What Would YOU Do?

[BrewingBoar]

Hey guys, I just brewed a clone 1554 from AHB and I must say it is yummy so far. Here is my dilemma the o.g. is supposed to be 1.059 and f.g. is 1.015. I just took a sample and my hydrometer is reading 1.025 after the corrections but my orginal was 1.062 and i made sure i stirred the s!#!t out of with a starter. Should i warm it up in the bath and if so about what temp? Should I just RDWAHAHB and just let it sit longer? It has been in the primary for three weeks now with the same reading three days in a row.

Thanks!!!

 

[Brak23]

Does it taste good to you? Or does it taste like it still needs some time?

 

[unionrdr]

Swirl the FV to stir up some of the yeast on the bottom. Then warm it up a little. That should help.

 

[BrewingBoar]

Does it taste good to you? Or does it taste like it still needs some time?

That taste from the sample I had, taste real close to the original 1554. It was an extract kit as well but I must say this is one of my favorite beers.

 

[BrewingBoar]

Swirl the FV to stir up some of the yeast on the bottom. Then warm it up a little. That should help.

What do you mean by FV? It was fermented at 68 should I warm it up to 72F?

Thanks for the replies guys it makes us newbies feel relieved.

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

If it is a kit then your OG was REALLY what the kit said it would be. The Difference is in it not being mixed well no matter how much you stirred it ( never made a kit, just regurgitating what I have read over and over again). As for it being at 1.025 I would warm it up to the mid-high 60's ( or the high end of your yeast strain) and swirl ( not agitate and get oxygen in) it up to get the yeast moving again.

 

[Daybis]

I would honestly just leave it alone and give it some more time.

 

[cooper]

Also remember that most extract kits typically finish in the 1.020 range. I don't know why but that seems to be the way they work. I'd say you'd be good to bottle/keg it if you wanted. You could transfer to secondary and let it sit for another week or two to condition and it might come down a little more.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

If it is a kit then your OG was REALLY what the kit said it would be. The Difference is in it not being mixed well no matter how much you stirred it ( never made a kit, just regurgitating what I have read over and over again). As for it being at 1.025 I would warm it up to the mid-high 60's ( or the high end of your yeast strain) and swirl ( not agitate and get oxygen in) it up to get the yeast moving again.

Last time I checked, kits neither provide the water nor control evapration in the kettle. And no amount of stirring can correct for discrepencies there.

My first suggestion would be to check your hydrometer in distilled water.

 

[BrewingBoar]

If it is a kit then your OG was REALLY what the kit said it would be. The Difference is in it not being mixed well no matter how much you stirred it ( never made a kit, just regurgitating what I have read over and over again). As for it being at 1.025 I would warm it up to the mid-high 60's ( or the high end of your yeast strain) and swirl ( not agitate and get oxygen in) it up to get the yeast moving again.

That is my understanding as well with it being an Extract. The yeast was a White Labs Souther Lager being best fermented at 50-55°F but since it is an ale I was told to ferment at 68°F which it what i did. Would you still warm it up?

 

[Hockeyhunter99]

Agreed.

What temp is it fermenting? sounds stalled

 

[BrewingBoar]

Last time I checked, kits neither provide the water nor control evapration in the kettle. And no amount of stirring can correct for discrepencies there.

My first suggestion would be to check your hydrometer in distilled water.

My hydrometer is off by .002 but these numbers are with the corrected calculations.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

My hydrometer is off by .002 but these numbers are with the corrected calculations.

And how are you measuring your volumes? If by bucket gradations, some of them can be off.

 

[BrewingBoar]

Agreed.

What temp is it fermenting? sounds stalled

68F but it did get down to 55F last night. It is on my garage floor with a heater set to 70F. That usually keeps the fermentation temp right at 68F

Thanks

 

[Grippe]

FV means fermentation vessel I believe.

Anyways, I'm another person in favor of swirling the yeast up into suspension in order to get the FG knocked down a bit. You'll notice a LOT of CO2 coming out if you do - this is the gas that is suspended in the liquid being released, ergo the yeast is still consuming unprocessed molecules. I've gotten to the point that I don't even take gravity readings if there is CO2 being released as I swirl the carboy (I swirl twice a day after primary fermentation has slowed down). Once I get to the point where there is no gas coming out while swirling it (usually around the two week mark, sometimes longer, sometimes shorter) I rack to secondary (after letting the carboy sit unmolested for at least 24 hours for the yeast cake to completely settle).

