Stuck Before I Start

[sremed60]

I have never home brewed before. And to be perfectly honest, I don't (personally) know anyone who has home brewed before. Up until 3 or 4 weeks ago it wasn't even something I ever considered doing.

Then I decided maybe it would be fun, so I started looking into it. I've spent the last month obsessed with trying to learn as much as I possibly can as fast as I can. When I'm not on the computer surfing the forums for answers, I got my face in a book or magazine about it. And when my eyes and brain need a rest, I go and talk my wife's ear off about it, (which thrills her to no end).

So I want to get started on my first batch ASAP. I've gone from considering all-grain systems for brewing 5-10 gallon batches, extract brewing 1.5-2 gallon batches, to partial mash, and now (I think) I've settled on all-grain BIAB 2-3 gallon batches. The BIAB seems quite a bit easier than having to buy or build a mash tun. I like the idea of smaller 2-3 gallon batches; I plan to try as many recipes as I can and I don't want to be stock piling cases all over the house like a hoarder.

All I have so far is a boil pot. I know I need at least a fermenter, a hydrometer, a thermometer and the beersmith software. From what I've been able to come up with I think I prefer the plastic bucket fermentor over the glass carboy, (seems easier to get in and clean). If I am going to do 2-3 gallon batches what size fermentor do I need? Is 3 gallons too small? Is 6.5 gallons too big?

Any help is appreciated. I'm a cheapskate and before I go spending money on equipment I want to make sure I'm getting what I need. Since I've never done this I figured I'd reach out and get some advice from those who have done this.

 

[unionrdr]

Well, a 3 gallon batch might work out ok in a lowe's or home depot 5 gallon bucket. They go to 5 gallons all the way full. But it's the white or milky colored ones marked food safe. A nylon paint strainer bag works great as a grain bag. Easier to clean.

 

[HarborTownBrewing]

You can skip buying Beersmith...at least until you are ready for it. To me, it's purpose is in crafting recipes and whatnot, but nobody should be trying that until they have a few batches under their belt.

I'd suggest planning on doing 5 gallon batches. For all the time you'll put into each batch, it's worth it to at least get 5 gallons out of it. 3 gallons will take about as long.

You'll also want an auto-siphon/racking cane. And a wine thief. As well as a bottling bucket. You'll need some hosing to connect to the racking cane as well, which you can pick up at Home Depot. Plus a bottle crimper thingy, and some star san.

Honestly though, you can buy a starter kit from Midwest or whomever and it will include nearly everything you need. It's a pretty safe route to go.

All the best man!

 

[yesjenks]

You can skip buying Beersmith...at least until you are ready for it. To me, it's purpose is in crafting recipes and whatnot, but nobody should be trying that until they have a few batches under their belt.

I'd suggest planning on doing 5 gallon batches. For all the time you'll put into each batch, it's worth it to at least get 5 gallons out of it. 3 gallons will take about as long.

You'll also want an auto-siphon/racking cane. And a wine thief. As well as a bottling bucket. You'll need some hosing to connect to the racking cane as well, which you can pick up at Home Depot. Plus a bottle crimper thingy, and some star san.

Honestly though, you can buy a starter kit from Midwest or whomever and it will include nearly everything you need. It's a pretty safe route to go.

All the best man!

Agreed regarding the 5 gallon batches and starter kit. You can a kit for $100-150 or so and will use most (if not all) the items included.

I would suggest starting with an extract kit. You can find them at many sites online or your LHBS. It'll take you about 2 hours to make your first batch and give you a better idea what to expect from BIAB.

Welcome to the hobby!!

 

[Kharnynb]

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=525556

a list of what I personally use for my biab cheapskate system.

You'd also need a bottle capper, bottle brush and something to dry your bottles on, like for example:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=513740

 

[Kharnynb]

doublepost..

 

[revco]

I think that's a smart choice. If BIAB had been a pioneered option when I was learning to brew, I would have done that long before I switched to all grain. Extract does have a benefit of being easy on the learning curve, though, so don't overlook something simpler as a starting point. There's a lot of important processes that extract has in common with all brewing methods, so you'd still learn things like fluid transfers, fermentation and the boil process. Just make sure your purchases (e.g. kettles) can do both as it sucks to have to re-buy things down the road to fit your new modified processes.

I would suggest 5 gallon fermenters. They're helpful and can be used heavily in aging 5 gallon batches, so they maintain their functionality no matter the scale of the system. I personally like carboys, they're in some ways easier for me to clean...but then again, I have a pump cleaner. Regardless, you can just soak in Oxiclean or PBW and it's a done deal, easy peasy. You want some headroom for fermentation, so 5 gallons can get you there on even a 3 gallon batch. The 6.5's are good for 5 gallon batches.

