50 Amp circuit, 30 amp BrewBoss controller

[FunCat1828]

So I recently had my house built and had a 50 amp circuit for my brewery put in the garage, currently doesn't have GFCI breaker in the panel. but will be added in the future or possibly as part of getting this temp setup going.
I'm long term planning a Brucontrol controller, but have access to a 30 Amp BrewBoss controller that I can use in the meantime. I want to use that for my 20 Gallon BIAB setup until I get the main panel setup so I can get away from propane altogether.

What's the cheapest and easiest way to step down from the 50A to 30A with GFCI for this control panel? 50Amp spa panel and then step down to 30A from there? Replace the 50A breaker with a 50A GFCI and then......?

 

[doug293cz]

Put a 50A GFCI breaker in the panel, and change the plug on the BrewBoss cord to match the 50A outlet. Plugging loads smaller than the circuit capacity it done all the time. A 50A and 30A GFCI both trip on ~5mA of leakage current (this is the function that protects you.)

Brew on

 

[whoaru99]

It would be interesting to know the NEC version adopted/enforced in your area, presuming you're in USA. Or, what exemption critera was used.

AFAIK/FYI/FWIW 2020 NEC required GFI on 240V circuits in garages amongst other places.

210.8(A) Dwelling Units. All 125-volt through 250-volt receptacles installed in the locations specified in 210.8(A)(1) through (A)⁠(11) and supplied by single-phase branch circuits rated 150 volts or less to ground shall have ground-fault circuit-interrupter protection for personnel.

(1) Bathrooms

(2) Garages...

 

[doug293cz]

It would be interesting to know the NEC version adopted/enforced in your area, presuming you're in USA. Or, what exemption critera was used.

AFAIK/FYI/FWIW 2020 NEC required GFI on 240V circuits in garages amongst other places.

So, are you questioning why the circuit was not installed with a GFCI breaker initially? I missed that on first reading.

Brew on

 

[FunCat1828]

I am based in the US in Idaho.

 

[whoaru99]

So, are you questioning why the circuit was not installed with a GFCI breaker initially?

Correct, considering the mention it's recently built house (presuming garage too).

 

[IDMaynard]

I am based in the US in Idaho.

What part of Idaho? I'm in Boise

 

[FunCat1828]

What part of Idaho? I'm in Boise

I'm in the 2C!

 

[Agent]

Correct, considering the mention it's recently built house (presuming garage too).

I'm going to take a guess that says the garage has a 50amp 240v subpanel run to it, but there is not yet any 240v receptacles run out of the panel yet.

 

[FunCat1828]

Correct, considering the mention it's recently built house (presuming garage too).

It was built in 2022, including the garage.

 

[FunCat1828]

I'm going to take a guess that says the garage has a 50amp 240v subpanel run to it, but there is not yet any 240v receptacles run out of the panel yet.

No I have a receptacle out of the panel. No subpanel, it's wired directly into my main panel located in the garage.

I guess it's possible that it is already a GFCI. I'm not home and can't go double check the panel. That would be a nice surprise for me, but I remember specifically asking them for it to be a 50A GFCI circuit in the build process, but they wouldn't commit to that. The challenges of going with a community builder and not a custom builder.

 

[mac_1103]

I remember specifically asking them for it to be a 50A GFCI circuit in the build process, but they wouldn't commit to that.

As mentioned, if your jurisdiction was enforcing the 2020 NEC they would have had no choice but to commit to that. So maybe they knew it wasn't needed to get your local building inspector to pass it and they didn't want to commit to it because of supply chain issues.

 

[FunCat1828]

As mentioned, if your jurisdiction was enforcing the 2020 NEC they would have had no choice but to commit to that. So maybe they knew it wasn't needed to get your local building inspector to pass it and they didn't want to commit to it because of supply chain issues.

Managed to find a couple pictures of what I am working with from the build process in the good old google drive!

Likely a combination of supply chain issues at the time and also builder issues to be honest.

