Aeration Stones Still Popular?

[Clint Yeastwood]

Are people still using aeration stones? Have any new aerating inventions popped up since my brewing retirement in 2006?

Also, I want to reduce the mush in my machine. Are hop bags still the state of the art?

 

[Sammy86]

Are people still using aeration stones? Have any new aerating inventions popped up since my brewing retirement in 2006?

Also, I want to reduce the mush in my machine. Are hop bags still the state of the art?

Short answer, yes and yes.

For the hops you can use a hop spider but bags work equally well at least IMO.

Personally, i ditched it and throw the hops in and whirlpool at the end of the boil to make a nice cone at the bottom and try not to worry about it.

 

[IslandLizard]

Both oxygenation and aeration stones are still popular, yup. Oxygenation is becoming more of a preference due to the wider availability of equipment and efficiency (shorter time needed and higher DO values).

Now my LHBS was selling an oxygenation wand, being a stainless stone screwed onto the end of a skinny 24" stainless tube, for $60.
I thought the similar looking $30 ones, 5 years ago, were already pushing it.

I made my own from a sawed off, old plastic racking cane, and a short piece of vinyl tubing to connect the barbed stainless stone to.

I use hop bags in the kettle because I'm using a plate chiller.
Depending on hop load in a 5 gallon batch, I use 1 or 2 9x22" fine mesh hop bags, weighed down with a handful of glass marbles, clamped to a kettle handle with a bulldog clip. Only the very fine dust comes through, which is no issue with the chiller. The bags get lifted periodically to drain and refresh wort.

 

[Clint Yeastwood]

Thanks for the help.

I just made a beer without hop bags, and it didn't clog anything, but I was using pellet hops.

Since posting the questions, I have seen people claiming hop bags kill the hop flavor, but it seems like you should be able to compensate by using more hops.

Is there some reason why people don't just use a clean tool to scoop the hops out?

 

[hotbeer]

Of course a lot of us don't even aerate or oxygenate our wort. I think the trend is that more people are moving to dry yeast since there is so much variety of dry yeast today than there were 10, 15 and 20 years ago.

But if you are going to save your yeast and re-pitch whether it use to be dry or not then it needs the oxygen.

 

[Clint Yeastwood]

Of course a lot of us don't even aerate or oxygenate our wort. I think the trend is that more people are moving to dry yeast since there is so much variety of dry yeast today than there were 10, 15 and 20 years ago.

But if you are going to save your yeast and re-pitch whether it use to be dry or not then it needs the oxygen.

I didn't know dry yeast didn't require oxygen.

I'm looking around for a dry yeast equivalency chart for substitutions. If anyone knows of a good reliable reference, I am all ears.

 

[hotbeer]

I'm looking around for a dry yeast equivalency chart for substitutions.

I look at this when I'm considering yeast substitutions and I want to be fairly close to the same yeast character.

https://beermaverick.com/yeasts/yeast-substitutions-chart/
It doesn't group them by liquid or dry, you just have to know or find out. And most certainly it doesn't have all the dry yeasts or liquid yeasts represented.

 

[hotbeer]

I didn't know dry yeast didn't require oxygen.

They don't. They are already at or through that stage at the time they are harvested and dried. So they are pretty much ready to begin fermentation and they also have all the nutrients included with them too.

However they are only dry yeast for the first use. If you harvest them or re-use the slurry, then treat them the same as you do for liquid yeasts.

One member here claims they get better beer with their dry yeast after the second or third round. But for my use, I'm not brewing for top place at a competition. I'm happy with just opening a bag or two and directly pitching it to the wort. No fuss or added complication for me as I like simplicity.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

One member here claims they get better beer with their dry yeast after the second or third round.

There was also a long running discussion (involving multiple people and covering multiple strains) in AHA forums a couple of years.

 

[Clint Yeastwood]

Guess it's time to shake the bucket before fermentation starts and get myself a stone and wand.

 

[IslandLizard]

Guess it's time to shake the bucket before fermentation starts and get myself a stone and wand.

Use a whisk, or stir briskly for a minute, whipping air into the wort/beer.
Splashing the chilled wort into your fermenter vessel also aerates, as does draining through a (well sanitized) sieve from a height.

