48 Hours - No Action - Wyeast Laboratories - Bohemian Lager™ 2124

[beershere]

Hey all,

It has been 48 hours since I pitched the yeast for my Vienna lager using Wyeast Laboratories - Bohemian Lager™ 2124 and I have yet to see any action.

I did not create a starter, but I did pitch a good amount of yeast that I received from a local brewery. (I know, should have created a starter still!)

I aerated the wort for 20 minutes with an aquarium pump, and pitched at 48 degrees F. I have let the wort warm to 52 degrees now but still no action.

A few questions, 1.) Should I attempt to aerate the wort again to get this yeast going? 2.) Should I Pitch more yeast? 3.) Should I just leave it the hell alone? 4.) Any other ideas?

This is only my 5th batch, and I have always seen my yeasts take off within 30 hours, though I have yet to attempt fermenting at lager temps so I am a bit paranoid with this one.

Thanks.

 

[CDGoin]

I'd wait.. I am in the same boat.. I pitched cool and then transferred to the 50 degree fermentation room.

So far nothing after almost 50 hours.

I do think I saw the bubbler move once.. so I took solace in that and assume the fact its cooler temps thus things are going to go slower.

I also have a IR Temp finder.. and can tell the center of the fermenter is at 52 degree while everything else is at 49-50 so something is generating some heat, and I can only assume some fermentation is going on.

I figure as long as I don't see a lacto infection build on the top I won't worry about it for a few more days. In a few more days I may just pitch some more yeast if nothing more occurs. I figure at worse, I will make another starter and add some yeast nutrients to it and pour it down the bubbler hole through a spout to avoid exposing the beer to any infection.

That's the key.. I wouldn't aerate anymore.. could lead to an infection. If you don't have to break the seal of your fermenter the better. Lagers need more patience than other beers.. but the end result is worth it

 

[bratrules]

I've brewed two batches this year using 2124. One was a Vienna lager and the other was a Dortmunder export. I did make huge starters for both and pitch the yeast when it was most active and both took about 8 hours or so to start fermenting. But from what I hear this yeast can be a slow starter. What I do is to cold crash my starter then decant that add some of my first runnings by the time am ready to add my yeast its very active. That cuts down on my lag time!!

 

[fatnoah]

I've never used 2124, but the one lager I did took 72 hours to get going. I was about to give up, but sure enough it finally started. So I say patience is required here.

 

[Nugent]

I'm fermenting a pils with 2124 right now at 50F (10C).

Brewed on Friday and pitched a stepped up 3l starter at about 52F (~11C) in the late afternoon. Have a nice half inch krausen right now, but no activity in my blow-off jar yet.

Seems very happy to me, as I expect that lagers always take longer to get started.

I'd wait. Good luck.

 

[CDGoin]

So far nothing after almost 50 hours.

Update : I pitched about 11PM on Thursday.. as of 11PM last night mine is also not showing much of anything.. So I am also at 72 hours.

Did not check this morning.. but as my LHBS is closed till tommorrow I am at least waiting that long.

Curious if yours ever got started and what you did. As this is the longest its ever taken one of mine to take off as well.

I personally think my room has gotten too cold. Its currently at 48-50 degrees, which is a few degrees colder than the kit recipe calls for (by about 5 degrees) but within the middle of the range for a Lager. I may just warm it up to 54 degree first to see if it will take off.

Because as I mentioned before.. I would do everything in my power to not break the seal and open it up to contamination.

 

[bratrules]

Update : I pitched about 11PM on Thursday.. as of 11PM last night mine is also not showing much of anything.. So I am also at 72 hours.

Did not check this morning.. but as my LHBS is closed till tommorrow I am at least waiting that long.

Curious if yours ever got started and what you did. As this is the longest its ever taken one of mine to take off as well.

I personally think my room has gotten too cold. Its currently at 48-50 degrees, which is a few degrees colder than the kit recipe calls for (by about 5 degrees) but within the middle of the range for a Lager. I may just warm it up to 54 degree first to see if it will take off.

Because as I mentioned before.. I would do everything in my power to not break the seal and open it up to contamination.

Personally I think that 48-50 is not to cold for 2124. Last brew I did I fermented it 45 and it started up just fine. Just wait a bit longer and take a gravity reading.

 

[Taxovich]

I usually ferment 2124 in the 43-45 degree range. Just give the fermenter a swirl every hour or so to get the yeast in suspension.

 

[CDGoin]

Good to know.. Thanks. I will try the swirl method a bit if it hasnt taken off when i get home tonight.