At first, you might think 5 gallons is a lot and it does seem so...but really, that's only 2ish cases of beer. In the beginning, your beer may just be "OK" compared to commercial stuff...but when you start nailing the processes down, you might very well want to do 5 gallon batches to save a ton of time. What I'm saying is it would be wise to design around at least 5 gallons rather than lock yourself into small batching.

Most of the above advice is good, so I won't bother repeating it. Definitely invest into Starsan for sanitation purposes, you can also use other sanitizing chemicals. Good luck on the journey and welcome to brewing!

 

[sremed60]

Thanks guys. Good advice. My reasons for going with smaller batches are: (1) I already have a 3 gal stock pot, (or at least my wife does), so I wouldn't have to shell out the money for that right now. (2) I don't really drink a lot of beer so I would rather be able to brew lots of small batches without having cases and cases of beer stock piled everywhere.

Most of my friends and family don't drink at all, or they drink wine. The few beer drinkers I know think Bud Light is the greatest beer on earth. If I handed them a good ale they'd spit it out.

 

[yesjenks]

I understand the 2nd of your reasons. Know that for the first you can boil 21/2 gallons for a 5 gallon batch. Just too off your carboy to 5 gallons. Either way, good luck with you decision!

 

[sremed60]

Which brings up another question. If I can boil 2.5 gallons of wort and then just top off the other 2.5 gallons with water, then what would be the advantage to having an 8 gallon boil kettle, boiling the entire 5 gallons all at once, and then have to invest in some kind of wort cooler to cool it down? Why not boil 2.5 gallons and then add 2.5 gallons of cold water?

Probably a stupid question - just the kind of stuff I'm trying to figure out before I start buying equipment.

Really, what I'm trying to do is to brew small batches, all-grain (BIAB). Just enough for a 6-pack or two to try it. If it's good I can always brew it again. I don't really want to turn my garage into a microbrewery with huge tubs and pots and fermentors everywhere. I don't plan on ever getting into this on any scale larger than brewing a couple 6-packs for my own enjoyment.

So when all is said and done I guess I really just need a bunch of 5 gallon fermentors.

 

[Kharnynb]

partial boil vs full boil:
You get better hop flavour in a lower gravity wort.
You reduce the chance of caramelising your wort.

Gear wise, it doesn't matter much what size batches you make, except kettle and fermenter size.
2.5 gallon batches, it's probally better to look for 3.5 gallon max fermenter, otherwise you have a lot of headspace left.

 

[RM-MN]

partial boil vs full boil:
You get better hop flavour in a lower gravity wort.
You reduce the chance of caramelising your wort.

Gear wise, it doesn't matter much what size batches you make, except kettle and fermenter size.
2.5 gallon batches, it's probally better to look for 3.5 gallon max fermenter, otherwise you have a lot of headspace left.

Headspace doesn't matter for primary. The fermenting beer gives off so much CO2 that you can ferment in an open fermeneter. If you move the beer to secondary, then the headspace matters a lot. I ferment a lot of 2 1/2 gallon batches in a 6 1/2 gallon fermenter.

 

[brewkinger]

Some good advice above.
To summarize and not repeat everything. ..
Start simple with extract to get the processes down. The key to good beer is repeatable steps.
Once you get that down, then move to BIAB or AG, but start simple IMO.
Get the biggest kettle that you can afford. This alone will dictate how you start.
A 10 gallon pot will serve you well for normal 5 to 6 gal batches.
Get a beginners kit from LHBS or online. All necessary stuff will be included.
Check out the stickied threads in the Beginners forum here on HBT.

 

[Onkel_Udo]

To dispel one of your fears, unless you have a tiny house or apartment the gear does not take up much space for small batch BIAB or up to 5-gallon batch extract. this is assuming you are only going to have a maximum of two batches bottled at any one time. The equipment nests together very well and the cases of bottles stack.

So do a simple 1 gallon kit from Northern Brewer for your first batch. You get a couple of 6 packs and find out if this is something you will enjoy. You have a big enough pot already. You will just need a fermenter, bottling cane, small auto-siphon a capper or a small number of flip-top bottles and couple of other things...every one of these is reusable.

 

[HarborTownBrewing]

To dispel one of your fears, unless you have a tiny house or apartment the gear does not take up much space for small batch BIAB or up to 5-gallon batch extract. this is assuming you are only going to have a maximum of two batches bottled at any one time. The equipment nests together very well and the cases of bottles stack.

