Treehouse Yeast - temperature range and profile question

[ProblemChild]

Hi all,

Last week, I cracked open a can of Lights On from tree house and enjoyed the hoppy goodness within.

As I got near the bottom, I decided to see if I could collect the yeast and grow it to sufficient quantity to use it at home.

Well, a week later and I am sitting on a number of mason jars with this yeast in my keezer.

Before I jump into using it, I was wondering if anyone in here had knowledge of what the temperature range for this yeast is and how to profile the fermentation temperatures. I did observe that is was active at a fairly low temperature, so my guess is first two days at about 58-60°F, free-rise to room temps (68°F) over two or three days and then D-rest at 70-72°F then finish out at 65-68°F, but that is just a guess. Anyone have any suggestions?

I am surprised with how slowly this stuff cold crashes - my Friday samples are only clear at the top 1/2". most yeasts are well on their way to dropping but this one seems to just stay in suspension.

 

[RedIvan16]

Sounds like you got a good pull from the can!

Treehouse basically uses Conan yeast in their beers, which is more or less commercially available as "Vermont IPA" from some sources. Here's the literal yeast strain we use at the brewery I intern with:
http://gigayeast.com/yeasts/gy054-vermont-ipa-yeast.html

According to my boss its same one they use at Hill Farmstead, and from tasting Treehouse over and over I'm certain its the same thing. I know we pitch at about 64, then let it rise to about 68-70 after a few days.

 

[ProblemChild]

Sounds like you got a good pull from the can!

Treehouse basically uses Conan yeast in their beers, which is more or less commercially available as "Vermont IPA" from some sources. Here's the literal yeast strain we use at the brewery I intern with:
http://gigayeast.com/yeasts/gy054-vermont-ipa-yeast.html

According to my boss its same one they use at Hill Farmstead, and from tasting Treehouse over and over I'm certain its the same thing. I know we pitch at about 64, then let it rise to about 68-70 after a few days.

Thanks. I have used the Omega OYL-052 DIPA which has not been stated as such, but is allegedly Conan. It has not behaved like this at all - at least with regard to activity in the starter (this is way more active) and how hard this is to crash out. I have heard tell of it being related to WY1318, but again, different behavior, does not strike me as a top-cropper. I will probaly use the temp recommendations you put out as I can see no reason why they would not work well.

 

[Cavpilot2000]

Sounds like you got a good pull from the can!

Treehouse basically uses Conan yeast in their beers, which is more or less commercially available as "Vermont IPA" from some sources. Here's the literal yeast strain we use at the brewery I intern with:
http://gigayeast.com/yeasts/gy054-vermont-ipa-yeast.html

According to my boss its same one they use at Hill Farmstead, and from tasting Treehouse over and over I'm certain its the same thing. I know we pitch at about 64, then let it rise to about 68-70 after a few days.

I've read genetic analysis shows Treehouse isn't using Conan, or if they are, it's blended with another yeast (maybe two).

 

[flugelizor]

Sounds like you sipped out of the can for a while before you decided to harvest yeast out of it? This sounds unsanitary.

Try this next time:
1. clean the can.
2. wipe down the lip with alcohol or sanitizer,
3. Pour out your beer
4. Add wort and swirl to mix
5. Pour it into a small bottle with airlock

 

[ProblemChild]

Sounds like you sipped out of the can for a while before you decided to harvest yeast out of it? This sounds unsanitary.

Try this next time:
1. clean the can.
2. wipe down the lip with alcohol or sanitizer,
3. Pour out your beer
4. Add wort and swirl to mix
5. Pour it into a small bottle with airlock

Nope - poured the beer into my favorite glass. I like pouring a bit at a time so there is a big open space between the top of the liquid and the top of the glass. A small swirl brings out the amazing smell of the hops.

Would have been good to wipe the lip of the can for sure though.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Treehouse basically uses Conan yeast in their beers, which is more or less commercially available as "Vermont IPA" from some sources.