 

[beershere]

Thanks for all of your posts.

Update:

As of 65 hours I still have nothing as well, CDGoin, thanks for posting sounds like we are in the same boat right now. I am going to give it a swirl when I get home tonight, but leaving this morning the carboy bath was at 54F.

Another thing I failed to mention, is that the yeast slurry I pitched was probably around 40F when I pitched....I am hoping it is still trying to reach an equilibrium temp with the wort and take off.

 

[CDGoin]

I have been swirlling all day and took it out of its bath and letting the heater warm the room.

What I do in my garage this time of year ( and until tonight it has worked) It put my fermentor in my deep stainless sink in the brew room.. and fill it with water. Then when the garage gets to 40 or so over the night the water stays at 50 and when the garage gets to 60 the water stays 50.. works AWESOME.

I am thinking I may have stressed my yeast when I was doing the starter.. I have never been stuck :-/ usually within 18 hours or less to start.

LBHS is open tommorrow and a a new batch of yeast will be input through the vent hole and hopedully that will work if the swirllign and heating doesnt work tonight.

 

[CDGoin]

Checked this morning.. it looks like upping the temp to the MId-50s and swirling all evening MAY have helped.. No Krausen.

But looked like maybe some bubbles on the top forming.

Swirled one more time and left. Will say I did get a yeasty wiff as the air lock popped a few times from the swirling.. so it MAYBE on the verge of going. The 24 hour mark from when it warmed up is 9PM so I will know by then.

In the meantime. I will buy some more yeast and if I get home and still nothing.. will add some additional yeast to get it going. I may have stressed my yeast when I made the start or pitched too warm. I know my thermometer said the wort was at 60, but I will admit I had a number of home brews when I pitched.. so I could have misread or taken a bad temp.

 

[beershere]

Well, at 90 Hours I gave up waiting. Added another 1.5 cups of 2124 yeast slurry to the wort which is now at 55F.

Hopefully I see some action soon, or this batch may be a loss.

 

[processhead]

My most recent experience with this yeast in dunkel was disappointing.
Slow to show signs of active fermentation. Added a second slap-pack and then showed fermentation, but then stuck at 1.040.

Exhibited off flavors and had to dump it.

May have been my failure to do a starter.

 

[CDGoin]

I got a vial of liquid yeast from the LHBS and going to try it: WLP820 its an Oktoberfest Lager Yeast..

INTERESTING directions though that seem to be counter to what I have read.

Add yeast at 70-74 and let set there until fermentation starts in 5-15 hours.. THEN bring down to lager temps..

ON the White Labs website others talked about upwards of 5 days to get this yeast to start at 50 or so degrees..
http://www.whitelabs.com/yeast/wlp820-oktoberfestmärzen-lager-yeast#faq

Be interesting to see what happens. IF I have to use it.. find out when I get home.

 

[CDGoin]

UGH !!!

Warmed up to 65.. swirled every hour or so and a fresh batch of yeast injected into the batch..

SMALL Bubbles this morning..

It DOES seem to produce a little action for the hour after I swirl it and then it goes what looks to be dormant..

Will pull a Gravity reading tonight if it still isnt showing any signs of life.. may just be a REALLY slow fermentation that I am not used to seeing. Which is is REALLY wierd since this is a Brewers best kit I have done 2 times before. So you would expect the same results.

 

[Darwin18]

I got a vial of liquid yeast from the LHBS and going to try it: WLP820 its an Oktoberfest Lager Yeast..

INTERESTING directions though that seem to be counter to what I have read.

Add yeast at 70-74 and let set there until fermentation starts in 5-15 hours.. THEN bring down to lager temps..

Those directions are terrible, IMO.

Pitching yeast that high leads to off-flavors that would be prevented if you did the following:

1) Pitch an appropriate size starter. See Mr. Malty or other yeast pitching software.

2) Pitch the yeast when the wort has cooled to fermentation temperatures. According to White Labs that is 52 - 58 F, not 70 - 74 F.

The directions you have are for those who do not use a yeast starter for liquid yeast and need to get fermentation going. Fermentation at that high of a temperature range leads to off-flavors, that may eventually mellow out through lagering, or you could prevent them entirely by pitching a starter when the wort is the fermentation temperature range.

 

[CDGoin]

That is what I was worried about.. that's why I didn't even try to get to the 70 degree range. But what I wrote was straight off the printed label on the vial. The Fermentation temps on their website and what they have on the vial do say low 50s'. But the 70 degree kick start is what they do advise on the Vial.

