all my beer taste the same

[darby_ross]

I leave my batches in the primary for 2 weeks then keg. Roughly 4 days in keg before drinking. Normally when I bottle they stay in there 2 weeks before drinking. I think im gonna brew a smaller all grain batch(biab) and see if that helps. The only problem is that its not every batch that this happens too. I would say about every 3 out of 5 batches has that taste. So i may have to do multiple attempts at this to determine if thats the problem.

 

[fearwig]

Really ? Yes and they filter out the chlorine too ! Guess you didn't know that.

He has also switched sanitizers

Cheers

In His OP He stated that he has used bottled water (thus eliminating the chlorine) and still has the same taste.

Cracks me up how many have said chlorine.

Cheers

We ought to hold a contest to see if anyone can actually work more unnecessary confrontation into these posts, just as an exercise or something.

Anyway, if someone says "My beer tastes medicinal and astringent" people are going to say chlorine. There could be a number of ways that gets in his beer, but it's an obvious first suspect to eliminate. Bottled water may be more or less dechlorinated, but you don't know what you're getting. Just about all water has some chloride even without treatment, and some bottled water is tap water that is very, very slightly treated. I would not be amazed at all to find bottled water with high chloramines, especially store brand stuff.

Note he also said he gets this in bottling, though he doesn't say whether he's force carbing and bottling with a gun. If he's priming, then carbonic acid is out.

He says he's had ingredients from more than one source, so my other theory (bad LME) seems weak.

I think it's down to RO. It's not much more than bottled. Give it a try.

 

[ross_daly]

I think the most feasible answer so far has been it may be from using an unoxidized aluminum pot. Is that what you brew with?

The carbonic acid theory sounds pretty baseless to me. If you think that's the answer, shake a beer until it's dead flat and see if the off flavor is gone.

As for "extract twang." That has been beaten to death here (with no clear resolution.) I've had bad extract beers and bad all grain beers. There is such a thing as stale dme and lme, but I generally blame the worker who blames his tools. It sounds like he's sourced ingredients from 3x vendors as well. Not likely that he got bad ingredients from all of them.

Here's some more questions for you. I feel like we need more info to pin this down:
What kind of brew kettle do you use?
How do you store your filled bottles? What temp? How much does that fluctuate?
Do other people taste this same taste?
Have you ever submitted a beer to a contest?
What do you use to sanitize / clean your gear?
Do you taste "carbonic acid" in seltzer or soda?
Is there any (even minute) difference between the good and the bad batches in process, season, or ingredients?
What temp do you pitch at, and do you use a properly sized starter?
Could the beer be getting oxidized at any point?

You've definitely changed a lot of things out in trying to fix this off-flavor. Think about the things you haven't changed. When you brew with bottled water, do you still top off with tap water, perhaps? Is your keg/bottle cleaning impeccable?

One last thing is that sometimes it helps to brew with a second set of eyes around. If you have a buddy that brews, have him over and ask him if you're doing anything wrong. Have him taste a "bad" beer and see how he describes it.

I know that seems like a lot of questions, but I don't brew with you and I don't have your tongue or your beer, so it's important to ask a lot to see if anything seems off.

 

[fearwig]

I think if it were the pot, it would be oxidized by now. That always seemed like the biggest red herring to me anyway, but maybe I just haven't experienced it (my aluminum BK is very thoroughly oxidized--all over).

 

[WileECoyote]

I leave my batches in the primary for 2 weeks then keg. Roughly 4 days in keg before drinking. Normally when I bottle they stay in there 2 weeks before drinking. I think im gonna brew a smaller all grain batch(biab) and see if that helps. The only problem is that its not every batch that this happens too. I would say about every 3 out of 5 batches has that taste. So i may have to do multiple attempts at this to determine if thats the problem.

The Bold I highlighted in your reply is the taste problem.

Try your beer 14 days on the gas after kegging and aging/conditioning it for 2 months before you put it on the gas, and I would bet it taste good, beer 4 days on the gas taste nasty.

Only 2 weeks in the bottle carbing up can taste nasty too.

Most 2 week old beer taste nasty too.

Give your beer some time to get good, Try 2 months on one of your bad tasting beers before you drink it and I'll bet it will taste good !

Im sure you are tasting green beer flavor too.

Cheers

 

[WileECoyote]

We ought to hold a contest to see if anyone can actually work more unnecessary confrontation into these posts, just as an exercise or something.

Maybe we should, you'll will be right there too.

Cheers

 

[ross_daly]

I think if it were the pot, it would be oxidized by now. That always seemed like the biggest red herring to me anyway, but maybe I just haven't experienced it (my aluminum BK is very thoroughly oxidized--all over).

I think the big difference is that some people will scrub their alu. pot until it shines with something abrasive. That'll definitely give you a bad flavor. I agree with you though Fearwig, I've used an aluminum pot a LOT and been ok. Just like oxygenating beer when racking to secondary/bottling - it doesn't seem like a big deal until your beer tastes bad.