Hi all,

Last week, I cracked open a can of Lights On from tree house and enjoyed the hoppy goodness within.

As I got near the bottom, I decided to see if I could collect the yeast and grow it to sufficient quantity to use it at home.

The Julius yeast has been one of the most intensively studied on HBT, I suggest you take this over to this thread where 10 colonies were taken from Julius and their DNA analysed. None of them are WLP4000 (the Yeast Bay version of Conan - Conans from different commercial sources do behanve differently, but they shouldn't be wildly different at the DNA level), instead they look like they're using Fermentis dry yeasts, almost certainly S-04 and T-58 and possibly WB-06, plus possible F-2 for carbonation. Certainly people have reported Julius-like results with a mix of S-04:T-58:WB-06 in the 85:12:3 kind of range. There's been sightings of tanks set at 60F and 66F at the brewery, but these things never quite translate to homebrew and people have come up with various temperature profiles to get something that works experimentally.

That thread has attracted lots of people interested in Treehouse cloning more generally, if you're interested enough to have harvested yeast then it's probably worth setting aside an evening to read the whole thread.

 

[Joon1975]

I received 2 beers of Julius and one of each of Alter Ego and Hurricane. I’m interested in harvesting the yeast. I’ve never done it before. Can someone explain to me how to do it?

I just start making starters so any help would be appreciated! Thanks!

 

[ProblemChild]

I simply poured the quantity desired

I received 2 beers of Julius and one of each of Alter Ego and Hurricane. I’m interested in harvesting the yeast. I’ve never done it before. Can someone explain to me how to do it?

I just start making starters so any help would be appreciated! Thanks!

Prior to drinking said beverage, I made a weak 500ml starter (1.020) and chilled to 60°F. I poured the beer slowly into a glass (well, not this time as much as I would planning to harvest yeast as I was not even thinking about harvesting), ensuring I did not disturb the little spot of yeast on the bottom. Typically, I pout the last bit out very slowly to ensure nothing escapes. Afterwards, cover the can with starsan-ed aluminum foil and let the yeast warm for about 20 min . Add to the starter and let er rip. When you get good activity, add a liter of starter with a gravity of about 1.050 (will dilute with the existing starter) and crash after 24 hours or so. You can wash or not wash the yeast, it is up to you.

 

[ProblemChild]

That thread has attracted lots of people interested in Treehouse cloning more generally, if you're interested enough to have harvested yeast then it's probably worth setting aside an evening to read the whole thread.

Great idea. Thanks

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Prior to drinking said beverage, I made a weak 500ml starter (1.020) and chilled to 60°F. I poured the beer slowly into a glass (well, not this time as much as I would planning to harvest yeast as I was not even thinking about harvesting), ensuring I did not disturb the little spot of yeast on the bottom. Typically, I pout the last bit out very slowly to ensure nothing escapes. Afterwards, cover the can with starsan-ed aluminum foil and let the yeast warm for about 20 min . Add to the starter and let er rip. When you get good activity, add a liter of starter with a gravity of about 1.050 (will dilute with the existing starter) and crash after 24 hours or so. You can wash or not wash the yeast, it is up to you.

This will work if the brewery is using a single strain - but as per that other thread, there seem to be at least 4 different strains in Julius so you won't get a stable proportion of the different strains. Worse, they seem to be using a specialist bottling strain - they tend to be very aggressive and "take over" a blend, but don't make very nice beer. If Alter Ego and Hurricane are anything like Julius, you'd be far better off just buying yeast from Fermentis.

 

[ProblemChild]

This will work if the brewery is using a single strain - but as per that other thread, there seem to be at least 4 different strains in Julius so you won't get a stable proportion of the different strains. Worse, they seem to be using a specialist bottling strain - they tend to be very aggressive and "take over" a blend, but don't make very nice beer. If Alter Ego and Hurricane are anything like Julius, you'd be far better off just buying yeast from Fermentis.

