2 row and 6 row question

[tomwhit19]

So I went to my LHBS to pick some grains and hops for a upcoming brew day and it’s for the same beer I made about a month ago as well, which consists of 6 row and 2 row for base malt. The last time I picked up these grains they bagged and labeled Avery thing separate for me and his time when I told the guy I would 6 row and 2 row he says that they don’t exist anymore and that there was a cross pollination between between the barleys and that it’s basically a combination of the two and they aren’t separate anymore

I’m just looking for some validity in this, as I’ve tried to find something online to suggest this and am coming up empty handed

 

[Master]

It sounds like he's FOS. Full Of Stuff.

 

[Master]

Now on a practical standpoint, a good amount of 2 row does have more diastatic power than it used to (good for mashing things that can't self convert) but it's not that 2 row and 6 row don't exist.

 

[waldoar15]

Some of the distributors like LD Carlson that supply some shops quit carrying it. It's still available other places.

 

[balrog]

There is 6 row
There is 2 row
I'm sure somewhere there is cross pollination betwixt and some franken-row out there, plotting to take over the Canadian midwest grain belt and drain the Great Lakes in a bid to destabilize the earth's rotation to constantly point itself at the sun.

Then again, it also sounds like a story, told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

 

[Lefou]

Hahaha....whatta maroon.
Unfortunately there's a lot of that going around. Maybe there's no such thing because his shop doesn't sell 6-row barley, but it exists.

 

[tomwhit19]

I was there a month ago and got 6 row and 2 row for a brew day, I mean if they don’t carry it why would every time I go there even to get 2 row would they not say anything until now

 

[waldoar15]

Hahaha....whatta maroon.
Unfortunately there's a lot of that going around. Maybe there's no such thing because his shop doesn't sell 6-row barley, but it exists.

I know it exists as I just got some last week. But the part about LD Carlson is true. My LBHS is supplied by them.

 

[grampamark]

One problem is that very few growers plant 6-row varieties any more. According to recent reports by both the American and Canadian malting associations, and those countries' respective ag departments, 6-row varieties have accounted for <10% of barley production in recent years.

I'm a grain farmer from Montana. Our state has been one of the leading barley producers for years, but planted barley acreage has been declining here, as well. Part of the reason for that is the price of malt barley hasn't been competitive with the prices paid for other crops which are well suited to the area. Another reason is that the BMC brewers have reduced the amount of barley they are willing to contract for. Demand for beer isn't decreasing; apparently, the use of adjuncts (which are even cheaper than barley) is increasing.

Mark

 

[brandonlovesbeer]

Ditto on the FoS!

Just find another HBS.
Clearly he is not reputable enough to know what he’s trying to sell.

 

[tomwhit19]

I went back today and talked to the guy I normally deal with, got it sorted out

 

[user 125772]

I'm sort of curious what sort of recipe you're brewing that calls for 6-row ?

 

[Morrey]

This may sound "novice-like", but in all the beers I have made, I have never used 6 row barley. I may have used a tractor trailer load of 2 row, but never once have used 6 row.

Diastatic Power aside, if we made a most simple SMaSH beer, one with 2 row and one with 6 row, neutral yeast, hops and all else being exactly the same, what differences in taste or mouthfeel would we expect?

 

[tomwhit19]

I'm sort of curious what sort of recipe you're brewing that calls for 6-row ?

Cream Ale

 

[waldoar15]

This may sound "novice-like", but in all the beers I have made, I have never used 6 row barley. I may have used a tractor trailer load of 2 row, but never once have used 6 row.

Diastatic Power aside, if we made a most simple SMaSH beer, one with 2 row and one with 6 row, neutral yeast, hops and all else being exactly the same, what differences in taste or mouthfeel would we expect?

I use it in the CAP that I brew, have for years. Many people say it has a bit more of a grainy flavor than 2-row. Some people can't taste any difference. I mainly use it so the beer stays within style.

I'll tell you there is a big difference in taste between 6-row brewers and 6-row distillers malt. I got 10 lbs of distillers malt by mistake and it made a rough beer.

 

[ba-brewer]

I went back today and talked to the guy I normally deal with, got it sorted out

What was his story?

This may sound "novice-like", but in all the beers I have made, I have never used 6 row barley. I may have used a tractor trailer load of 2 row, but never once have used 6 row.

Diastatic Power aside, if we made a most simple SMaSH beer, one with 2 row and one with 6 row, neutral yeast, hops and all else being exactly the same, what differences in taste or mouthfeel would we expect?

I heard 6row has slightly more husk material so it help with laudering when you have huskless adjuncts, something about them being slight thinner from the way they grow. Slight higher protein also puts back body that is lost by adjuncts.