 

[Wingnutt73]

I have the same issue. I actually created a thread too. And I tried the water and it seem to help but I think it is a combination of the water and temp ( In my case that is). Any who check it out here https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/all-my-brews-taste-same-444012/ maybe there is something there that is not here????

Hope this helps and if you pin it down let me know. Lastly I think the Extract Twang may be a contributing factor. Just my 2 cents.

 

[fearwig]

Even if OP only leaves it in the keg four days before drinking, I don't think he is drinking the whole thing that very day, or even that week. I mean I hope not. So I am 99% sure this is not an issue of how long it's in the keg, because it doesn't need to be in the keg all that long, by any account, for this flavor to diminish even for those who experience it. And then it stands to reason he'd notice the flavor had disappeared after a week or two.

 

[WileECoyote]

Hi darby_ross,

Please read post #35 I am really trying to help you and I'll bet if you try it, it will help.

You don't have anything to loose by trying it, much better than dumping another batch if you ask me.

When I started out I listened to the people saying beer is good at 2 to 3 weeks old and tried drinking my beers in 2 to 3 weeks too, tried other peoples beers at 2 to 3 weeks also, and I have yet to have anyones beer at 2 to 3 weeks old that is even worth drinking.

Do whatever you want, after all its your beer !

I was just trying to help the OP but I guess others here take offense to that.

Cheers

 

[fearwig]

Hi darby_ross,

Please read post #35 I am really trying to help you and I'll bet if you try it, it will help.

You don't have anything to loose by trying it, much better than dumping another batch if you ask me.

When I started out I listened to the people saying beer is good at 2 to 3 weeks old and tried drinking my beers in 2 to 3 weeks too, tried other peoples beers at 2 to 3 weeks also, and I have yet to have anyones beer at 2 to 3 weeks old that is even worth drinking.

Do whatever you want, after all its your beer !

I was just trying to help the OP but I guess others here take offense to that.

Cheers

I think the "Cheers " comes across as pretty glib/sarcastic after certain types of posts, especially ones where you're mocking half a dozen people for their sensible advice. But it seems like you put it after everything even though it's not your sig, so my actual non-sarcastic apologies if I "took offense" without reason. It definitely wasn't because you tried to help the OP, that's ridiculous.

Anyway, we can still settle the substance of the point. OP, have you poured every beer you ever made out after just four days, or have you given some time to age?

 

[WileECoyote]

I think the "Cheers " comes across as pretty glib/sarcastic after certain types of posts, especially ones where you're mocking half a dozen people for their sensible advice. But it seems like you put it after everything even though it's not your sig, so my apologies if I "took offense" without reason. It definitely wasn't because you tried to help the OP, that's ridiculous.

Anyway, we can still settle the substance of the point. OP, have you poured every beer you ever made out after just four days, or have you given some time to age?

You just can't help your self can you.

And I really don't care what you think to tell you the truth.

If you don't like the cheers after everything don't read my post.

I will no longer reply to you fearwig as this is not helping the OP, neither is telling him that 2 to 3 week old beer taste good.

Cheers

 

[fearwig]

"Two or three week old beer taste good" - not something I have said (though it obviously can? what are you doing to the beer that you can't drink it until month in the keg?)
Cheers

Still hopeful to help the OP, if such a thing is possible. *headdesk*

Try RO water. And don't pour your beer out if it doesn't taste good yet after one or two weeks. Both good advice. The latter I would wager you have already tried, because who would do that?

 

[cheezydemon3]

Really ? Yes and they filter out the chlorine too ! Guess you didn't know that.

He has also switched sanitizers

Cheers

Granted Purified water will have it removed and is cheap, but the cheapest crap (he did not specify) is straight outa the tap.

CHEERS!

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/greenhouse/post/2011/01/bottled-water-lack-key-data/1

"Bottled water companies try hard to hide any information consumers may find troubling," Jane Houlihan, EWG's senior vice president for research, said in releasing the findings. "Their ads depict mountain streams and natural springs. Yet nearly half the time, according to the industry's own statistics, they're bottling tap water."

Bottled water companies are not required by the Food and Drug Administration, which regulates the industry, to publish water quality tests. The Environmental Protection Agency requires water utilities do so for tap water.

 

[CBMbrewer]

Okay boys... I think we are straying from the topic.
I do agree that there are a number of culprits and most of the ideas and advice given on this thread are worth while and legitimate. I would, however, lean toward the possibility that the beer is still too young. I can say without a doubt or bias that beer, very freshly carbonated can and will have a very unpleasant and overbearing flavor from the initial reaction of co2 and h2o. Many of us describe it differently, but they way the op has described it is one way I have read and heard before. I would try and let it sit in the keg for at least 2 weeks before enjoying. Obviously I would also try and eliminate any of the other very possible causes that have been mentioned. Don't give up hope yet!

 

[Taranis]

The Bold I highlighted in your reply is the taste problem.

