3-in-1 "Boil Kettle, Jacketed Chiller, Conical Fermenter" by Brewha

[Baja_Brewer]

I still need to finish reading this but it is a bear mobile. Has anyone that is an active poster ordered a large? Seems like a pretty decent price for a 1-1.5bbl system, if it can actually produce a 45gallon yield!

And (this is probably in the thread)- what the highest volume yield that anyone with a medium has had?

 

[JB_Brewing2]

An early brew was 11.5 gallons but all I've ever tried to brew since was 10 gallons.

Ma femme aime la bière.

 

[Cmason]

Well,

My system delivery got a bit hosed up, but Nathan is working to correct it.

I had what I thought was going to be a simple business trip to Brussels this week. I missed getting caught in the airport explosion by 5 minutes.

I just not got to London via Eruostar train, the airport is a mess and will be closed for some time.

A hectic and sobering 48 hours. The people of Beligum and Brussels are great, keep them in your thoughts.

 

[nackedei]

And (this is probably in the thread)- what the highest volume yield that anyone with a medium has had?

Largest brew I've done in my medium was a Berliner Weisse. Sent ten gallons to kegs, five and change into a carboy with some apricots and Brett, and a half gallon into a 2 liter PET bottle that I chilled and carbed with a carbonator cap. Had a half gallon or so left over before reaching the dead space in the cone. So I guess that brew ended up being about 16.5.

But then I'm lazy, and always shoot to have a bit left over so I don't need to worry about anything/can force carb it with a cap to drink and sample immediately.

 

[OneManBrewery]

Unfortunately I haven't tried it out... But that's what the wedge wire looks like in my colander. I got a week off next week for some quality brew time.

 

[Cmason]

Onemanbrewery,

Where did you get the wedge wire? What size colender do you have?

Thanks!

 

[hgearle]

Little help from the gallery to make my first 11 gallon batch of IPA (medium BIAC).

Ingredients…29 lbs grain, 15.5 gallons water (no sparge), Original gravity 1.074

Brewsmith says that my Mash Volume needed of 17.79 is greater than my MT volume of 14.49. From what I have seen on this forum, I should be able to brew this beer, but Brewsmith says otherwise. Do you think this beer is doable in the medium BIAC?

Secondly, I am concerned about my salt additions for my Chicago water. I use Martin Brungard’s Spreadsheet for my salt/acid additions which have been great for my 5 gallon gravity system, and I want to run the additions I am calculating by you since I have never done a no sparge 15.5 gallon recirculating mash before. I told the spreadsheet that I am doing a 15.44 gallon mash and it says to add 27.8 grams (about 7 tsp) of gypsum, one half tsp of calcium chloride, and one quarter tsp salt.
My Chicago water will be cut by adding 30% distilled water and I will add 13 ounces of acidulated malt to the mash.

Does this all sound reasonable for a rather big IPA??? Thanks.

 

[Jimmy82]

Little help from the gallery to make my first 11 gallon batch of IPA (medium BIAC).

Ingredients…29 lbs grain, 15.5 gallons water (no sparge), Original gravity 1.074

Brewsmith says that my Mash Volume needed of 17.79 is greater than my MT volume of 14.49. From what I have seen on this forum, I should be able to brew this beer, but Brewsmith says otherwise. Do you think this beer is doable in the medium BIAC?

Secondly, I am concerned about my salt additions for my Chicago water. I use Martin Brungard’s Spreadsheet for my salt/acid additions which have been great for my 5 gallon gravity system, and I want to run the additions I am calculating by you since I have never done a no sparge 15.5 gallon recirculating mash before. I told the spreadsheet that I am doing a 15.44 gallon mash and it says to add 27.8 grams (about 7 tsp) of gypsum, one half tsp of calcium chloride, and one quarter tsp salt.
My Chicago water will be cut by adding 30% distilled water and I will add 13 ounces of acidulated malt to the mash.

Does this all sound reasonable for a rather big IPA??? Thanks.

The volumes are doable. My IPA is about 30lbs of malt and 60 liters of water in the mash. I'm not sure you'll hit the 1.074 you're aiming for with those volumes though.

I haven't really looked at the beersmith profiles included, but I'm guessing they only take the mash colander volume into account when doing that calculation, when really the important volume is that of the conical itself.

I'll post a bit more detail when I have a chance - posting this from my phone.

 

[limulus]

Limulus....That is funny!

Got my medium BIAC today (2 weeks in transit) and started to assemble it. What a nice piece of equipment! As others have said...it has such a nice finish and Nathan didn't cheap out on anything. This is a quality system and I am looking forward to making some great beer with it. I am lifting my glass of homebrew now and toasting to ... Nathan. Thanks for the ingenuity.