This is a really good point. I store ALL my brewing equipment (except for two pots) in the original box my kit came in. Actually, it is really convenient as I can throw the box in the car and take it with me to, say, my father-in-law's house like I'm doing this weekend to bottle a beer. The box is probably 16"x16"x 3'.

You could get away with a 3 or 4 gallon pot, but you will probably outgrow it quickly - especially if you are looking to do BIAB. I recently did an extract brew in a 3 gallon pot. We added 2.25 gals water but by the time we added all the dry malt extract, that pot was so full we had to pull out wort just to be able to boil. It truly was a pain.

I got a 7 gallon pot and I can just barely get a 5.75 gallon boil going in there, so you could get a 7 gallon pot and make it work, but bigger would be safer. My advice would be, figure out what you think your average boil will be, and get a pot 2 gallons larger.

Like someone else said already too, you may only intend to make a couple gallons of beer at a time, but the beer truly does go away quickly - even if you don't drink much. Between friends and coworkers, I seem to always loose a minimum of 12 bottles of each batch just in hand-outs.

 

[Homercidal]

For 2.5 gallon batches you will find a lot of things you can use instead of buying fancy homebrewing-specific gear. For instance, you can boil a higher gravity wort then add a frozen chunk of sanitized ice to cool it down quickly, while also diluting the wort to desired OG.

This saves having to build/buy a chiller and gets the temp down pretty quick. After the ice is melted you can continue to chill using an ice filled sink. You only nee to get the temp down below 140F to get the benefits of chilling. After that a little while getting down to pitching temp (65F) is no problem.

You can use a 5 gallon Food Grade bucket found at most supermarket deli's or bakeries for really cheap.

You will need a decent waterproof thermometer (I have a CDN cheapo that does a great job and I think I paid $15 at Walmart or something). Make sure it's a decent one. There are PLENTY of cheap and INACCURATE thermometers out there! A nice thermometer will stay in your kit if or when you upgrade.

You will need a hydrometer. You will use it to measure the gravity.

You will need some hose and a bottling bucket with a spigot and bottling wand. (Remember to always disassemble the spigot after use and wash thoroughly.)

You will need a capper, bottles, and caps.

You might want an airlock or three.

Honestly, brewing 2.5-3 gallons is way cheaper and easier than doing 5 gallons and it doesn't require too many special items. Most of the important factors in brewing are process-related, not equipment related.

Tips: Don't boil with the lid on. Pitch proper amount of healthy yeast and ferment at proper temps. Handle fermented wort gently as aeration can cause oxidation later. Clean well, and always sanitize your equipment and ingredients AFTER THE BOIL IS OVER (before that it's not really important...)

Most of all, have fun, and have a homebrew. This isn't rocket science, it's a fun hobby.

 

[LakeErieMonster]

I don't plan on ever getting into this on any scale larger than brewing a couple 6-packs for my own enjoyment.

Thats how we all start out...

 

[ACbrewer]

OP - to save money, you can do this
https://phoenix.craigslist.org/search/sss?query=homebrew beer&sort=rel

I've only bought 1 bucket from a store (7.9 oversized... using it for making wines - which are a 6 gallon standard). I bought 5 buckets and 6 carboys from various people on craigslist.... plus sundry of other parts like racking canes, cappers, etc.

I think everyone else has touched on the gear you need/want for a basic start.

The equipment is broadly in 2 categories - brew/cooking and fermenting. Things like pots, etc fall in the cooking side. Things like fermenting vessels fall in the fermenting side. You indicate that you think you will only make smaller batches. That's fine. If you do extract, you can use a 3 gallon pot to make up to a 5 gallon batch. But you can't use a 3 gallon fermenter for a 5 gallon batch. Actually cause of foaming during ferment, you want about 20% 'air' above your wort/beer during the initial fermentation. this gives the foaming somewhere to go.

If you think you will graduate to larger stuff after your first try, get full size gear for the fermenters. 5 gallons of liquid is pretty standard because much more weighs a lot and is hard to move, so even if you went to 10 gallons, you'd still ferment in 5 gallons. if you do smaller, you can ferment in the 5 gallons for the initial (primary fermenter). You will want "exact sizes" for the secondary/aging fermenter.

I'd recommend you start with a extract because with the pot you have, that is fine. With grain BIAB, you need about 2x or more of the brew volume for this method, and for 'traditional' all grain you need or more vessels for the mashing although they can be closer to actual size of the brew volume. (I think 1.5x)

I use a 3 gallon and a 4 gallon stock pot for my extract batches just fine.

 

[standpoint]

Keep in mind you will be tying up your fermentor for weeks per batch - for small batches and variety you should get multiple fermentors.