Try your beer 14 days on the gas after kegging and aging/conditioning it for 2 months before you put it on the gas, and I would bet it taste good, beer 4 days on the gas taste nasty.

Only 2 weeks in the bottle carbing up can taste nasty too.

Most 2 week old beer taste nasty too.

Give your beer some time to get good, Try 2 months on one of your bad tasting beers before you drink it and I'll bet it will taste good !

Im sure you are tasting green beer flavor too.

Cheers

This

 

[fearwig]

I don't wanna harp, but what are the odds this guy has never had a beer that hasn't been in his keg more than two or three weeks? Is he a hardcore alkie who doesn't like to brew very often? Otherwise it's basically impossible. It's not the answer because even if you drink your beer too green, you eventually, by the end of it, drink some beer that isn't too green. Because it takes you a little while. It sounds like a good answer because it's a finger-wagging "don't do what you want to do" thing, but it's not the answer to an off flavor question because invariably he'd have figured it out by now (by drinking the last of each beer, weeks later) if it were the problem.

Anyway, a thousand head-desks to you all. A facepalm. Two facepalms and a groan.

 

[Arrheinous]

I've never experienced this CO2 bite everyone is talking about. Sure it tastes better after a couple weeks in the keg/fridge but even right after a force carb session it's pretty good.

 

[cheezydemon3]

I have never had "Green" beer taste medicinal.

I used to ALWAYS try my green beer, just felt like it was more info on my beer.

 

[JonnyBravo859]

I am going to go back to the original message and say that I experienced something very similar and discovered that it was residue from sodium precarbonate(PBW-Oxiclean). If you do not rinse both your bottles and your fermentation vessel very, very well you will get a medicinal overpowering flavor similar to a really heavy wheat beer. I find that people who love wheat beers dont mind. It masks almost every other flavor. 6 ounces of hops and you cant tell any are in there. I have since started rinsing thoroughly with a bottle washer and the problem has gone away. I did one experiment with a few lightly rinsed bottles and got the off flavor. Try to super rinse your next batch. I bet it will help.

 

[satyrbassist]

Time heals all things. The only thing I can't speak to is the co2 as I've always naturally carbonated. But here are a few things I've noticed in my beers:
1. Extract takes longer to condition than an all grain.
2. If my beer is kept below 70 degrees it takes longer to condition.
3. Unless infected ALL beer will condition itself out and lose all off flavors if left long enough.
I know this doesn't allow for "young" drinking, and doesn't address the initial problem. But unless you are using pool water, even the chlorine taste will be gone with enough time


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[fearwig]

3. Unless infected ALL beer will condition itself out and lose all off flavors if left long enough.

Ehhhh, well. Even if you limit "all" to fermentation-based off flavors, I beg to differ. Underpitch and hot fermentation can both create nasty-bad things that might never disappear. Or they might. I find hot alcohol flavors seem to mellow, but "bad fruity" (like underpitched English or US yeast) doesn't always go away.

Telling people to let their beer sit six months mostly just makes the problem go away in that they don't post any more questions about it--at least for six months. By which time they don't care as much and have brewed more beer.

 

[satyrbassist]

Well said fearwig. And I guess I am speaking more to a single bad batch. My main worry was that he was throwing every batch out after a two week taste test.


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[satyrbassist]

Well said fearwig. And I guess I am speaking more to a single bad batch. My main worry was that he was throwing every batch out after a two week taste test. And that if he let one sit it would be easier to figure out if it's ingredients or method


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[fearwig]

Oh yeah. I drink my good beers, but I drink my bad beers too. As punishment, maybe. Either way, no reason to pour out bad beer. If you keg, bottle it. If you bottle, put the bottles away and find a use for them, cook with them, whatever.

I had an ESB that was way too big some months ago due to a bad efficiency estimate, and I didn't take gravity because I was sloppy and brew day was running late. Underpitched it, and not enough bitterness for all the malt. So nasty. Had the last one last night. Tasted like regrets. Or specifically, like candy you find in a gutter.

 

[darby_ross]

I second this. Some of us are really sensitive to carbonic acid, which is what is formed when co2 and h2o interact. With time it will pass. So if it doesn't, obviously, it is another issue.

I am going to go back to the original message and say that I experienced something very similar and discovered that it was residue from sodium precarbonate(PBW-Oxiclean). If you do not rinse both your bottles and your fermentation vessel very, very well you will get a medicinal overpowering flavor similar to a really heavy wheat beer. I find that people who love wheat beers dont mind. It masks almost every other flavor. 6 ounces of hops and you cant tell any are in there. I have since started rinsing thoroughly with a bottle washer and the problem has gone away. I did one experiment with a few lightly rinsed bottles and got the off flavor. Try to super rinse your next batch. I bet it will help.

I may try this I was using oxyclean to begin with and swithed to pbw. Could this simple detail be the main issue.

 

[darby_ross]

Sorry for the delay. The problem turned out to be carbonic acid.