 

[BrewingBoar]

And how are you measuring your volumes? If by bucket gradations, some of them can be off.

I guess you could be correct on that since I have a 5gal bucket and supposed to top off to 5.25gal. I did do a little guessing on the 5.25gal but it should be pretty close according to the lines on the bucket.

 

[BrewingBoar]

FV means fermentation vessel I believe.

Anyways, I'm another person in favor of swirling the yeast up into suspension in order to get the FG knocked down a bit. You'll notice a LOT of CO2 coming out if you do - this is the gas that is suspended in the liquid being released, ergo the yeast is still consuming unprocessed molecules. I've gotten to the point that I don't even take gravity readings if there is CO2 being released as I swirl the carboy (I swirl twice a day after primary fermentation has slowed down). Once I get to the point where there is no gas coming out while swirling it (usually around the two week mark, sometimes longer, sometimes shorter) I rack to secondary (after letting the carboy sit unmolested for at least 24 hours for the yeast cake to completely settle).

I have never thought of that but that sounds like a good idea if your are careful not to let oxygen in the beer.

 

[Grippe]

I leave the air lock in - it keeps the airspace in the carboy full of CO2 and the air lock prevents any oxygen from getting in.

edit - I use a 2x bubble airlock, the three piece airlocks don't handle the swirling action as cleanly

 

[JLem]

That is my understanding as well with it being an Extract. The yeast was a White Labs Souther Lager being best fermented at 50-55°F but since it is an ale I was told to ferment at 68°F which it what i did. Would you still warm it up?

I've never used this strain, but I am concerned about the advice to ferment it a such a warm temp. The difference between an ale and a lager is the yeast, not the beer. You are considerably outside this yeast's temp range. Not sure that this explains the potentially stalled fermentation, though I suppose it might.

 

[BrewingBoar]

I've never used this strain, but I am concerned about the advice to ferment it a such a warm temp. The difference between an ale and a lager is the yeast, not the beer. You are considerably outside this yeast's temp range. Not sure that this explains the potentially stalled fermentation, though I suppose it might.

I believe everything what you are saying. I was giving that temp by a few guys on here as well as AHB. I didn't happen to notice any off flavors being at that high of a temp though.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

I guess you could be correct on that since I have a 5gal bucket and supposed to top off to 5.25gal. I did do a little guessing on the 5.25gal but it should be pretty close according to the lines on the bucket.

What I mean is, have you verified that the marks on the bucket are in fact correct? Some of these pre-printed buckets have been found to be nearly a half gallon off.

 

[BrewingBoar]

Can someone help explain to me what the difference in .008 might be? I know you wouldn't get as high alcohol% but what else? Would the flavors be that much different? Or a dry taste similar to wine?

 

[BrewingBoar]

What I mean is, have you verified that the marks on the bucket are in fact correct? Some of these pre-printed buckets have been found to be nearly a half gallon off.

No, i guess i need to do that to see if they are off.

 

[unionrdr]

I think stalls happen due to the yeast being stressed somehow,from my experiences. Moreso than mearly being extract. As long as the extract is reasonably fresh. In this case,I'd go with stressed yeast.

 

[Grippe]

I've never used this strain, but I am concerned about the advice to ferment it a such a warm temp. The difference between an ale and a lager is the yeast, not the beer. You are considerably outside this yeast's temp range. Not sure that this explains the potentially stalled fermentation, though I suppose it might.

I think you might have hit it on the head WLP838. I didn't catch that the kit included a lager yeast for a product branded as an ale.

 

[JLem]

68F but it did get down to 55F last night. It is on my garage floor with a heater set to 70F. That usually keeps the fermentation temp right at 68F

Thanks

Has the temp fluctuated over the course of the fermentation? It is possible that a quick drop in temp may have caused the yeast to drop out. Gently swirling to get some yeast back in suspension might be a good idea.

 

[BrewingBoar]

I think stalls happen due to the yeast being stressed somehow,from my experiences. Moreso than mearly being extract. As long as the extract is reasonably fresh. In this case,I'd go with stressed yeast.

Very well could be this was the first time aI made a yeast starter and made sure I did the right amount. I guess the high temp could have stressed them.

