WLP 820-need to throw a HBT lifeline

[wallybangbang]

So i brew with two of my friends every month at my house. They usually ferment their beers here because I have a temp controlled freezer. They recently made a rye lager with WLP 820 Oktoberfest. I have been telling them for a while they need to make starters but wont take my advice. Well anyway their lager is five days in and showing no signs of fermentation . No bubblin, no gravity drop and no Krausen.
Here is my question. I have a vial of WLP 830 German lager I was saving for another batch. Any thoughts on making a starter and throwing that in there? From what I think the 830 would just take over. That is what the friends want to do, and I'm not making the 90 min round trip to the brew store for them for another vial of 820. Your thoughts please!

 

[schematix]

I'd let them learn a valuable lesson in lager brewing and that is pitching rates are of the utmost importance. Best way to learn is from your mistakes.

What temp are you fermenting at? You could help them out a little but by bumping the temp up.

 

[day_trippr]

We're a week out from The Great Seasonal Symbolic Celebrations and someone wants to go all hard ass on a couple of neophytes?

I think the merciful application of the 830 would be the higher calling...

Cheers!

 

[schematix]

We're a week out from The Great Seasonal Symbolic Celebrations and someone wants to go all hard ass on a couple of neophytes?

I've never been accused of being a softy. After 5 days probably not much 1 more tube is going to do unless the original yeast was just plain dead.

 

[wallybangbang]

I've never been accused of being a softy. After 5 days probably not much 1 more tube is going to do unless the original yeast was just plain dead.

I've heard 820 is a slow finicky fermenter but with the lack of any visible signs I was wondering if the yeast was bad too. Best buy date was 2-1-16 and to answer the other question they pitched at about 70 then threw it in the freezer to ferment at 50. These are my boys so I have to help them out. They do need to get over the logistical challenges of making a starter and bringing it to my house though. I only have one flask, and they buy their yeast.

 

[DurtyChemist]

Have them take a gravity reading before you pitch more yeast. It could be working just fine and they are worried over nothing. Without knowing OG, yeast manf. date, fermentation temps, etc. it's hard to tell what's going on.

You could also make a larger starter, harvest clean fresh 2nd generation yeast from the starter for yourself to store in the now empty 830 vial, and help friends while still keeping your supply of 830 fresh AND avoid driving to the LHBS. It might be worth letting them sweat it a bit while your starter is growing.

 

[wallybangbang]

I ended up moving it inside the house for 24 hours. At 65 degrees inside my house it started bubbling and formed a good krausen. Moved back out to the garage at 52ish and is still going. Not a hard fermentation by any means but at least the yeast are working. Hopefully it doesn't have any off flavors from the 65 for 24 hours. I'm sure it's going to take forever to ferment but oh well, live and learn. I have a Helles going right now too, my first time making a lager.

 

[g-star]

Hopefully it doesn't have any off flavors from the 65 for 24 hours.

I'd be more concerned with the fact that you were woefully short on yeast, pitched hot, then had a 5 day lag time. Raising it up to 65 to get it going at that point was just pouring gasoline on the ranging dumpster fire that will be this beer.

 

[wallybangbang]

I'd be more concerned with the fact that you were woefully short on yeast, pitched hot, then had a 5 day lag time. Raising it up to 65 to get it going at that point was just pouring gasoline on the ranging dumpster fire that will be this beer.

Lol. Little harsh..... Obviously someone takes brewing beer in a bucket in my garage a little more seriously than I do. Just a question there big guy , does it make you feel better to bash people in an online forum? Makes you feel like a real man? I think somebody needs a hug.

 

[alukaiser]

I recently ran into the same thing with 820, but I made a 2.5 liter starter with two vials and pitched at 53, so it can definitely be a finnicky yeast. I had to raise to 58, rack to stir it up, and use a bunch more yeast to get it going.

 

[g-star]

Lol. Little harsh..... Obviously someone takes brewing beer in a bucket in my garage a little more seriously than I do. Just a question there big guy , does it make you feel better to bash people in an online forum? Makes you feel like a real man? I think somebody needs a hug.

Lighten up bro...best just to accept your fate and laugh at yourself on this one.

 

[DurtyChemist]

Lol. Little harsh..... Obviously someone takes brewing beer in a bucket in my garage a little more seriously than I do. Just a question there big guy , does it make you feel better to bash people in an online forum? Makes you feel like a real man? I think somebody needs a hug.

Does questioning someone who points out multiple things possibly resulting in an error to you after you ask the question make you feel like a better Brewer? I am sure the beer will be fine but you really shouldn't come across like this after asking for help.

 

[giraffe]

Lol. Little harsh..... Obviously someone takes brewing beer in a bucket in my garage a little more seriously than I do. Just a question there big guy , does it make you feel better to bash people in an online forum? Makes you feel like a real man? I think somebody needs a hug.

Looks like the guy was jesting to me. Lighten up. But seriously, they underpitched a lager by a factor of 4 at least, and used a finicky strain, it aint ever going to be ideal, just do what you can. If they insist on making lagers with no starters id push them on the wlp940, mexican lager yeast, its probably the lager yeast ive used that can take the most abuse and still make decent beer. (And pitch 2 vials. Or get them to use a company with bigger pitches.)

 

[wallybangbang]

Does questioning someone who points out multiple things possibly resulting in an error to you after you ask the question make you feel like a better Brewer? I am sure the beer will be fine but you really shouldn't come across like this after asking for help.

You know this is a great site with all lot of good people giving good knowledge, most off the posts I've come across keep with the spirit of craft brew in helping one another. But to call someone's beer a dumpster fire because they made a mistake is just stupid and out of line. I wasn't really questioning him, I know what my boys did wrong, I would just never say or type that response to anyone. It really doesn't add anything to my situation- it's just a shot across the bow from an Internet hero . To answer your question no it doesn't make me feel like a better Brewer, just standing up for what's right. I will never fire the first shot , that's not my style, but I will definitely fire back.

 

[wallybangbang]

Looks like the guy was jesting to me. Lighten up. But seriously, they underpitched a lager by a factor of 4 at least, and used a finicky strain, it aint ever going to be ideal, just do what you can. If they insist on making lagers with no starters id push them on the wlp940, mexican lager yeast, its probably the lager yeast ive used that can take the most abuse and still make decent beer. (And pitch 2 vials. Or get them to use a company with bigger pitches.)

Thanks for the advice!

 

[wallybangbang]

I recently ran into the same thing with 820, but I made a 2.5 liter starter with two vials and pitched at 53, so it can definitely be a finnicky yeast. I had to raise to 58, rack to stir it up, and use a bunch more yeast to get it going.

Thanks. I'm not a huge lager guy and knew nothing about 820. From reading the reviews and searching it a lot of people have issues even with making a starter. Obviously my guys are way behind the 8 ball. Thanks again for the advice.

 

[wallybangbang]

Lighten up bro...best just to accept your fate and laugh at yourself on this one.

Alright I'm over it, I'll lighten up. The beers official name will be g-stars dumpster fire lager, in honor of you.

 

[Yooper]

This back and forth nastiness provides no value at all to the forum at large, and so this thread is closed.