two, and keep my fingers crossed. Maybe I'll swirl the bottles again tonight and raise the temps. Again.

So if it never carbonates, do you think it would be wise to, perhaps, uncap the bottle, pour them back into the bottling bucket, mix in some rehydrated dry yeast and some more priming sugar, and rebottle? Or is that insane? Like I said, I refuse to lose 10 gallons of beer.

 

[the_bird]

You sure that the bottles have sealed well? I've had a few where I noticed I could take the cap off with my thumb, they just didn't grab right. You aren't using weird bottles or a new capper, are you?

Pouring the beer into the bottling bucket is a recipe for oxidation; if you DO decide to do anything else, I would be inclined to open the bottles, drop in a carb drop or two, and maybe a couple granules of dry yeast, then re-cap. Still, I'm thinking that the Laaglander is just taking a long time because it isn't terribly fermentable.

 

[uglygoat]

i personally would give the beer one month in the bottles, then check them.

 

[Evan!]

You sure that the bottles have sealed well? I've had a few where I noticed I could take the cap off with my thumb, they just didn't grab right. You aren't using weird bottles or a new capper, are you?

Pouring the beer into the bottling bucket is a recipe for oxidation; if you DO decide to do anything else, I would be inclined to open the bottles, drop in a carb drop or two, and maybe a couple granules of dry yeast, then re-cap. Still, I'm thinking that the Laaglander is just taking a long time because it isn't terribly fermentable.

Nah, same old bottles, same old capper...and like I said, I do still get a hiss when I open the bottles.

I'm hoping you're right on the laaglander, Bird...

 

[Evan!]

i personally would give the beer one month in the bottles, then check them.

I've been checking them weekly. We'll see what happens next week I guess.

 

[Desert_Sky]

and like I said, I do still get a hiss when I open the bottles.

sounds to me like you're well on your way. Give it another week.....maybe 2

 

[jdoiv]

Nah, same old bottles, same old capper...and like I said, I do still get a hiss when I open the bottles.

I'm hoping you're right on the laaglander, Bird...

The hiss you hear could also be the difference in barometric pressure from the day you bottled. If you see the CO2 gas swirling around the bottle neck, then you've got at least some carbonation. I'm with Bird and think it's Laaglander. I would also suggest giving it a few more weeks and as a last resort getting some of the little carb tablets.

 

[Evan!]

Yeah, I see the co2 swirling, so it's not just the pressure dif.

Man, I hope you guys are right...

 

[Zymurgrafi]

I wil say from experience I used to use dme exclusively. It takes a bit longer than corn sugar. Maybe that is why the carbonation is smoother?

Also, something to think about next time. Weigh the dme rather than scoop with a measuring cup. I am not sure about this, a wild guess, but maybe, just maybe, age could have had an eefect in that depending on storage conditions there could have been axcessive moisture absorbed into the dme from the air, thus your 1.25 cups may have been more like 1.125 or less...

I also like the laaglander theory. If it is less fermentable as most seem to agree there would be less carbonation. Good luck don't give up on it

 

[casebrew]

I've had probs carbing this winter. Last couple batches I use Cal-V, a hot weahter yeast. No carbonation until I warmed up the bottles by moving them inside, where I had fermented them. So, adequite sugar, time,... leaves temps?