Unfermented starter?

[jmancuso]

I'm making a starter for a 10 gallon batch of czech pils using wyeast 2278. My plan was to make 2 seperate 1.75 liter starters with 2 smack packs and then cool and decant and pitch into 2 3.5 liter starters. Well after letting the initial starter sit at 70-75 degrees for 2 days and seeing no sign of fermentation I thought I just missed it. There was a pretty large yeast cake on the bottom so I put it in the fridge and after it was chilled and I was ready to decant i took a gravity reading of what i decanted and it was the exact same as my O.G. Now i'm not sure what to do, I was planning to brew tomorrow but don't want to under pitch my pils. Any ideas?

 

[PintOfBitter]

did you wait for the smack packs to swell? sounds like your yeast was hosed before you even pitched it. better find a substitute ASAP.

 

[jmancuso]

I just waited an hour for it to come up to temperature and it was partially swelled. There is a ton of yeast on the bottom, did they just reproduce and die? Or did I put it in the fridge too early?

 

[a10t2]

Just a double check: are you taking gravity readings with a hydrometer?

 

[jmancuso]

yes a hydrometer 1.040 friday 1.040 sunday

 

[jmancuso]

If this yeast is dead and I dont have time to make another starter chill and decant there is something i came across in an old thread i may try. I'm thinking i might take about 4 liters of wort from my brew today and chill it to 55 degrees as fast as possible and pitch the yeast in there. Then put the remaining 4.5-5 gallons of wort in my ferm chamber and allow to chill to 55 degrees over night and pitch the starter when it looks active. Not really sure if this would work. Does anyone have experience doing anything like this before?

 

[PintOfBitter]

if the SG did not change, your yeast is 99% certainly dead or completely inactive. you need new yeast if you don't want to waste your batch.

 

[Pivovar_Koucky]

I had a vial of white labs in the mail during the recent heat wave that took 2 in starter before it showed any signs of life. Took off pretty well after that.

 

[PintOfBitter]

the sad truth is that you're taking a lot of risks using a starter that has had that long for baddies to take hold (no starter is truly sterile) and will have such a pitiful yeast count. I really encourage you to get some new yeast. Are you willing to risk the waste of the labor of a brew day, cost of ingredients, and lengthy lager fermentation period?

Your lager will need a very large cell count in order to come out well. You just won't get it from sub-par yeast.

The way I see it, the best you can hope for is a weak fermentation and high FG. The worst is an infected batch that gets fed to the sewer rats.

 

[PintOfBitter]

Assuming you properly cared for the yeast after you bought it, the store you got it at may be willing to replace it for you, since it would seem that the abuse happened pre-consumer.

 

[jmancuso]

Does this sound like it would work

If this yeast is dead and I dont have time to make another starter chill and decant there is something i came across in an old thread i may try. I'm thinking i might take about 4 liters of wort from my brew today and chill it to 55 degrees as fast as possible and pitch the yeast in there. Then put the remaining 4.5-5 gallons of wort in my ferm chamber and allow to chill to 55 degrees over night and pitch the starter when it looks active. Not really sure if this would work. Does anyone have experience doing anything like this before?

 

[PintOfBitter]

no. dead yeast is dead yeast. you won't get enough cells out of it without laboratory-type treatments.

 

[jmancuso]

I'm sorry I forgot to specify I would be using two new yeast packs.

 

[samc]

Relax, take your time and do it right. Put off brew day if need be and make a proper starter. Rushing usually results in a poor end product and mistakes.

 

[PintOfBitter]

I'm sorry I forgot to specify I would be using two new yeast packs.

Gotcha. This would work, but I agree that you'd be doing yourself a disservice not to do a proper starter.