Traded up a from Corny, now my beer is flat?

[jat147]

Hi,
I've been using a corny keg for a year or so and have managed some good, consistent results using the sort of chart that is often mentioned on here:
http://www.kegerators.com/carbonation-table.php

I've now got a bigger keg, with an A-type fitting - also known as a 'german slider' I'm told. Carbing in the same way as before, with the gas going into the product out tube, with the gas in valve blocked using the rubber no leak valve thing. I've had the keg in a fridge at 37F under 20psi for 2 weeks now but the beer is still pretty flat. Plenty of foam, but no carbonation.
According to the chart, I ought to have over 3 atms, but something must be wrong. I'm at a loss?
Any ideas?

 

[Beer_Eugenics]

How long and what size liquid lines do you have?

 

[masonsjax]

Plenty of foam and pretty flat beer is usually a sign of overcarbonation.

 

[Hello]

^ this and I suspect perhaps serving pressure is too high for the length of liquid line you have going.

 

[jat147]

Hey, thanks for the input.
The lines are 5/8 and are over 10ft to the font.
I doubt the serving pressure is a factor in the lack of carbonation as I always start with zero pressure and gradually turn the gas up until it has just enough to pressure to flow properly. The foaming isn't a big concern and I can control it with an inline reducer, which has helped.
In the last few days I've put the carbonating pressure up a few pounds and this has resulted in a few very small bubbles being formed in the served beer. But we're up to like 25 psi now, which just seems much more than I ever needed in the Corny - with the same beer!
I'm blaming the keg, I just dont know why?

 

[Beer_Eugenics]

I assume you mean 3/8th which would mean your lines are good. Excessive foam is caused by the co2 coming out of the beer making it go flat. But I would also try putting the gas line to the gas post, I carb my cornys this way with no problem. I'm not familiar with your keg but maybe having the gas to the serving post is the problem.

 

[jat147]

I assume you mean 3/8th which would mean your lines are good. Excessive foam is caused by the co2 coming out of the beer making it go flat. But I would also try putting the gas line to the gas post, I carb my cornys this way with no problem. I'm not familiar with your keg but maybe having the gas to the serving post is the problem.

Yeah, good point.
I'll try putting gas into the gas line, its worth a try. Maybe the product dip tube has a problem with the gas pressure inside it? These kegs would have been filled with carbonated beer when they were designed.
Thanks

 

[eric19312]

Is this a common technique? Gas to the serving line for force carbing? I am new to kegs and this is the first time I've come across mention of that technique.


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[masonsjax]

Gas to the serving line is fairly common. The benefits are minimal, but shouldn't contribute to overcarbed beer any more than gas to the gas post would, it might get there a few seconds earlier is all.

Over 3 volumes is way higher than a typical style would call for and would result in foamy flat beer due to overcarbing. Offgas it and set the regulator lower to solve the problem.

 

[jat147]

Gas to the serving line is fairly common. The benefits are minimal, but shouldn't contribute to overcarbed beer any more than gas to the gas post would, it might get there a few seconds earlier is all.

Over 3 volumes is way higher than a typical style would call for and would result in foamy flat beer due to overcarbing. Offgas it and set the regulator lower to solve the problem.

You're quite right, 3 vols is too high.
But you're quite wrong about this being the cause of undercarbonated beer. I've gradually rose the gas pressure to 25psi after starting at only 12psi. At 12psi the problem of undercarbonated beer isn't caused by the pressure being too high, is it?

Many people apply pressure to the dip tube as it'll force the gas into the base of the keg and bubble thru it, gaining co2 saturation as it does. Applying gas to the gas in line gives a blanket of co2 above the beer, which will work of course, and saturation will take place. The truth is I bet both methods will give the same result eventually, as equilibrium is reached.

 

[masonsjax]

Yes both methods have the same result.

If you started at 12 psi, that still leans slightly toward the high side of carb levels at your temperature. However, if you didn't allow ample time for the beer to fully condition before turning up the pressure, you probably blasted right past a good level and straight to overcarbonation. I've seen this a thousand times. Don't try to be fancy or rush the process, you'll not be happy with the results. Just set it and forget it. In a mere 10 days the beer will be perfect. Patience is probably the single most important trait for a homebrewer to master.

 

[jat147]

I've fixed it.

The answer came to me last night, when comparing how I deal with the new keg against the old corny. After force carbing, the corny needs the gas line removing and the excess pressure releasing via the bleed valve on the lid before reconnecting the gas to the other line and turning it on at the lower serving pressure. The new keg doesn't of course have a bleed valve fitted.
After managing to bleed the excess gas, the beer served with adequate carbonation and no excess foam.
User error you might say?