Sounds like I should lead off with something out of the fridge. Have a hoppy pale ready to go for this weekend. May just use WY1272 and add this yeast and priming sugar to the keg.... 12

 

[ProblemChild]

Worse, they seem to be using a specialist bottling strain - they tend to be very aggressive and "take over" a blend, but don't make very nice beer. If Alter Ego and Hurricane are anything like Julius, you'd be far better off just buying yeast from Fermentis.

Explains what I am seeing in the starters I am making - stuff is aggressive and does not crash. Also, I noticed an odor that was both funky and a little sulfury. I can only imagine that by your description, more than a generation away and all that will be left is the "bottling strain" you mentined

I do see a great possibility of starting with a good character yeast (WY1968 comes to mind) in my DIPA's and finishing with this stuff...

 

[Northern_Brewer]

If you're not going to follow the DNA evidence and use Fermentis, then just use Wyeast 1318, which seems to be the go-to yeast for this kind of beer at the moment.

 

[ProblemChild]

If you're not going to follow the DNA evidence and use Fermentis, then just use Wyeast 1318, which seems to be the go-to yeast for this kind of beer at the moment.

I have four strains available to me right now (hence the reason for the choice) and Fermentis is not among them. I also do not (yet) have 1318.

However, the Fermentis combo is on the agenda.

 

[RedIvan16]

If they use a blended yeast that would not surprise me. I know a lot bigger breweries have house yeasts for certain beers, and Northern Brewer is right in saying that sometimes small amounts of different strains are adding during canning.

Regardless, as per your original question, I think treating what you have from the can like you would Conan or 1318 is a safe bet. Pitch at 64, hold for a few days, then raise the temp up to 66-68 and you should be fine. I seriously doubt Treehouse's strain is being chilled down lower than 60.

Actually, if you guys want I can ask my boss if he knows what strain they use. He knows the brewers at Treehouse pretty well.

 

[ProblemChild]

If they use a blended yeast that would not surprise me. I know a lot bigger breweries have house yeasts for certain beers, and Northern Brewer is right in saying that sometimes small amounts of different strains are adding during canning.

Regardless, as per your original question, I think treating what you have from the can like you would Conan or 1318 is a safe bet. Pitch at 64, hold for a few days, then raise the temp up to 66-68 and you should be fine. I seriously doubt Treehouse's strain is being chilled down lower than 60.

Actually, if you guys want I can ask my boss if he knows what strain they use. He knows the brewers at Treehouse pretty well.

That would be awesome. I know I will never be able to threaten these guys and only am able to get a can every now and then, so even trying to emulate it would be fantastic.

 

[RedIvan16]

That would be awesome. I know I will never be able to threaten these guys and only am able to get a can every now and then, so even trying to emulate it would be fantastic.

So I asked him while I was there this weekend, he confirmed they use Conan yeast. It may be their own house version after a few generations, but its basically Conan. I would treat the stuff you pulled from the can like Conan in that case!

 

[ProblemChild]

So I asked him while I was there this weekend, he confirmed they use Conan yeast. It may be their own house version after a few generations, but its basically Conan. I would treat the stuff you pulled from the can like Conan in that case!

Thank you. I greatly appreciate you following up. Great stuff. Thanks again.

 

[isomerization]

Thank you. I greatly appreciate you following up. Great stuff. Thanks again.

How was the beer you made with the TH dregs?

 

[ProblemChild]

Without a single point or quote of any real solid evidence, I chose to not use it. It seems entirely possible that they use a finishing yeast in secondary - one that is aggressive (more so than Conan) but not highly attenuative. I have never seen Conan that flocculant. The yeast I gathered created a hard cake at the bottom and dropped clear within two days. It crashed out like S-04. My guess is that this is done to counter hop creep. It also prevents anyone from using their strain of Conan or whatever they use if it is not a blend already.