 

[Broken Crow]

Maybe it's me... Just to back up a sec; You have no power at all in your garage but you do have a box with a 6/3 50A line awaiting a single 50A RV receptacle? ...no provision for garage lighting or 120V outlets such as for pumps or a fridge or anything?

I want to use that for my 20 Gallon BIAB setup until I get the main panel setup so I can get away from propane altogether.

You could just put a 30A receptacle in that box and work in the dark, but seriously: put in a sub panel first and maybe at least one extra outlet for lighting and maybe a pump.

 

[FunCat1828]

Maybe it's me... Just to back up a sec; You have no power at all in your garage but you do have a box with a 6/3 50A line awaiting a single 50A RV receptacle? ...no provision for garage lighting or 120V outlets such as for pumps or a fridge or anything?

You could just put a 30A receptacle in that box and work in the dark, but seriously: put in a sub panel first and maybe at least one extra outlet for lighting and maybe a pump.

My bad….Main panel = main brucontrol control panel

I have power throughout the house and garage.

 

[mashdar]

According to the mikeholt.com list, effective date for 2023 NEC in Ohio residential construction was Q1 2024. It appears 2020 NEC was voted for adoption in early 2020, probably with a Q1 2021 effective date.

So very likely this was a code deficiency at time of construction, unles the permit was pulled in 2020 and construction took years. (If you have the permit docs, they should list a code version.)

Ohio amends the NEC though, so maybe the edited the new requirement out.

 

[mac_1103]

According to the mikeholt.com list, effective date for 2023 NEC in Ohio residential construction was Q1 2024. It appears 2020 NEC was voted for adoption in early 2020, probably with a Q1 2021 effective date.

OP is in Idaho, not Ohio.

 

[FunCat1828]

According to the mikeholt.com list, effective date for 2023 NEC in Ohio residential construction was Q1 2024. It appears 2020 NEC was voted for adoption in early 2020, probably with a Q1 2021 effective date.

So very likely this was a code deficiency at time of construction, unles the permit was pulled in 2020 and construction took years. (If you have the permit docs, they should list a code version.)

Ohio amends the NEC though, so maybe the edited the new requirement out.

It looks like Idaho also amends the NEC, but I'm not an electrician if that's not already obvious at this point!

https://legislature.idaho.gov/wp-content/uploads/sessioninfo/2024/legislation/H0704.pdf

Regardless of any potential code deficiencies, looks to me that what I am left with is I need to get a GFCI breaker for this 50A circuit put in my main electric panel that is already fully operational in my garage, and then change the power cord on the Brewboss to match the 50 amp receptacle to get me up and running at least on E-BIAB as the brucontrol control panel gets put together.

Ultimately I just want to brew some beer soon!

 

[Broken Crow]

It looks like Idaho also amends the NEC, but I'm not an electrician if that's not already obvious at this point!

https://legislature.idaho.gov/wp-content/uploads/sessioninfo/2024/legislation/H0704.pdf

Regardless of any potential code deficiencies, looks to me that what I am left with is I need to get a GFCI breaker for this 50A circuit put in my main electric panel that is already fully operational in my garage, and then change the power cord on the Brewboss to match the 50 amp receptacle to get me up and running at least on E-BIAB as the brucontrol control panel gets put together.

Ultimately I just want to brew some beer soon!

Or you could just install an L6-30R in the 50A box and keep the cord....I don't think that's a code violation and since most receptacles use the screw-down bare wire type connections rather than a sleeve, the larger gauge wire (if already present) should fit.
https://www.amazon.com/ELEGRP-Recep...se&keywords=l6+30r&qid=1722011918&sr=8-5&th=1
... I could be wrong about some code detail, but this seems the easiest/economical path.

 

[whoaru99]

Or you could just install an L6-30R in the 50A box and keep the cord....I don't think that's a code violation and since most receptacles use the screw-down bare wire type connections rather than a sleeve, the larger gauge wire (if already present) should fit...

It would be fine so long as the 30A receptacle terminals are rated for 6ga wire, and that a 30A breaker is installed not a 50A breaker.

