Warning: Don't soak your Better Bottles for a week

[EdWort]

I made a major mistake in cleaning a couple of Better Bottles last week. I took them out on my deck, added some PBW and filled them with water. I put some plastic wrap over the top to keep the water from evaporating and then went on a business trip.

When I returned, I noticed one was empty and the other was about 1/3 empty. WTF????

The empty one had cracks in the bottom. I moved the almost full one by sliding it on the deck and it started to leak profusely.

I did not heed the warning on the Better Bottle web site about soaking and it cost me two Better Bottles.

BetterBottle carboys are resistant to attack by the aggressive commercial detergents recommended for use in home winemaking or brewing. However, as noted in the Materials section (see left side of page), strong caustics such as lye (sodium hydroxide - NaOH), caustic potash (potassium hydroxide - KOH), and excessive concentrations of highly caustic detergents can damage PET and, for that matter, many other plastics, metals, and even glass. Use only brand-name detergents that have a good track record. Detergents should be diluted according to the manufacturer's recommendations for routine cleaning (i.e., <1% by weight for Five Star PBW*) and contact times should be minimized. Instead of soaking carboys and fittings in high concentrations of detergent for hours and hours use lower concentrations, smaller volumes of detergent solution, and agitation (it's easy with BetterBottle carboys). Also, replace fouled detergent solution frequently in order to maintain maximum cleaning efficiency.

I now will only soak for a couple of hours.

Lesson learned? Don't soak your Better Bottles more than overnight without rinsing with clear water.

 

[Revvy]

Do you think oxyclean is as caustic? I've been guilty of that..

 

[Synovia]

I've left better bottles out back full of oxy for weeks and never had a problem. I'm thinking its the PBW.

 

[jpc]

I've left better bottles out back full of oxy for weeks and never had a problem. I'm thinking its the PBW.

It's not likely the PBW; it's more likely the concentration of PBW. From the quote above:

Use only brand-name detergents that have a good track record. Detergents should be diluted according to the manufacturer's recommendations for routine cleaning (i.e., <1% by weight for Five Star PBW*) and contact times should be minimized. Instead of soaking carboys and fittings in high concentrations of detergent for hours and hours use lower concentrations, smaller volumes of detergent solution, and agitation (it's easy with BetterBottle carboys).​

I use the prescribed strength and have had no issues soaking for days.

 

[passedpawn]

I've left better bottles out back full of oxy for weeks and never had a problem. I'm thinking its the PBW.

Me too. In fact, many, many times (I have 5 of them).

Something else is at play here.

 

[Beerrific]

I developed a crack in the bottom of my better bottle too. Only thing I can figure is week long soaks with oxiclean or pbw.

 

[RogerMcAllen]

Doesn't seem too surprising

As quoted above from the better bottle site, strong caustics will damage better bottles. From the PBW technical data sheet, at a normal usage level of 1%, PWB has a pH of 12. That is a pretty strong caustic.

From the OxyClean website, the pH can be as high as 11.
The highest concentration for any OxyClean use I've found is 1/4 scoop per pint on hard surfaces, which comes to 2 scoops per gallon. More resonable usage levels will have pHs closer to 10.

Remember pH is a logarithmic scale, so something with a pH of 12 is 100 times more caustic than something with a pH of 10.

http://www.oxiclean.com/FAQ.aspx
http://www.ahprofessional.com/Literature/files/OxiClean Did You Know.pdf

 

[Bobby_M]

Are you sure you didn't freeze it over a cold night? I know it's Texas, but I don't know squat about your weather.

 

[DeafSmith]

Could the bottom have already been cracked or weakened? I know the BB web site says not to tilt them on edge when full to aerate the wort, as this can cause stress cracking. They recommend putting a tennis ball under the dimple in the center of the bottom to avoid this problem.

 

[bob1852]

I know people swear by both BB and glass - but at least I know how to treat glass........

If certain cleaning solutions or angles or "rocking" are weaknesses of BB, I'll stick with the glass -- aka, don't drop it.....

 

[Schlenkerla]

I have one BB and I routinely leave it filled with 2 shots of bleach and the rest water. I have done so for about 3 years. No issues yet.

Bleach is sodium hypochlorite.

 

[PolishLogic]

I generally use about 3/4 of a scoop of Oxiclean and then fill the carboy up with warm water. Haven't noticed any issues, although we're talking about ~20 brews into my career, so there's not been a seriously prolonged exposure.

 

[brewingkitty]

still seems odd... as all our chemicals come concentrated in PET and HDPE containers...

 

[dzlater]

....................................

From the OxyClean website, the pH can be as high as 11.
The highest concentration for any OxyClean use I've found is 1/4 scoop per pint on hard surfaces, which comes to 2 scoops per gallon. More resonable usage levels will have pHs closer to 10.
..............................................

You put 12 scoops of oxyclean in a 6 gallon fermenter ?
that seems like a hell of a lot to me, I use maybe 1 at the most.

 

[Synovia]

You put 12 scoops of oxyclean in a 6 gallon fermenter ?
that seems like a hell of a lot to me, I use maybe 1 at the most.

I don't think he does, I think thats just the max "dosage

 

[dzlater]

ok I misunderstood

 

[maida7]

Doesn't seem too surprising

As quoted above from the better bottle site, strong caustics will damage better bottles. From the PBW technical data sheet, at a normal usage level of 1%, PWB has a pH of 12. That is a pretty strong caustic.

From the OxyClean website, the pH can be as high as 11.
The highest concentration for any OxyClean use I've found is 1/4 scoop per pint on hard surfaces, which comes to 2 scoops per gallon. More resonable usage levels will have pHs closer to 10.

Remember pH is a logarithmic scale, so something with a pH of 12 is 100 times more caustic than something with a pH of 10.

http://www.oxiclean.com/FAQ.aspx
http://www.ahprofessional.com/Literature/files/OxiClean Did You Know.pdf

Isn't Texas know for having highly alkaline water to begin with. That could be a factor.

I've been using better bottles for several years. I let mine soak in PBW or Oxiclean over night. Sometimes I will forget about them for a few days. I've never had one break.

 

[Cpt_Kirks]

I'm on the oxy list, I leave BB's soaking for a week at a time, especially in winter. Haven't had any issues yet.

I use one scoop of oxy per bottle.

 

[DrawTap88]

I read that same thing in the manual for BBs after I screwed my first one up. I let it soak in a very strong solution of PBW and then tried to use my brush to knock some of the crud off. That BB got very tiny scratches from the bristles of the brush. They aren't discernable to the naked eye, but once you put some hot water in it, the steam makes them show pretty clearly. Now my BB don't get more than an hour soak...and a very thourough rinse.

 

[ArcaneXor]

Recently lost my second Better Bottle, this one to extensive cracks along the bottom that did not look like like the pressure cracks I had the first time around. Could have been the AHS Brewvint cleaner (or whatever it is called) - it literally looked like the cracks formed layer by layer from the inside.

 

[Grummle]

Ugh, I too do this for a week or so at a shot. I was thinking it was better then scratching the plastic with a brush. After a week with PBW (1Tbs/gallon) its clean as a whistle. Guess I'll have to rethink this....

 

[indigi]

I've left mine soaking for over a month when I moved them to the back of the basement and forgot about them with no problem. One and change scoops of OxyClean in 3 gallon models. I've used one since to make a cider with no problems (other than not adding yeast nutrient so it doesn't taste so hot).