Is there any accessories that are a must or can be bypassed ? Thought on carbing then transfer or not carbing in the fermenter . Things you've learned after using.
Spike fermenters.
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I also just got my CF5 a few weeks ago and kegged my first batch last night. It went pretty poorly, so much so that I was considering posting it for sale and going back to buckets.
I have the gas manifold because I like the idea of naturally carbing to nearly serving pressure and possibly adding a spunding valve in the future. I also got the chiller and the 1.5” and 2” barbed fittings to limit “mess”. Oh, and the racking arm.
I don’t expect I let it cold crash long enough and I now have a keg full of sediment and trub. I did an “open” pressurized transfer that foamed all over the dang place and got all over the inside of the kegerator. The beer looked clear leaving the conical, but obviously not. I tried not too fill to fast, but I noticed that at the first “notch” of the 1.5” valve, it was just causing even more agitation and foam, so I went to the second notch to reduce co2 coming out of solution.
I think I learned a few lessons... I tried transferring with added co2 pressure of 5psi, I might try lower next time. I’ll also be more patient and just go with the timeline I’m more used to in buckets. I’m also going to go against their recommendations and put 6.5 gallons in there and dump trub after 7-10 days. Lastly, I’m going to pickup their closed transfer kit to be doubly sure to keep this a cleaner process.
I keep adding more and more accessories lol.
I have the gas manifold because I like the idea of naturally carbing to nearly serving pressure and possibly adding a spunding valve in the future. I also got the chiller and the 1.5” and 2” barbed fittings to limit “mess”. Oh, and the racking arm.
I don’t expect I let it cold crash long enough and I now have a keg full of sediment and trub. I did an “open” pressurized transfer that foamed all over the dang place and got all over the inside of the kegerator. The beer looked clear leaving the conical, but obviously not. I tried not too fill to fast, but I noticed that at the first “notch” of the 1.5” valve, it was just causing even more agitation and foam, so I went to the second notch to reduce co2 coming out of solution.
I think I learned a few lessons... I tried transferring with added co2 pressure of 5psi, I might try lower next time. I’ll also be more patient and just go with the timeline I’m more used to in buckets. I’m also going to go against their recommendations and put 6.5 gallons in there and dump trub after 7-10 days. Lastly, I’m going to pickup their closed transfer kit to be doubly sure to keep this a cleaner process.
I keep adding more and more accessories lol.
cswant88
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Transferring fully carbed, next time try pre-cooling the keg, fill through the out port, the counter pressure should keep the foaming down. Pull the prv occasionally to keep it flowing. It works for filling bottles, in theory should work for filling a keg.
Blazinlow86
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It depends on your process. I have the racking arm,pvr,carb stone, barbed connector for the dump Port and a quick connect for the racking arm to my brew hoses. I prefer to transfer completely finished beer to kegs. Cheers
OP
OP
When you transfer completely carbed beer does the keg have to have psi pressure , but not as high as the pressure in the fermenter ?
Do you mean their conical fermenter unitanks, or the newer FLEX fermenter?
If you mean the CF5 or CF10, then the price is higher than the FLEX fermenters. I have a CF10, and I'm glad I bought that instead of the CF5. I brew mostly 5-gallon batches but I felt that I might move up to 10-gallon batches, and the CF10 is only $100 more than the CF5 in order to double capacity.
An issue is how you're going to do temp control. Hard to find a refrigerator or freezer that accommodates these things, though it's easier with the CF5. You can't move them while full unless they're on wheels, so you have to factor in where you want them to be if you can't roll them around.
I have all sorts of ideas about what is needed and not, but it depends on what you're looking to get. Which one, specifically?
If you mean the CF5 or CF10, then the price is higher than the FLEX fermenters. I have a CF10, and I'm glad I bought that instead of the CF5. I brew mostly 5-gallon batches but I felt that I might move up to 10-gallon batches, and the CF10 is only $100 more than the CF5 in order to double capacity.
An issue is how you're going to do temp control. Hard to find a refrigerator or freezer that accommodates these things, though it's easier with the CF5. You can't move them while full unless they're on wheels, so you have to factor in where you want them to be if you can't roll them around.
I have all sorts of ideas about what is needed and not, but it depends on what you're looking to get. Which one, specifically?
OP
OP
I got the cf5 . My Grainfather cant do 10 gallons is why I went the 5 . I have a DIY gylcol chiller . I just finished now all I need is gylcol . I purchased the shorty legs, the shelf (new one ) caster wheels, closed transfer kit and temp control. Looking at getting the gas manifold set up soon .