 

[whoaru99]

According to the mikeholt.com list, effective date for 2023 NEC in Ohio residential construction was Q1 2024. It appears 2020 NEC was voted for adoption in early 2020, probably with a Q1 2021 effective date.

So very likely this was a code deficiency at time of construction, unles the permit was pulled in 2020 and construction took years. (If you have the permit docs, they should list a code version.)

Ohio amends the NEC though, so maybe the edited the new requirement out.

I completely upgraded the wiring in my garage from 60A subfeed to separately metered 200A service just after MN adopted 2020 Code. Part of that was adding a 240V, 50A circuit.

However, due to supply chain issues at the time, MN issued a temporary exemption for the 240V GFI requirement, so didn't have to put in GFI breaker at the time (not that one was available anyway...) nor was required to retrofit one.

 

[Broken Crow]

It would be fine so long as the 30A receptacle terminals are rated for 6ga wire, and that a 30A breaker is installed not a 50A breaker.

OK, Thanks. I just use and adapter I made from bits to plug into my 40A stove outlet;

albeit to an L14-30R as I use a 120V leg in my controller as well.

 

[whoaru99]

Yeah, there are all sorts of adaptions people make or buy.

What I know is for single receptacle on a circuit NEC says the receptacle rating shall have amp rating not less than the branch circuit. There is an exception for cord and plug connected welders based on their nameplate duty cycle rating.

Myself, I hook lower rated things to a 50A circuit, but it's through a distribution setup that includes a GFI breaker and a panel that protects the lower rated receptacles/circuits according to their ratings.

 

[IDMaynard]

I'm in the 2C!

Sweet!

 

[sbro]

adaptions people make

Nice portable panel, but I had a question.
What is the 3rd dual pole breaker power? It looks like two 120v 20A outlet pairs and a 240v 20A receptacle.
Does the dual pole breaker work on the 120 outlets by tripping both branches?

 

[whoaru99]

Does the dual pole breaker work on the 120 outlets by tripping both branches?

Correct. The bottom 240V receptacle and the bottom 120V duplex are essentially in parallel.

That one 120V, 20A duplex receptacle is split wired as a multiwire branch circuit. NEC requires both ungrounded wires be opened simultaneously in case of fault or overload on either one.

The point of that is the primary use of this panel was intended for powering several fairly stout pro audio amps (total ~10kW rated output).

Three of those amps can operate from 240V. I don't always use all three but I always use two. Hence the two dedicated 240V outlets and for the times I don't use three amps at 240V, there is the ability to have a couple more 120V outlets if/as necessary.

 

[mac_1103]

the primary use of this panel was intended for powering several fairly stout pro audio amps (total ~10kW rated output).
...
I don't always use all three but I always use two.

Neighbors must love you.

 

[whoaru99]

Neighbors must love you.

Based on your presumption of use?

 

[mac_1103]

Nice presumption.

or joke

 

[whoaru99]

or joke

I have my doubts, but OK.

 

[mac_1103]

I have my doubts, but OK.

Seriously? Sheesh.

 

[whoaru99]

Seriously? Sheesh.

Seriously.

 

[mashdar]

He didn't say want he was amplifying. Could be his 10kW pirate VHF television station.

 

[whoaru99]

He didn't say want he was amplifying. Could be his 10kW pirate VHF television station.

I can neither confirm nor deny that.

 

[Broken Crow]

I can neither confirm nor deny that.

I gotta ask: Sound Engineer? I used regularly annoy my GF when working on soundtracks. I miss it.

 

[FunCat1828]

GFCI installed!

 

[whoaru99]

I gotta ask: Sound Engineer? I used regularly annoy my GF when working on soundtracks. I miss it.

No, not formally anyway.

Caught the audio bug early on although in last several years those proclivites have somewhat tapered. Certainly not gone though.

 

[FunCat1828]

Thanks all! I did a successful wet test tonight. Tomorrow is a full test run and then cleaning kegs and fermenters and next week will be my first brew day in years!