Water for a Dry Stout

[chrisp]

I'm planning to brew a dry stout tomorrow and I am wondering if anyone sees any issues with the R/O water adjustments I'm planning.

The recipe is Jamil's Cerveza De Malto Seca from "Brewing Classic Styles". 32 SRM

I used the EZ water adjustment spreadsheet to approximate the Dublin water profile for 8 gallons (4.5 mash/3.5 sparge).

Here are the numbers:

CaCl2: 0.5 / 0
MgSO4: 2 / 1.56
NaHCO3: 3 / 2.33
NaCl: 0.3 / 0.23
HCL Acid: 0 / 0
Lactic Acid: 0 / 0

Mash Water / Total water (ppm):
Ca: 137 / 77
Mg: 11 / 11
Na: 55 / 55
Cl: 25 / 19
SO4: 46 / 46
CaCO3: 264 / 194

RA (mash only): 159 (18 to 23 SRM)
Cl to SO4 (total water): 0.41 (Very Bitter)

 

[dale1038]

I have no idea.

What I do know is I am brewing this tomorrow as well. What yeast are you using? I decided on us-05 (blah I hate dry yeast).

I'm mashing at 153 for an hour. Are you following Jamil's mash times and temps? A little crazy for me, but I always wonder if it would make a difference.

Good luck.

 

[MattHollingsworth]

I had great luck with a Dry Stout recently using Wyeast 1028. I wouldn't mash that high, personally. It's a Dry Stout, after all. You WANT it dry.

I used 149 and had great results.

I don't see any real problem with the water numbers above, but I can't really say as I haven't done a ton of Dry Stouts and compared the results with different water. That being said, I used water like this, for all of the water:

Ca: 86
Mg: 27
Alkalinity as CACO3: 316 (which is 386 ppm Bicarbonate, a ****load!)
Na: 9
Cl: 12
SO4: 31
RA: 239

Chloride/Sulfate ratio: Very bitter.

For me, however, I didn't adjust my water at all. This is my tap water straight, with no adjustments. I just filtered the water. I wanted to try and see how Stouts work with my water as I usually have to adjust my water a lot. And as it turns out, the water here is great for Stouts. Also brewed an Imperial Stout recently using the same water with no adjustments at all and it came out fantastic.

 

[chrisp]

I'll be using US-05 and mashing at 150. I'm going to skip the 120 rest Jamil calls for in the book.

My RA could probably be higher but I don't want to over do it. I can always tweak it on the next batch. I'll check the mash PH and see where it falls.

 

[MattHollingsworth]

I used the 120 rest for the flaked barley, but I didn't use Jamil's recipe. I used 350 g of flaked barley, or 8.86%. Be aware that you need to try to maintain your heat in the mash tun during run off. That flaked barley gets really gummy. Mine got stuck the first time through and I had to give it a stir and recirc. again and run off a second time. Second time I was more careful about trying to keep the heat maintained and also ran off just a little faster and it worked better. If you use as much flaked barley as Jamil, I'd say you'll have to be extra careful as he uses way, way more than I do.

 

[chrisp]

Thanks for the tip. I'll be batch sparging so it shouldn't be a problem but I'll be sure to keep an eye on it.

After reading the 15 page EZ Water thread, I've tweaked my numbers again.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f128/ez-water-adjustment-spreadsheet-135095/

Starting Water (ppm):
Ca: 0
Mg: 0
Na: 0
Cl: 0
SO4: 0
HCO3: 0

Mash / Sparge Vol (gal): 4.5 / 3.5
Dilution Rate: 0%

Adjustments (grams) Mash / Boil Kettle:
CaCO3: 5.5 / 4.28
CaSO4: 0 / 0
CaCl2: 0.5 / 0.39
MgSO4: 2 / 1.56
NaHCO3: 3 / 0
NaCl: 0.5 / 0.39
HCL Acid: 0 / 0
Lactic Acid: 0 / 0

Mash Water / Total water (ppm):
Ca: 137 / 137
Mg: 11 / 11
Na: 60 / 39
Cl: 32 / 32
SO4: 46 / 46
CaCO3: 264 / 218

RA (mash only): 159 (18 to 23 SRM)
Cl to SO4 (total water): 0.70 (Bitter)

 

[chrisp]

After listening to the Brew Strong water podcasts I've tweaked the water additions again. I decided to make the chloride to sulphate ratio more balanced.

What do you think?

Starting Water (ppm):
Ca: 0
Mg: 0
Na: 0
Cl: 0
SO4: 0
HCO3: 0

Mash / Sparge Vol (gal): 4.5 / 3.5
Dilution Rate: 0%

Adjustments (grams) Mash / Boil Kettle:
CaCO3: 5.5 / 4.28
CaSO4: 0 / 0
CaCl2: 0.5 / 0.39
MgSO4: 2 / 1.56
NaHCO3: 3 / 0
NaCl: 0.75 / 0.58
HCL Acid: 0 / 0
Lactic Acid: 0 / 0

Mash Water / Total water (ppm):
Ca: 137 / 137
Mg: 11 / 11
Na: 66 / 44
Cl: 41 / 41
SO4: 46 / 46
CaCO3: 264 / 218

RA (mash only): 159 (18 to 23 SRM)
Cl to SO4 (total water): 0.89 (Balanced)

 

[MattHollingsworth]

I think they all look fine, personally, except I've never added sodium so can't comment on that.

 

[chrisp]

It increases the sodium level but helps balance out the chloride to sulphate ratio. My only other choice would be calcium chloride but it would lower the RA and I am already a little low with the RA.

The numbers are within Palmer's recommended ranges except for the sulfate which is 4 ppm low. Again, I can't increase the sulfate with out lowering the RA.