I got it up to the 60-65 range.. and re-pitched from the vial. Figured that was warm enough given its worked for my Ales and such.

In my case, I am doing a 5 gal batch of Best Brewers Octoberfest, and it just comes with one sachet of dry yeast.. as I have done I have heated up some water.. put a few spoons of DME into 2 cups of water, mix and let it sit for the 1-2 hour brew time and then pitch when it gets below 70 degrees. Then put in the fermentation room (its usually about 55 in there) and the next days its fermenting beautifully and I put it into the sink and cool down to 50. Wait 8 or so days.. check gravity, and then rise for the D-rest. This has worked well on my two lagers, and perfect for my 2 ales (although the ales don't get the cool down in the sink).

When I got stuck at day 5, I pitched the White Labs WLP820 liquid yeast from the vial. Didn't do a starter..

I guess this would be a good time to learn to make starters as I am about to switch to all-grain. That aside.. never needed a big one before.

So now have the little starter I did on brew day in there, and a vial of WLP820.. on Day 6. I am just crossing my fingers for an active vent when I get home tonight. Starting to read how long some people have had to wait on certain Lager strains to get busy.

My concern is with all the dead yeast (I assume they are dead) I will get off flavors now from them alone. Maybe leave it all alone for a few more days..

 

[beershere]

On day 5 I have a Krausen forming, with the fermenter at 59F now. This is after repitching after 3 nights with no action. I am also a bit concerned about off flavors with the large amount of inactive yeast in there.

I'm going to get it to secondary after fermentation starts to slow again.

Go Brewers.

 

[CDGoin]

There is hope then

 

[Darwin18]

There is certainly hope. You're going to make beer, and it might end up being okay, but if you want to make the best beer you can you should really look into starters for liquid yeast. Not every style will need a yeast starter but most benefit from it, and it's almost certainly necessary for lagers.

 

[beershere]

Yes, it's likely good this happened on my 4th batch.....I have previously used smack packs and never bothered with a starter. This was a slap in the face to just do a starter already......

All that work put in grinding and mashing and cooling and sanitizing, just to dump in some yeast I don't even know are alive.

I've seen the light....I'll use starters from now on.

 

[bratrules]

Yes, it's likely good this happened on my 4th batch.....I have previously used smack packs and never bothered with a starter. This was a slap in the face to just do a starter already......

All that work put in grinding and mashing and cooling and sanitizing, just to dump in some yeast I don't even know are alive.

I've seen the light....I'll use starters from now on.

Yeah man always make a starter!! Especially for lager as I stated in one of my earlier post I made huge starters for both my lager. And pitch your starter while its very active that way the yeast start eating as soon as they are pitched!! Cut down on your lag time. Oh and also on a side note I got 80% attenuation on both beers. So keep your yeast happy and you will get better beer lol.

 

[CDGoin]

And there was beer.. Not very active. BUt a nice 1/8" pure white foam on the top.. and the vent was a bubblin..

Looked as if room had stabilized at 60 so wasnt up in temps too bad. These yeastys maybe slow but they are alive. Now back to its water bath and down to the 49-53 range. Now that I know somethings going on I will let it sit for the next week or so.

I will just wait until within the 1.020 range and perform a D-rest on it to get it closer to 1.016.

 

[CDGoin]

I read a few things and think I now now what the problem was.. I didn't have bottled water around and went ahead and used tap. Since I was concerned about Chlorine.. I put in a campden tablet by what I was told was the right amount (1 per gallon).. found out that was for WINE.

For Beer and to help with chlorine you need only 1/4 a tablet.

I also read the campden tablets kill wild yeast.. etc..

So.. I am pretty sure the overdose of campden.. was a contributing factor to my slow fermentation.

Curious if you used campden too..?

 

[beershere]

No, I did not use Campden tablets....Just boiled my water pre mash. Good to hear you have some action now.

Mine skyrocketed to 66F on the aquarium thermometer in my 58F garage after one night of fermenting......going to put it back in the 50F bath now.....I'm thinking this is going to turn out steam beerish. We'll see!

 

[CDGoin]

Well day 6 and it was down to the same gravity as the 2rd batch.. So blended them together and am letting the temps slowly rise to do the D-rest and then to lager

Vent was a bubbling this morning so hopefully everything is good now. Fortunately my secondary is 30L, and I was right I dumped (accident and long story) almost exactly half of last batch.. These two ended up right at 30L. So if it comes out great.. then I will have plenty of it for a while at least.