Agree with closing the keg and filling under pressure. Definitely could have gotten more tools ready and planned this better. I’m going to email Spike and pick up the transfer kit by the time I’m ready to transfer the next batch.
When transferring fully carbed beer, the keg has to be pressurized. Keep the fermenter at whatever pressure you needed to carb it. Mine was around 14 psi yesterday. Hook a line in so that as beer is pushed, the same psi is maintained. Fluctuations in pressure can cause foaming.
If your fermenter is 14 psi, set your keg to just barely under that. Maybe 12-13 psi. Use one of these. https://www.morebeer.com/products/spunding-valve-gauge-ball-lock.html
Just unscrew the end cap until you get the pressure you want, then leave it. I put mine on my grain scale to make sure its flowing very slowly. The slower the better. It can take a very long time, 1 hr plus if going super slow. You can speed it up to however fast you want, but with speed comes foam.
Also, there's no need to throttle the wracking arm valve. Let it go wide open. The receieving keg pressure is how you speed up or slow down
If your fermenter is 14 psi, set your keg to just barely under that. Maybe 12-13 psi. Use one of these. https://www.morebeer.com/products/spunding-valve-gauge-ball-lock.html
Just unscrew the end cap until you get the pressure you want, then leave it. I put mine on my grain scale to make sure its flowing very slowly. The slower the better. It can take a very long time, 1 hr plus if going super slow. You can speed it up to however fast you want, but with speed comes foam.
Also, there's no need to throttle the wracking arm valve. Let it go wide open. The receieving keg pressure is how you speed up or slow down
OP
OP
Hey all , does the spike come with a racking arm ? I just was thinking about that.
CodeSection
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The racking arm is a $25 accessory...and well worth it.
OP
OP
Ok thank you
An hour to transfer? Is everybody doing this? I brew half barrel batches I can't take half a day to package... I've been thinking a unitank would speed up my process and have had this on my upgrades list for when I have an excuse to splurge. But an hour to transfer per keg is a non starter. Somebody tell me it isn't so...
Blazinlow86
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It takes about 5 minutes per keg for me to transfer carbonated beer using a spunding valve. Cheers
Blazinlow86
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Without it you will likely get a clogged connector as the sediment collects around the port area. Cheers
OP
OP
Looks like I'm gonna get 1 asap.
OP
OP
I hope it doesn't take an hour lol. I do a closed transfer right now at a slow pace and it takes 10 tops. This is currently with my fastferment and non carbonated beer though.
It doesn't take me an hour, but my beer typically is carbed at about 7 psi when it's 38 degrees.
I discovered something interesting about transferring equipment. I originally set up my unitank so that I'd have a liquid-out post on the racking valve, and then a double-ended liquid-out jumper I'd use to move that beer from the unitank to the keg. It wasn't particularly fast, but neither was it an hour. Maybe 25 minutes more or less.
But it seemed prone to clogging which slowed things down.
Here's the jumper:
Then I had an inspiration. I changed the fitting on the racking valve to a camlock male fitting, changed one of the liquid out QDs to a female camlock fitting, and it is MUCH faster.
Here's that new setup:
There's always going to be an issue with hop or krausen trub clogging the poppets, and if one isn't careful that stuff will clog things up, slowing transfer to a crawl. So it's a good idea to clear the racking arm of anything that will clog things up.
I will clear the racking arm and tubing of trub by attaching this jumper post to the liquid QD, and then running beer through that line to ensure everything is clear.
Here's that jumper post:
That has the added effect of purging the line of air, so that when I turn off the racking valve, remove the jumper post and attach the QD to the keg, I have a purged line, no trub issues, and it flows pretty fast.
Typically I'll pressurize the fermenter to about 12psi, then put a spunding valve on the keg at about 8psi. That works in my setup.
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OP
OP
Dang mongoose ! I could totally hang and have a beer with you and tinker with modding brewing equipment. I dig your style man. You seem to be always trying to make something better. 
Given your 5 minute keg transfers I really want to make sure I'm understanding what you are doing Blazinlow86.
Can you provide a link for "quick connect for the racking arm to your brew hoses" you are using?
Is it something like this?
https://spikebrewing.com/collections/conical-accessories/products/1-5-tc-x-qc-2
Then a you put one of these https://spikebrewing.com/collections/conical-accessories/products/quick-connect-fitting-fqc-x-barb-1
on a line with a ball lock liquid out connector on the other end of the line?
I suppose you use 1/2" inner diameter silicone hose to connect those two fittings right?