 

[waldoar15]

What was his story?


I heard 6row has slightly more husk material so it help with laudering when you have huskless adjuncts, something about them being slight thinner from the way they grow. Slight higher protein also puts back body that is lost by adjuncts.

The adjuncts were originally used to cut the protein level of the 6-row malt in the US to make clearer and lighter Lagers before 2-row became widely cultivated in this country.

 

[ba-brewer]

The adjuncts were originally used to cut the protein level of the 6-row malt in the US to make clearer and lighter Lagers before 2-row became widely cultivated in this country.

That is a true statement but 6row as well as the adjuncts continue to be used along with 2row.

 

[Transamguy77]

I have a rice lager beer I make and the last time I went to the LHBS they stopped carrying it. I used some amalyse powder and it seemed to work, I couldn't taste the difference.

I'm told that the modern 2 row is much more modified and 6 row is not needed to help convert starches because the 2 row can do it now.

 

[SEndorf]

I'm told that the modern 2 row is much more modified and 6 row is not needed to help convert starches because the 2 row can do it now.

This. The conversion numbers of modern 2 row make it negligible.
But I know a couple of old school brewers that still use it when they have a shtload of adjuncts. Maybe old methods die hard, but they claim to notice the difference.

 

[Morrey]

I may have my head in the sand like the proverbial ostrich, but I don't think much about using 6 row and never felt a pressing need to search it out. Maybe I am simply not aware, but doesn't seem to me that 6 row is on my "must have" list. I am sure there may be a definite need and use for it, or maybe the recipes I use don't focus on 6 row. My LBHS orders it as a special request, but doesn't carry it regularly. This tells me the demand is possibly low on 6 row.

 

[Transamguy77]

6 row is supposed to have a higher diastatic power than 2 row so if you are using an adjunct like rice or corn you can can better conversion if you use 6 row.

I only ever looked into using it because I was looking to use rice as an adjunct and I was looking for a super dry finish like Sapporo so I was told to use 6 row instead of 2 row. It's not so common to use now as we are finding out since no store stocks it.

 

[Morrey]

6 row is supposed to have a higher diastatic power than 2 row so if you are using an adjunct like rice or corn you can can better conversion if you use 6 row.

I only ever looked into using it because I was looking to use rice as an adjunct and I was looking for a super dry finish like Sapporo so I was told to use 6 row instead of 2 row. It's not so common to use now as we are finding out since no store stocks it.

Did you ever make the Sapporo clone you mentioned? I often order a Sapporo when we go for sushi, but for some reason I've never thought to brew a clone....until now.

 

[Transamguy77]

Yes I've made it a few times now it's a pretty simple recipe.

10 gallon batch
5lbs of cooked rice, something gelatinous (sushi rice works excellent).
12lbs 6 row or 2 row with some added amalyse.
2oz of Saaz @60
2oz of SaaS @15
S 34/70 or S 23 lager yeast, I prefer S 23.
Add your rice to your mash and mash low 148 and at least a 90 minute mash.

It's a great easy drinking beer, it's on my need to brew soon so it's ready for summer list.

 

[The_Bishop]

Is that 5 pounds of rice measured dry, then cooked?

 

[tomwhit19]

What was his story?

So like i said i went back and spoke with the guy that normally helps me out, and the guy that told me that wasn't necessarily wrong he just didnt say it the right way, so the brand of base malts they carry had a cross polination between their 2 row and 6 row and the 6 row of this particular brand basically started growing as a modified 2 row, but my lhbs does carry 6 row the guy the day before just didnt know i guess, i got what i needed, what i got one month ago

 

[soccerdad]

So like i said i went back and spoke with the guy that normally helps me out, and the guy that told me that wasn't necessarily wrong he just didnt say it the right way, so the brand of base malts they carry had a cross polination between their 2 row and 6 row and the 6 row of this particular brand basically started growing as a modified 2 row, but my lhbs does carry 6 row the guy the day before just didnt know i guess, i got what i needed, what i got one month ago

Not good enough. The guy in the OP must still be flogged !!

 

[Lefou]

Give him a personal tour of The Pit of Misery. Dilly dilly.

 

[Transamguy77]

Is that 5 pounds of rice measured dry, then cooked?

Yes 5lbs dry then I usually cook it the night before and actually add some more water to it so it sucks up as much as it can before adding it to the mash and sucks up the mash water.

 

[ddibbern5]

Take a listen to the latest beer smith podcast -
https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcas...isodeGuid=http://beersmith.com/content/?p=520
They briefly discuss 2 row vs 6 row associated with cream ale.
Cheers