Wheat APA

[Jonkl]

So, the past couple years, I've been making a partial mash, hoppy wheat beer. It's a brew I've shared with the folks I ride a 3-day cycling tour with in the fall. This year, I've decided to go all-grain, and tweak the recipe a little (a lot), so I'm getting an early start. The goal is the same: Be an approachable, refreshing, crisp beer to enjoy after riding 80 miles in the wind and heat.

I'm a little concerned this one may be a little too complicated. Any thoughts?

Grupetto 3.1.0

Batch Size: 2.50 gal
Boil Size: 3.92 gal
Boil Time: 60 min
Efficiency: 57.00 %

Est Original Gravity: 1.052 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.012 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 5.3 %
Bitterness: 42.6 IBUs
Est Color: 8.0 SRM

Grist:

2 lbs Vienna Malt (3.5 SRM) 32.0 %
2 lbs White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM) 32.0 %
10.0 oz Wheat, Torrified (1.7 SRM) 10.0 %
8.0 oz Rye Malt (4.7 SRM) 8.0 %
6.0 oz Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) 6.0 %
4.0 oz Munich Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) 4.0 %
3.0 oz Caramel Wheat Malt (46.0 SRM) 3.0 %
3.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) 3.0 %
2.0 oz Honey (1.0 SRM) 2.0 % (Flame Out)

Hops:

0.20 oz Sorachi Ace [12.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min 15.0 IBUs

0.30 oz Crystal [3.50 %] - Boil 15.0 min 3.3 IBUs
0.20 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Boil 15.0 min 5.3 IBUs
0.20 oz Pacific Jade [13.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min 8.1 IBUs

0.40 oz Crystal [3.50 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 10.0 min 1.6 IBUs
0.30 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 10.0 min 2.9 IBUs
0.30 oz Pacific Jade [13.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 10.0 min 4.4 IBUs
0.20 oz Centennial [9.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 10.0 min 2.0 IBUs

0.30 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Dry Hop 4.0 Days
0.30 oz Crystal [3.50 %] - Dry Hop 4.0 Days
0.30 oz Pacific Jade [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 4.0 Days

Yeast:
1.0 pkg American Ale II (Wyeast Labs #1272)

 

[Jonkl]

Update: I'm thinking of cutting out the C40 and just using 8 oz of CaraWheat, cutting the CaraPils all together, and bumping up the honey to 4 oz.

 

[tagz]

I made a series of hoppy wheat beers. They turned out really well, but after a while the thick mouthfeel wore on me. If you are looking for crisp you might want to watch how much you use. Plus with carapils, caramel and Munich your going to have a fair amount of body.

 

[mrmop520]

You have 8 grains listed and 5 types of hops. For a simple refreshing beer I would cut those numbers at least in half. Simplicity is usually what you want!

For me, Vienna, white wheat, torrified wheat would be fine (maybe a bit of carapils or crystal if you want it a bit sweeter with more body) with 2 or 3 types of hops at max. I find its tough to get distinguishable hop characteristics from more than 2 flavor/aroma hops, but that is just in my brews!

 

[Jonkl]

Thanks for the tips, tagz and mrmop.

Updates - I dropped the CaraPils, C40, and CaraWheat completely, and added a little CaraVienne to bring a little bready sweetness. Also, I bumped the Munich down and the honey up, percentage-wise, to lighten the mouthfeel a bit. Got rid of the Centennial in the post-boil, and the Crystal in the dry-hop (I have 0.7oz of it in the inventory, so it works out better, anyway).

Should I just bitter with Pacific Jade instead of Sorachi Ace? It looks like their AA% and cohumulone numbers are similar. I have some SA on hand, so that's why I was thinking of using it. But there will be about 0.2oz of the PJ left over, too.

I'm pretty interested to see how the Pacific Jade/Amarillo/Crystal trio works out. It seems like they should all play off each other fairly well.

Est Original Gravity: 1.050 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.009 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 5.4 %
Bitterness: 42.8 IBUs
Est Color: 5.9 SRM

Grist:

2 lbs Vienna Malt (3.5 SRM) 35.6 %
2 lbs White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM) 35.6 %
10.0 oz Wheat, Torrified (1.7 SRM) 11.1 %
6.0 oz Caravienne Malt (22.0 SRM) 6.7 %
2.0 oz Munich Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) 2.2 %
8.0 oz Honey (1.0 SRM) 8.9 % (At Flame-out)

Hops:
0.20 oz Sorachi Ace [12.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min 15.6 IBUs

0.30 oz Crystal [3.50 %] - Boil 15.0 min 3.4 IBUs
0.20 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Boil 15.0 min 5.5 IBUs
0.20 oz Pacific Jade [13.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min 8.4 IBUs

0.40 oz Crystal [3.50 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 10.0 min 1.7 IBUs
0.30 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 10.0 min 3.0 IBUs
0.30 oz Pacific Jade [13.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 10.0 min 4.6 IBUs

0.30 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Dry Hop 4.0 Days
0.30 oz Pacific Jade [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 4.0 Days

Yeast:
1.0 pkg American Ale II (Wyeast Labs #1272) [124.21 ml]

 

[gometz]

I'm personally a big fan of simplicity when it comes to ingredients (the one exception is my darker beers).

For refreshing I'd think you'd be fine using just Vienna, wheat, and 1 crystal. Maybe a little honey at the end just for that added touch. That amount of torrified wheat seems high too. I know you are looking for head retention, but I don't think you'll have too much of an issue with that.

The new hop schedule looks interesting, can't say too much there. 43 IBU with a FG of 1.009 might be a bit bitter.

 

[Psylocide]

Yeah, this recipe is crazy on the specialty grains.

My wheat APA recipe... it is stellar.

6 lb White Wheat
5 lb 2-row
1 lb Caramel/crystal 40L


OG = 1.060
FG = 1.009
ABV = ~6.7%
Est IBU = 50ish


.5 oz Columbus @ 60 mins - 15% AA = 26 ibu
1 oz Centennial @ 30 mins - 9% AA = 24 ibu
.5 oz Columbus flame-out addition
.5 oz Centennial flame-out addition
.5 oz Cascade flame-out addition
1 packet rehydrated Nottingham pitch @ 62°
1 oz Citra dry hop - 5 days
1 oz Mosaic dry hop - 5 days
.5 oz Simcoe dry hop - 5 days

Mash @ 152°

 

[Jonkl]

All righty. Torrified wheat is out. I was actually trying to double-down on the wheat character with it, but I'm not sure it would do a whole lot of that. I'll try out the home-toasted wheat option for that.

Now, we're down to Vienna and Wheat, honey, and 4oz of the CaraVienne, and 8oz of home-toasted wheat malt. (Put it on a nut roaster for ~13 1/2 minutes, until 1/4 to 1/3rd of the grains are about the color of light-roast coffee.)

I'm not too worried about the high-IBU/low-FG combo, because almost 10 IBUs are calculated in the post-boil steep, which I've never got a ton of bitterness from, anyway.

 

[Jonkl]

I've been drinking this one for a while, and it turned out pretty well. The home-toasted wheat gives it some character, but the star is the Pacific Jade/Amarillo/Crystal. Definitely a good combo.

Pacific Jade works really well with a wheat beer. When they say it has some black pepper character, they seem to mean something that's more in the tropical, aromatic character of fresh-cracked black pepper. It's really unique.

The 1272 gave me some phenolic notes at first, but it's conditioned out by now, and pretty clean.