That really is me in the photo with just a little facial enhancement

 

[limulus]

Onemanbrewery,

Where did you get the wedge wire? What size colender do you have?

Thanks!

The wedge wire bottom is now an option you can order from Nathan. I posted something about that a page or two earlier. It is not a cheap upgrade, but wedge wire is always more spendy than a perf bottom.

 

[OneManBrewery]

Onemanbrewery,

Where did you get the wedge wire? What size colender do you have?

Thanks!

Limulus is right, It's now an upgrade option or it comes with the 4 in 1 BIAC. I have a small colander. I brewed for the first time with mine and the mash filtration never slowed.

I'm still working out the kinks but what is your procedure for cooling your wort? It took a lot longer and a lot more tap water then I thought it would. Are you guys using the water pressure regulator from Nathan?

 

[JB_Brewing2]

Limulus is right, It's now an upgrade option or it comes with the 4 in 1 BIAC. I have a small colander. I brewed for the first time with mine and the mash filtration never slowed.

I'm still working out the kinks but what is your procedure for cooling your wort? It took a lot longer and a lot more tap water then I thought it would. Are you guys using the water pressure regulator from Nathan?

I'm using the water pressure regulator and the PRV from Nathan with no issues. TN ground water temp will be higher (+10F) than MI ground water temp so it will take longer than what I experience. a glycol chiller may be the way to go if you don't want the long wait time.

 

[OneManBrewery]

Well after a little research I found out I had the in and out switched for the jacket... Whoops. Hopefully this will help next time.

 

[hgearle]

My first brewing experience with the medium BIAC went well, but with lots of question marks flying over my head.

Temperature control seemed great with the system temperature controller, but when measuring at the top of the mash tun with a temperature gauge, or during cooling, the readings were off. For example, during the mash a temp probe in the top of the mash read about 145F while the temp controller read 151F; and all throughout the boil my temp controller read 209F. When cooling, the temp controller said 72F and my temp probe at the top of the wort said 93F. (BTW, my temp probe is seated all the way in and read perfectly with just water on a test run). I called Nathan and he said that with temperature dispersion throughout the vessel that it was normal and given time to regulate the temps will begin to match (which they did). Have any of you more experienced guys/gals seen this?

Second. How much volume do you account for yeast/trub loss? I found that I dumped about a gallon and a half to clear the mess from the bottom of the conical (I used about 8 ounces of pellet hops dumped directly into the boil).

Third. My OG/FG gravity readings were low and I am now reading that with a no sparge system, that I should be increasing the malt by about 20-25% to hit my gravity. (reference: Brew magazine article written by John Palmer May/Jun 2002, Skip the Sparge). Do you increase your malt bill to make up for a no sparge system?

Lastly. I dialed down the power on the power controller to 25% while mashing. When I went to mash out and increase the mash temperature to 169F it wouldn’t make the temp rise. So, I started to increase the power % slowly and it took 40% power to eventually make the temp rise to 169F. That whole process of figuring that out took 40 minutes. So my question is, what power settings are you using to do the mash out? Do you just crank it up all at once or do it slowly?

Seems like with any new system, there is a learning curve.

 

[jsmoon888]

I have only brewed once with my medium BIAC and loved it.
On the temp I did have to calibrate the temp controller to my Thermapen using the ice water method. My boil was at 208 and I am at 300ft elevation. I decided to trust the new temp sensor and stop driving myself crazy unless the beer taste is off.
I recirculated slowly during mash leaving element at 100% while automatically controlling it with the temp control. I did not do a mash out. Is that necessary? I don't remember seeing one in Nathan's video. My OG was low and I was at 68% efficiency so I made adjustments in Brewsmith for future batches.
I too was disappointed with the speed of cooling. I used tap water to 125f them switched to Nathan's Lindr cooling unit on auto temp control and left the house. On my next brew I will recirculate during boil to sanitize the pump and circulate during cooling to speed up the process. This made a huge difference with my old system with keggle and copper tubing chiller.
Overall I love the system so far! Especially not having to clean for hours. First brew was 6 hours and it can easily be 5. Next time I am going to have mash water ready the night before so I can just flip it on when I wake up and it will be waiting when I'm ready to mash in.