Thanks for all the replies guys

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

I've never used this strain, but I am concerned about the advice to ferment it a such a warm temp. The difference between an ale and a lager is the yeast, not the beer. You are considerably outside this yeast's temp range. Not sure that this explains the potentially stalled fermentation, though I suppose it might.

The temp ranges are suggested for the most desirable byproduct profile for that strain and not based on the most efficient temp for a particular strain.

In fact, a method to determine a yeasts maximum attenuation for a given wort profile is to fast ferment a small portion at a temp range far outside it's profile.

 

[cadarnell]

my first beer ever stalled ... i dont remember the exact numbers ... but i know it was 8 or so points over the target FG ... I warmed it up from 68 to 74 and swirled the bucket 3 or 4 times over an hour or so ... the next day the air lock was bubbling a bit and a new krausen had formed ... it went down a bout 4 or so points I think during that second fermentation ... so i think swirl it and warm it up ...

that beer i made was not the best, but it was drinkable for sure ... more so after a few months, but I am learning to be patient. ... good luck !!

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

Can someone help explain to me what the difference in .008 might be? I know you wouldn't get as high alcohol% but what else? Would the flavors be that much different? Or a dry taste similar to wine?

The difference is really not signifigant, IMO, except that a lager strain is being used which generally calls for a higher pitch rate than an Ale yeast and is typically less tolerant of starting gravities and alcohol presence.

Did you make a starter? If no, then the viability of the yeast may have been low from the start and the increased gravity could have been a choking point.

I think you might have hit it on the head WLP838. I didn't catch that the kit included a lager yeast for a product branded as an ale.

This means little. California common capitalizes on this concept. Forcing a yeast to perform below it's preffered range is cause for dormancy. Forcing a yeast to perform above it's target range is cause for higher byproduction.

 

[BrewingBoar]

My problem is the closet HBC is about an hour away and none of my friends are interested in good beer. I was getting frustrated with beers I was making since I didn't think they were coming out that good. Finally I bought some cheap german style light kit for the HBS and it was my best beer so far after some modifications. Patience and I don't get along but I'm learning.

 

[BrewingBoar]

Yes, I used a starter and Mr. Malty to calculate what I needed to pitch.

 

[BrewingBoar]

Has the temp fluctuated over the course of the fermentation? It is possible that a quick drop in temp may have caused the yeast to drop out. Gently swirling to get some yeast back in suspension might be a good idea.

I don't think it has. I know it did last night because the heater couldn't keep up with the temp outside. The temp here has been pretty steady for the last three weeks.

 

[JLem]

The temp ranges are suggested for the most desirable byproduct profile for that strain and not based on the most efficient temp for a particular strain.

In fact, a method to determine a yeasts maximum attenuation for a given wort profile is to fast ferment a small portion at a temp range far outside it's profile.

This is why I myself was somewhat skeptical about it causing a stall. Just thought it might cause some undue stress. Microbes in general grow "better" at higher temps, yeast are no exception. I am still concerned though that the OP was given advice to ferment this strain so warm. This is not a "hybrid" yeast like San Fran lager.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

This is not a "hybrid" yeast like San Fran lager.

Of this I will not argue. But, the worst that could happen as a result is too high an ester/phenol profile.

If the op's volumes are in fact on point, and in consideration that a starter was made, I would think it interesting to pull a quart or two aside and attempt a fast ferment to see if their is any steam left in this yeast or if their are any fermentable sugars left in the beer.

 

[BrewingBoar]

Of this I will not argue. But, the worst that could happen as a result is too high an ester/phenol profile.

If the op's volumes are in fact on point, and in consideration that a starter was made, I would think it interesting to pull a quart or two aside and attempt a fast ferment to see if their is any steam left in this yeast or if their are any fermentable sugars left in the beer.

I can do that for the name of BEER!!!! I just swirled it around some and will start bringing the temp up to around 70F. How would you go about doing this fast ferment?

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

I can do that for the name of BEER!!!! I just swirled it around some and will start bringing the temp up to around 70F. How would you go about doing this fast ferment?

You simply bring the temps up to a microbial optima. Say, 80*F. But you MUST know the OG and FG for it to have any correlation. In this, you would simply be testing the yeast on a small scale. The result will either be no more attenuation (or very little) meaning there is nothing left for the yeast. Or a sginifigant change in attenuation meaning the yeast cannot tolerate the conditions per design.