What pressure is the tank and what pressure is the keg? Do you have a spunding valve on the keg while filling? Do you do anything different with dry hopped beers? 5 min per keg sounds too good to be true, I'd be super happy with 10 min.
I dont operate a brewery. Time is something I have plenty of. I plainly said that you could speed up the process by opening up the receiving keg pressure.
That being said, I am moving fully carbonated beer that has been highly hopped. I'll just be blunt and call BS for efficiently filling a keg in 5 mins. I'm transferring clear beer, not foam. You go too fast and you lose carbonation that foams, leaving kegs that arent full, also causing turbulence that picks up hop particles.
Whatever your formula is, the process I laid out above is the same.
Ask yourself this ... what pressure do you serve your beer at from a keg. How fast can you drain a keg just leaving the tap handle open. Thats your base time it will take to fill the same volume. How much foaming is produced through your balanced beer lines. Are you happy with that amount of foam or would you like less. That's the time differential that will be in addition to your base.
That being said, I am moving fully carbonated beer that has been highly hopped. I'll just be blunt and call BS for efficiently filling a keg in 5 mins. I'm transferring clear beer, not foam. You go too fast and you lose carbonation that foams, leaving kegs that arent full, also causing turbulence that picks up hop particles.
Whatever your formula is, the process I laid out above is the same.
Ask yourself this ... what pressure do you serve your beer at from a keg. How fast can you drain a keg just leaving the tap handle open. Thats your base time it will take to fill the same volume. How much foaming is produced through your balanced beer lines. Are you happy with that amount of foam or would you like less. That's the time differential that will be in addition to your base.
It takes me about 10 minutes for 5 gallons. Spunding on receiving keg set to 10psi which is what the beer in the unitank is carbed to. 20 psi on the unitank headspace. No foam at all.
I'll have to try that next time. That is much more believable.
Blazinlow86
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I've never actually timed it so admittedly it could be closer to 10 mins. I don't have links for the accessories but it's pretty simple. I use a 1.5 tclamp fitting on the racking port with the same quick release fitting as my kettles so when I'm finished whirlpool chilling I just remove the brew hose from the whirlpool fitting and attach it to the racking arm and pump the wort into the fermentor. I don't have to move any hoses this way and don't loose any wort. When it comes to transfering the carbed beer into kegs I have a barbed 1.5 tclamp fitting with a ball lock connector on the other end. My fermentor is usually at 13psi and I use a spunding valve set around 10psi but that can vary depending on how much time I have. Hopefully that helps. Cheers
Dang mongoose ! I could totally hang and have a beer with you and tinker with modding brewing equipment. I dig your style man. You seem to be always trying to make something better.
Continuous quality improvment, baby!
Blazinlow86
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The only way to brew. Cheers
Ok got it nothing fancy. I do similar with my fermenter now just no TC.
How about dry hops. I get so frustrated with clogged poppets sometimes have to switch to a set I’ve removed the poppet from the post and the stem from the disconnect. Closed transfer comprised but what else can you do?
Blazinlow86
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I've never had issues with dryhops and I do alot of neipas between 12-18 gallons so alot of hops. Key is a good cold crash and definitely need the racking arm. After a 2-3 day crash at 35f all the sediment has dropped out and it's clear finished beer. Cheers
I have the carb stone but I've never used it. I oxygenate the wort using a long wand w/ a sintered stone at the end, and even though I have a CF10, not the CF5 like you do, it's more than enough to do it.
I don't carbonate in the fermenter using a stone; instead, I seal up the fermenter when there are about 5-7 gravity points remaining in the fermentation, and it self-carbonates not unlike how bottle conditioning occurs. I don't get complete carbonation because the PRV will release on mine about 12 psi.
Since I'm sealing it up while still at fermentation temps, rather than chilled temps, when I crash the beer to 38 degrees, the pressure drops to around 7psi. That's when I transfer to keg using a spunding valve. I'll set the spunding valve about 8psi, and up the pressure in the fermenter using CO2 to 12psi. I'll finish carbonating in the keg using the normal procedure, but that doesn't take long since it's already got about 1.5 volumes of CO2 in the beer.
Speaking of that--it would take two strong men with crowbars to pry the pressure manifold away from me. The pressure manifold has a pressure gauge, a PRV, and a gas post. It's just invaluable. You can pressurize the fermenter with CO2 from a regulator, you can draw off CO2 during fermentation simply by connecting a QD to that gas post and terminating the tubing in a jar....which really is nice because you can easily monitor fermentation by the bubbling.