 

[JB_Brewing2]

At about 840' (AMSL), my temp controller reads 206 to 207 when the boil begins to roll and I use that as the start for Brewsmith timing (never gets above 207). I keep the controller at 100% for strike water, mash, and boil temps. (Recently have been considering killing the element while raising the colander to avoid the potential for dry-firing of the element.) Sparge for a short period (15 min.) until the wort is clear and then just let the colander drain for maybe a half hour/45 minutes. For fermentation, the controller has been set at 3% to maintain warmth in my cold Michigan shop.

I too prep muni water the night before and treat it with campden tab to remove chloramine. Wake up the next day and plug in, then grab breakfast while heating my strike water. Grains are also ground the night before which helps to make a shorter brew day.

Started brewing in the '90's and have yet to have a bad beer (knock on wood). I will say that the medium BIAC has improved efficiency, greatly reduced clean-up, and shortened the brew day after over a dozen 10 gal. brews on it.

Have a Zombie Dust clone fermenting that required ~30 lbs grain and 15 3/4 oz. of Citra hops. Can't wait.

 

[cuda6pak]

My first brewing experience with the medium BIAC went well, but with lots of question marks flying over my head.

Temperature control seemed great with the system temperature controller, but when measuring at the top of the mash tun with a temperature gauge, or during cooling, the readings were off. For example, during the mash a temp probe in the top of the mash read about 145F while the temp controller read 151F; and all throughout the boil my temp controller read 209F. When cooling, the temp controller said 72F and my temp probe at the top of the wort said 93F. (BTW, my temp probe is seated all the way in and read perfectly with just water on a test run). I called Nathan and he said that with temperature dispersion throughout the vessel that it was normal and given time to regulate the temps will begin to match (which they did). Have any of you more experienced guys/gals seen this?

Same here - don't worry about it too much. Before pitching yeast I definitely give it a good amount of time at 65 or so to make sure the temperature has equalized throughout the wort.

Second. How much volume do you account for yeast/trub loss? I found that I dumped about a gallon and a half to clear the mess from the bottom of the conical (I used about 8 ounces of pellet hops dumped directly into the boil).

I use the same trub loss settings provided by Nathan for the BIAC in Beersmith. Majority of the time I don't even dump trub before pitching yeast unless I'm wanting to harvest. Then when racking I just open up the racking port into a bucket until it runs clear after a few seconds and know all the junk is below the racking port.

Third. My OG/FG gravity readings were low and I am now reading that with a no sparge system, that I should be increasing the malt by about 20-25% to hit my gravity. (reference: Brew magazine article written by John Palmer May/Jun 2002, Skip the Sparge). Do you increase your malt bill to make up for a no sparge system?

Like any other system, adjust the efficiency as necessary once you gather data and adjust your variables. I usually hit 70% pretty consistently so I have left it there.

Lastly. I dialed down the power on the power controller to 25% while mashing. When I went to mash out and increase the mash temperature to 169F it wouldn’t make the temp rise. So, I started to increase the power % slowly and it took 40% power to eventually make the temp rise to 169F. That whole process of figuring that out took 40 minutes. So my question is, what power settings are you using to do the mash out? Do you just crank it up all at once or do it slowly?

25% is the sweet spot that I have found for mashing. 100% and you run the risk of scorching the wort or constantly overshooting your recirc wort/mash temp. And yes, when I do my mashout I raise it to right at 40-42.5% depending on ambient temp.

Seems like with any new system, there is a learning curve.

See answers above

 

[ron8]

This is a little off topic. Sorry. Using my phone and not used to posting with it.

I use the medium BIAC. Nathan recently on a call about some accessories I ordered mentioned I could vorlauf via the racking port using the chugger pump. Up to now, since my first batch I haven't been doing any circulating, sparge, vorlauf, just a single step mash. I have done 9 batches. I let the colander drain for 10 to 15 minutes while the wort heats to boiling. So there is no additional time in doing this.

Wondering about your experiences, advice about the need, benefit of vorlauf. I understand the benefit when transferring to a separate boil kettle is to leave behind fine particles, giving a clearer wort to boil. And other benefit is to remove more extracted sugars from the spent malt.

I there a benefit to vorlauf other than better efficiency, recovering more of the sugars to users of the BIAC?

Thanks...ron8

 

[ron8]

I've brewed 9 batches with my medium BIAC. I learned as I went, with a couple foul-ups I'd rather not admit in print. haha. Last few batches I have now hit stride in getting water volume accurate.

I have not attempted to measure the amount of water lost in trub, as it is a mixture of water and solids, a slurry. The volume of the trub is consistent within a narrow band. I am brewing 10 gallon batches, with anywhere from 22 to 26 pounds of malt. I have not yet dumped trub out the bottom port until after racking beer. The top of the trub level is either at the bottom of the racking port, or just above the top lip of the racking port. I rack from the side, racking port. And so when beer stops flowing, I know I am done racking. One case I had a pint and a quarter extra beer. But since I figured out the water volume I generally end up with 2 five gallon corny kegs full, or just a pint short.