I don't think your kettle is big enough - you want AT LEAST a pot 1 to 1.5 gallons bigger than the amount of liquid you need to start boiling with. For example, if you want a 2.5 gallon batch at the end to bottle, and you are doing a 60 minute boil, you will need to add about 4 gallons of water to boil, which you will lose about 1 gallon to boiloff, and maybe 1/2 gallon from kettle, fermentor and bottling bucket loss.

 

[Homercidal]

Probably your biggest problem will be temp control. It's really important and I brewed for a while before realizing how much better my beer could have been if I'd kept th etemps in teh proper range. I'd try to rig up a square cooler or plastic toy bucket swamp cooler for cheap cooling, and a mini fridge for a more expensive solution.

Google swamp cooler for more info. They are cheap, useful, but somewhat inconvenient.

 

[jtratcliff]

Don't forget that for BIAB you're also mashing in your kettle... All your grain and water needs to fit... I very nearly fill a 10g kettle when doing 6g BIAB batches. 12-15lbs of grain, 7ish gallons of strike water leaves only a little room in a 10g kettle.

Simply dividing by 2 to go to a 3 gal batch, you'll want a 5 g kettle.

I use a 10g aluminum tamale steamer that I got for $20... If I were buying today, I'd get then 10g aluminum kettle from Staples for around $40.

There are decent, less-expensive options for SS too if you don't want aluminum.

 

[sremed60]

I don't think your kettle is big enough...

I agree. After looking into it further I decided to buy an 8 gallon kettle.

Probably your biggest problem will be temp control...

I'm in the process of building a "Son of Fermentation Chiller." The actual construction seems easy enough. I remodeled my house one room at a time and I've built furniture in my spare time so gluing styrofoam board together doesn't seem too intimidating. The electronics part, however, is. (I'm not electronically inclined). Radioshack sells a 4" 12v fan for $7, (I believe it's designed to cool audio equipment). I upgraded the thermostat in my house to a programmable one, so I have the old (non-programmable) one around somewhere. I know I need a thermometer with a probe and an AC/DC 12v adapter to make it all work, (still trying to wrap my brain around that part).

I use a 10g aluminum tamale steamer that I got for $20...

Ironically I just bought a 32 qt aluminum tamale steamer at Walmart for $21. I was concerned about cooking with aluminum because of rumors I've always heard about, but after looking into it there's no science behind those rumors. The only drawback to aluminum is that you have to be more careful cleaning it, (which is not really a drawback compared to the cost savings IMHO).
The equipment I've collected so far is:

• 32 qt pot
• 5 gallon glass carboy
• 6.5 gallon plastic fermentation bucket
• hydrometer
• bottle filler
• bottle capper
• 4 cases of bottles, (apparently I drink more than I thought)
• Beersmith 2 software

Still need a few things like a thermometer, racking cane, airlocks, caps... I converted and scaled down a recipe for a sweet stout I found on beersmith and did a little tweaking of the ingredients. I have no idea how it will turn out, but can't wait to give it a shot.

 

[jtratcliff]

The only drawback to aluminum is that you have to be more careful cleaning it, (which is not really a drawback compared to the cost savings IMHO).

The only thing you don't really want to do is to remove your oxide layer. (And you do want to establish an oxide layer first, before your 1st brew). But even if you do, it's easy to re-establish. Just fill with water and boil for a few minutes.

So no PBW soak or anything like that. I just give mine a rinse, maybe a light scrub with nylon brush or scrubby sponge and a little dish soap. Nothing too vigorous. Just enough to knock off any debris. I don't worry about how it looks, though.

 

[brokendownyota]

Do you already have a meat thermometer for your kitchen? If so, you can use that for a while (provided it's reasonably accurate).

I have a digital probe-type meat thermometer, and I just float the probe in my water by poking it through a tupperware lid. That might save you a few bucks to start, and get you moving faster.


Get yourself a bag and start brewing! If you need to grab a few things before bottling day, well, it'll help pass the time. It's easy to get impatient waiting for your yeasty friends to do their business!

-Scott

 

[VegasBrew1]

My personal experience is as follows. I found a big cooler in a thrift store for $3 as I was preparing to brew my first batch. That told me to go all grain from the get go (beer God wisdom). I live in Vegas and found 6.5 gallon buckets for free from hotel pools. They previously contained chlorine. I cleansed them well, and went for it. I now have sacks of 2 row, and a few sacks of other grains (Munich and Crystal). I bought dorm fridges cheap and wired STC 1000 controllers. I'm still not too deeply in debt, but I'm brewing. And loving it. The point is, learn what you can, and choose your path. If you like beer, you're gonna love this hobby.