Working on First Imperial Stout All Grain

[Bashiba]

Planning on doing my first Imperial Stout All Grain in a couple weeks and am looking for feedback for the recipe. I want to be a big chocolaty, smokey, black as black stout, not overly hoppy.

Here is what I'm Considering.
15 lbs Base 2 Row
2 lbs Chocolate
2 lbs Smoked Malt
1/2 lb Black Patent
1/2 lb 120 Caramel

1oz Chinook at 90min
1oz Styrian Goldings 30min
1oz Styrian Goldings 10min
Also considering some Star Anise in the boil at some point as well.

Beersmith figures it at 10.58% and 48 IBU's.

Not really sure what yeast to use to convert this much, would 2 starters of Safale 05 work ok?

Assuming I need to mash high like maybe 156 for good body.

All feedback would be appreciated.
Thanks

 

[sjlammer]

I think you are mashing a little too high. I'd put a half pound of crystal 60 and 2 oz of torrified wheat, and then mash at 152. with an OG that high, i think you will not beable to finish any lower that 1.020-1.025.

 

[jjp36]

Here's a couple things. You probably want to use some roasted barley in addition to the chocolate. So maybe do 1lb roasted barley and 1lb chocolate.

What kind of smoked malt are you using? Rauch malt or Peated malt. If its peat smoked malt 2 lbs is going to be wayyyy to much.

With all that roasted malt plus the crystal you already have enough unfermentables to give this beer body, so i would mash lower, probably around 152. I also like to use oats in my imperial stouts, but that is just my personal preference.

Don't make a starter with the S-05. If you want you can rehydrate it. I usually just sprinkle it right on top and don't bother.

 

[Bashiba]

Thanks for the quick replies and thoughts guys.

I was thinking 2 lbs of Rauch Malt, but if peated has a bigger flavor, maybe I'll go 1 lb of that and add a 1lb of roasted barley like suggested.

Why no starter for 05? And is one packet enough?

Also curious what 2 oz of torrified wheat will add to the beer?

 

[jjp36]

Please do not use 1lb of peated malt. You will need to age this beer for 6 years before you can start drinking it. I think the most i would use it about 4oz. I used 2 oz in a scotch ale i made and its still very prominent 1.5 years later.

You don't need to make starters for dry yeasts since they have a higher cell count per package then the liquid strains. You can either rehydrate them in warm water or just sprinkle them on top of the wort. I usually just sprinkle them on top. You might be able to get away with 1 packet, but i always pitch 2 into bigger beers like this.

I'm not sure about the torrified wheat since I've never used it, but i think at small amounts like that it helps with head retention

 

[Bashiba]

So if Peated is that strong, would my original plan of 2lbs of Rauch Malt be ok, or is that to much as well. I just want to make sure I get a nice big smokey flavor coming through.

Thanks for the info on the peated malt, now you have my head spinning for a new batch.

 

[jjp36]

I've never used rauchmalt before, so i'm not sure how much you would need. But i think you would need more then 2 pounds if you want the beer really smokey.

For the peated, i would probably use somewhere between 4-6 oz and that should give you a strong smoked flavor.

 

[sjlammer]

I wouldn't use any peated malt, use beechwood smoked rauch malt. 2 pounds should be fine. The thing with smoked beer is that less is more. I will check brewing classics styles for smoked beer recipes and get back to you tonight on how much the recipes use.

torriefied wheat is for head retention.... scratch the torriefied wheat (well you can use it) I would use 0.5- 1.0 pounds of flaked wheat for a creamy head and superior mouth feel.

For a beer that big, you should use two packets of safale-05.

+1 on the pound of dark roasted barley to replace one pound of chocalate. bump up the crystal 120 to one pound.

I might leave the anise out. as i read in another thread "to many competing flavors can muddy the overall taste of the beer" (either way though... its your call)

 

[sjlammer]

Robust Porter in brewing classic styles uses 3 pounds of rauch malt.

 

[Bashiba]

Thanks for all the help sjlammer
Right now here is what I"m thinking
13lbs Base 2 row
1lb Dark Roasted Barley
1lb Chocolate
3lbs Smoked
1lb 120
1/2 Black Patent

1oz Chinook at 90min
1oz Styrian Goldings 30min
1oz Styrian Goldings 10min

2 Safale 05

I'm not sure on the star anise yet, only because I don't have any, if I find some locally I'm going to use it if not, I'm sure it will be fine without. I agree with the simplicity factor in most cases, but as for big stouts I love them when they are ultra complex, and I really love the Anise in the finish of some of my favorite stouts and Porters. Old Rasputin and Anchor Steam Porter both come to mind.

 

[jjp36]

another option would be to steep the star anise in some vodka or everclear and then add it after fermentation if there isn't enough of that character for you.

As far as i know i don't think either Old Rasputin or Anchor Steam Porter have any actual anise in them.

 

[Bashiba]

Ya I don't suppose either of those beers actually use them, but I always get a hint of anise in the finish of both, I wonder what creates that?

What about using Fennel Seeds for the flavor, could I put them in late in the boil say 15 minutes, or even add them 2 the secondary?

I suppose the easy way to go would be just to give it a quick hit of Sambuca or absinthe before bottling.

 

[jjp36]

The trouble with doing it that way, is that if you have never made a beer with them before, it becomes hard to judge how much you need. If you add it to taste after fermentation is over, then you can be more precise in controlling the intensity of the flavors.

You can make a spice tea with either fennel or anise or both and see if that adds the flavor you were looking for and then add at bottling time until you get the flavor profile you're after.

 

[Bashiba]

Here is what I ended up going with
14lbs Base 2 row
1lb Dark Roasted Barley
1lb Chocolate
2.5 lbs Smoked Malt
1lb 120
1/2 Black Patent

1oz Chinook at 90min
1oz Styrian Goldings 30min
1oz Styrian Goldings 10min

2 Nottingham

OG 1.095
Just moved it to a secondary it measured
1.020, so looking really good, it fermented so well it blew all the way through my blow off hose and overflowed the milk jug it run into.

Tried the sample and its already tasting good, I'll report back when its finished.

Thanks for all the advice