There's a little plastic cone shaped aerator you mount on the end of your racking hose going into the fermenter. It starts to spray the wort. Let it splash from 1-2' height.

 

[Clint Yeastwood]

Thanks for the help, but things are going surprisingly well.

My homebrewing experiences are never quite normal.

I was putting together an order for a wand kit and some dry yeast, and I kept thinking I had an aerating paddle (Mix-Stir) lying on the floor of my garage. I went out there, and sure enough, there it was. I think I found it while cleaning up my shop and then put it in the garage, where it eventually found the floor.

I got it cleaned up and sanitized and opened up the fermenter. AY, CHIHUAHUA! It was already fermented up the wazoo. Thick layer of bubbles on top.

Guess this batch won't need any help.

I will still order a stone and wand, though.

I'm pretty confident the Mix-Stir is okay to use. It's been a long time since I used it to make manure tea for the plants.

 

[IslandLizard]

Guess this batch won't need any help.

Once it's fermenting, no. Aeration or oxygenation at that point will oxidize the beer, which is bad.

I will still order a stone and wand, though.

Are you planning on using compressed pure oxygen (little red canisters, or a welding tank) or just air?

For air, using an aquarium pump, you would need a wider pore stone (2 micron, IIRC), or nothing will come through, too much resistance.
When using an air compressor, a 0.5 micron pore stone should work fine. But you may need to send it through a HEPA filter first.

For compressed oxygen, 0.5 micron is good.

I'll post a pic of my homemade oxygen wand, using an old racking cane.
I think I paid $5-8 for the 0.5 micron stainless stones, about 6-7 years ago. I chose the barb version, not the threaded ones.

 

[Clint Yeastwood]

I have a 125 cu. ft. oxygen tank, but I am not excited about playing around with the regulator and moving the tank to the fermenting fridge. I wonder if I can get a coupler to refill a disposable. It works for propane, but then propane is somewhat less scary.

I suppose if I wanted to get cute, I could machine a thing to connect the stone to my cutting torch.

I have forgotten a lot about brewing, but I know better than to stick a drill into a half-fermented batch.

It's kind of a shame, because I got almost half the sheep manure off the Mix-Stir.

 

[IslandLizard]

It's kind of a shame, because I got almost half the sheep manure off the Mix-Stir.

Do you think you got it clean enough to use in wort/beer?

I wonder if I can get a coupler to refill a disposable.

I'd be careful refilling disposables. You got to know what their pressure limits are. I doubt it's 2000 psi like the large commercial/welding ones.

They seem to hold only 1.4 oz of Oxygen. You can calculate the pressure given the size:
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Bernzomatic-1-4-oz-Oxygen-Gas-Cylinder-304179/202044702

 

[Clint Yeastwood]

I'm going to ask about the oxygen tanks on a welding forum. I know I can step down the pressure, but it may still be a stupid idea.

 

[IslandLizard]

I'm going to ask about the oxygen tanks on a welding forum. I know I can step down the pressure, but it may still be a stupid idea.

Those little tanks are a lot easier to handle and move around than your large one.
Probably easier to move your fermenter to the cylinder.

I dose 5 gallon batches in a 6.5 gallon brew bucket at 1/8 l/min for 8 minutes, moving the wand around in the fermenter every 30-45 secs or thereabout. Or 1/4 l/min for 4 minutes under almost constant movement, when in a hurry.

 

[DuncB]

You are only suggesting a few litres of oxygen. How about filling a balloon and then attach to a tube and wand?
Might work.

 

[IslandLizard]

You are only suggesting a few litres of oxygen. How about filling a balloon and then attach to a tube and wand?
Might work.

Yes, it only needs a liter (or 2) of (pure) oxygen to attain 8-10 ppm DO in a 5 gallon batch. Both a slower dosage rate and moving the wand around will allow more oxygen to dissolve before it reaches the surface. Any bubbling or surface rippling is oxygen that didn't get dissolved, so try to minimize that.