You can even create a device using a butterfly valve, sight glass, and the pressure manifold to add dry hops without introducing oxygen into the system when you do that. Here's a link showing how I do that: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/no-oxygen-dry-hopping.663500/page-4#post-8581502
So--IMO, no need for the carbonation/oxygenating stone, and yes, yes, yes, get the pressure manifold w/ the items I listed.
Blazinlow86
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It's definitely not a requirement but it's actually one of my favorite parts. For me personally I only have room to keep 8 kegs refrigerated at a time if I'm using my cf15 so typically fresh kegs can sit at room temperature for awhile. By carbing all 3 kegs prior to racking it allows me to forget about them until I tap them or they get gifted away. Cheers
OP
OP
Well I drove home in excitement to get my cf5 as it was delivered. Man this thing is nice . What a work of beauty lol. When your daughter and wife say , it tells you something when your daughter and wife say, wow that's nice . Only thing I noticed was tiny scratches on the top where the rubber gasket meets the conical. Inside looks pristine. Cant wait to use this bad boy. Gotta get the racking arm and manifold asap!
Just to whet your appetite a bit more, here's a pic of me doing a pressure transfer this afternoon:
OP
OP
My fastfermenter schedule was
Transfer wort
Pitch
Day#7 dump yeast and trub
Then I'd keg on day 21 .
This should essentially be ok doing same with this fermenter right ? I'm a little Leary of dumping yeast and trub because I dont want beer to come shooting out .
Transfer wort
Pitch
Day#7 dump yeast and trub
Then I'd keg on day 21 .
This should essentially be ok doing same with this fermenter right ? I'm a little Leary of dumping yeast and trub because I dont want beer to come shooting out .
What I would do. Transfer wort from kettle, let trub settle for 1-2 hours and pitch the first quart. Pitch yeast. When bubbling slows drastically collect yeast over next 2-3 days with a soft cold crash to 50 at the tail end. Close valve to natuarally carbonate. Cold crash 2-3 days, more depending on carbonation, keg around day 14.
I can't answer this question because I never dump yeast and trub. I figured at some point I might try to harvest yeast but haven't found the need to do that yet.
The beer in the pic above showing the pressure transfer was brewed on May 25; today, June 4, is 10 days after pitching the yeast. It's gone through fermentation at 60 degrees, then ramped it up to 69 for a couple days at the tail end of fermentation, then back down to 60 for about 36 hours, then crashed it to 38 degrees.
That beer came out carbed at about 7.5 psi, I have it on 30 psi for six hours, then I'll see where I am with it. Meanwhile, my fermenter is empty, cleaned, sanitized, and ready for another brew day. BTW, it's a Kolsch, and at 10 days it is already drinkable and then some.
BTW, tried something with the yeast that I've never done. It was WLP029, german ale yeast, liquid yeast. I just pitched it from the packet, no starter.
I'm anxious to see how it all turns out, but early returns are excellent. Going to sample at 11:30pm tonite.
Blazinlow86
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When I first purchased my cf15 and tried harvesting yeast the first time I wasted alot of beer and have gone back to just over building my starters instead. Typically I wait until fermentation is almost done them add any dryhops and additionally switch the blow off to the prv valve. Once my dryhop schedule is complete there's usually between 5-10 psi built up at fermentation temp. I then set my controller to 35f and wait 48 hours. I then attach a barbed fitting with a piece of silicone brew hose from the dump Port into a gallon jug. Without the barb and hose to direct and slow the flow i would imagine a spectacular mess and terrible dump. With the pressure in the fermentor you only need to open the valve the tiniest amount and it will push the sediment out cleanly without wasting a bunch of beer. This needs to be done as slow as possible. I then add the carb stone and 24 hours later it's transfered into kegs without any sediment. Cheers
Blazinlow86
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That's a good idea if your harvesting yeast. Definitely cut down on the waste. Cheers
OP
OP
I dont harvest yeast . Might just leave yeast and trub for the whole duration. I'm just a creature of habit as I was taught to leave the beer alone and not rush it. That's why I let my beer sit for 3 weeks . I've never cold crashed either. Now I have my DIY chiller I will get to cold crash .
I appreciate all your input and tips on the fermenter.
I appreciate all your input and tips on the fermenter.
Blazinlow86
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You could keep doing like that if you prefer. Only thing that crossed my mind is I'm not sure how high up the cone the sediment will settle. If you don't have the racking arm and or forgot to position it upwards you might clog your connector when racking. When I dump I usually get at least .5 a gallon and if I remember correctly the dead space below the racking arm was the similar. Cheers
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