The water to grain ratio is higher than I expected. I'll follow up with that. It's much higher. I am doing 90 minute boils because the recipes I am using call for it. And, I'm using Belgian pilsner malt almost exclusively, with some other coloring/flavoring malts in small percentages. To drive off DSM which is common in this malt boil for 90 minutes. I hope that is right, all you experts out there. I am quite new to home brewing, just a year.

Hope this helps, even if it is not a direct reply to your questions. Ron8.

 

[ron8]

This reply is addressing your question hgearle, concerning trub volume, #824 post

 

[ron8]

:rockin:OK. I really have to get used to this posting stuff. Mr. hgearle's post #824 was the topic of this and the last 2 posts I made. Ron8.

 

[hgearle]

Thanks cuda6pak and ron8, that is the info and confirmation I needed to ensure that my system is operating normally.

After I dumped about a gallon of trub from the bottom port, I tried to get clear wort from the racking port and it still had trub. So I dumped a little more and it finally showed clearer wort. I then dry hopped into secondary.
I figured that the large amount of trub was a result of my brew being a 1.074 IPA with a lot of pellet hops.

I played with Brewsmith numbers to see what efficiency I got and it was 62% based on the final OG gravity. I figure that I either have to live with the lower efficiency number or increase the amount of grain to make up for the loss in efficiency.

Thanks cuda6pak for validating the power settings for the mash and mashout. It helps to know what is working for others.

 

[RiverCityBrewer]

This isn't specifically a 3-1 question, but how is everyone else dealing with beerstone? I'm not sure if its my water source, but it seems like I have a constant "film" left over when I am done cleaning. Here is a pic after sitting for a few days after cleaning where I took a nylon brush and rubbed the side a little. Is this beerstone or something else?

Cheers,

Joe

 

[cuda6pak]

I got a buildup of it after several brews/ferments. Now I hit it with some Barkeeper's friend whenever I feel like it to clean it off.

 

[Jimmy82]

I recirculated some PBW and 200° water for about 30 minutes and it removed all buildup...this was after approximately 1.5 years of use, and brewing every 3 weeks on average.

 

[cuda6pak]

I recirculated some PBW and 200° water for about 30 minutes and it removed all buildup...this was after approximately 1.5 years of use, and brewing every 3 weeks on average.

Good to know. I'm at 14 months since my first brew and haven't done a PBW soak since my initial one when I first got the unit.

 

[mdime]

I too was disappointed with the speed of cooling. I used tap water to 125f them switched to Nathan's Lindr cooling unit on auto temp control and left the house. On my next brew I will recirculate during boil to sanitize the pump and circulate during cooling to speed up the process. This made a huge difference with my old system with keggle and copper tubing chiller.

While the cooling times are definitely longer than when I used a counter-flow chiller, I find the simplicity and repeat-ability well worth it.

I also have the Lindr cooling unit and use one of its beer-line coils to pre-chill my groundwater during the initial chilling phase (to around 110deg). It helps speed up that initial phase and lets me get a little cooler with groundwater. At that point I then switch to recirculating the Lindr unit's tank water. I have a rotatable racking arm attached to the racking port of my BIAC and it helps to circulate the wort during chilling and that also helps.

 

[RiverCityBrewer]

I recirculated some PBW and 200° water for about 30 minutes and it removed all buildup...this was after approximately 1.5 years of use, and brewing every 3 weeks on average.

I got a buildup of it after several brews/ferments. Now I hit it with some Barkeeper's friend whenever I feel like it to clean it off.

Thanks for the input, I'll give it a go.

Cheers,

Joe

 

[jsmoon888]

Update after my second brew session: I circulated during the entire boil and cooling and it sped up both heating and cooling significantly. My gravity was still below the 68% target so I think I will try rinsing the grain next time with 168 degree wort to see if it helps. I really don't want to hassle with heating sparge water on a separate device. Have never tried a cold sparge. Comments welcome.

 

[Baja_Brewer]

Update after my second brew session: I circulated during the entire boil and cooling and it sped up both heating and cooling significantly. My gravity was still below the 68% target so I think I will try rinsing the grain next time with 168 degree wort to see if it helps. I really don't want to hassle with heating sparge water on a separate device. Have never tried a cold sparge. Comments welcome.

No experience, but this is hot off the press and relevant:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=579304