Now it takes quite some pressure to get oxygen through the .5 micron sintered stone. I doubt a latex balloon can deliver that, or even squeezing a filled (mylar) balloon. Mind, it also takes 2-4 minutes.

 

[DuncB]

Yes, it only needs a liter (or 2) of (pure) oxygen to attain 8-10 ppm DO in a 5 gallon batch. Both a slower dosage rate and moving the wand around will allow more oxygen to dissolve before it reaches the surface. Any bubbling or surface rippling is oxygen that didn't get dissolved, so try to minimize that.

Now it takes quite some pressure to get oxygen through the .5 micron sintered stone. I doubt a latex balloon can deliver that, or even squeezing a filled (mylar) balloon. Mind, it also takes 2-4 minutes.

I might have a play around at home for the benefit of others, not that it's something I'd do as I'm selling a D size oxygen cylinder and regulator now that I have an oxygen generator.
So I'll be oxygenating and not even worrying about waste.

 

[Deadalus]

There are threaded 0.5 micron stones that can be inserted into a 1/2" SS tee to oxygenate inline. Cheaper than the wand but depends on your setup. A separate wand on the other hand can be used to oxygenate starter yeast as well if you are interested in doing that.

I have a big O2 tank chained to the wall near my brewing rig.

 

[connell89]

Are people still using aeration stones? Have any new aerating inventions popped up since my brewing retirement in 2006?

Also, I want to reduce the mush in my machine. Are hop bags still the state of the art?

I still use a cooler brew system and poor my wort into the fermenter so it gets oxygenated as it falls the height of the 5 gallon carboy. If I brew a 1.060 or greater brew, I do think about oxygenating but usually save this step for really big beers.

I now use a stainless mesh hop spider in stead of bags. It works great and saves me a little money since I stopped buying bags. I did use a large nylon bag for whole cone hops. Whole cone hops take up a lot of room.

 

[Clint Yeastwood]

So why don't people scoop hops out?

 

[Sammy86]

So why don't people scoop hops out?

Risk of infection and oxygen

 

[Clint Yeastwood]

I think I am missing something here. The wort is at or near the boiling point, and you want oxygen at this stage, so I would think removing hops with a scoop would be fine.

 

[Sammy86]

I think I am missing something here. The wort is at or near the boiling point, and you want oxygen at this stage, so I would think removing hops with a scoop would be fine.

Sorry, I thought you were talking post boil into the FV. Completely my bad!

You can definitely scoop them out, the only issue i see is you can press those little wort suckers and extract a little bit more of wort out of them into the FV but it could be not worth it for the amount.

Again, my bad not understanding your post!

 

[Clint Yeastwood]

Sorry, I thought you were talking post boil into the FV. Completely my bad!

You can definitely scoop them out, the only issue i see is you can press those little wort suckers and extract a little bit more of wort out of them into the FV but it could be not worth it for the amount.

Again, my bad not understanding your post!

I should have explained that my wort is hot when it goes into the fermenter, at least this time around. I went to a bucket, and the bucket went in the pool. Next time I'll use an All-Rounder, and the wort will have to be colder. But I think I should still be able to scoop out a lot of hops before the chill.

 

[DonT]

...now that I have an oxygen generator.
So I'll be oxygenating and not even worrying about waste.

Where did you get your O2 generator? Does it have enough pressure to push through an oxygen stone?

 

[CDS]

I think I am missing something here. The wort is at or near the boiling point, and you want oxygen at this stage, so I would think removing hops with a scoop would be fine.

Now I might be the one missing something. I know that hot water can't hold as much disolved oxygen as cold water can, so I assume that's true of wort - if you're aerating hot wort, wouldn't the amount of oxygen be reduced by the time the wort is at pitching temp? I'm no expert - curious what others think.

 

[belgabrewing]

Are people still using aeration stones? Have any new aerating inventions popped up since my brewing retirement in 2006?

Also, I want to reduce the mush in my machine. Are hop bags still the state of the art?

I stopped using O2 because of the infection risk posed by all the little crooks and crannies in the "stone" and switched to using a single drop of olive oil. Nobody ever noticed.

https://brulosophy.com/2020/01/27/i...rnative-to-wort-aeration-exbeeriment-results/