Spike Conical- observations and best practices

[eric19312]

Got it, thanks. I thought about the oxygen in the elbow after the fact as I decided to order the stuff to rouse after I had brewed this particular batch. I also thought if I did not get all the oxygen out of the elbow, how much of the little bit that may be left would actually have time to dissolve into the beer? Wouldn't it likely bubble to surface and be pushed out the top as I pull the prv, and not have a chance to dissolve into the liquid with the co2 forcing it out?

Perhaps, guess it depends partly on how cold the beer is and lots of physics stuff I forgot long ago. I'm thinking try your planned bleed/purge. Then, making sure you have some headspace CO2 pressure, hook up a gas connector to your post and crack open the butterfly. If you are lucky there might not be a solid immobile hop plug and you will get some beer that will flow in and push out the semi-purged air. If nothing moves, close the butterfly, redo your partial purge, and hope for the best. Be quick about getting rid of the first bubbles that come up.

 

[Yesfan]

Shot from the top with racking added to the sample valve port. All good and the price from spike is really good. No noticeable weight added to front of conical. A lot of it is inside
View attachment 759832

How much of that inside weight is from the coil? I don't have a cooling coil, so was curious to know.

 

[WesBrew]

It’s a couple lbs. I have 9” leg extenders and the wide brace at the bottom so I didn’t notice any difference. I also took out the elbow and have that heavy butterfly valve direct mounted so the weight is centered . That made a big difference

 

[Yesfan]

That cooling coil looks pretty beefy, so thought I'd ask.

 

[kingmatt]

Brewed a NEIPA as my inaugural batch on the CF5 over the weekend:

 

[k-daddy]

Brewed a NEIPA as my inaugural batch on the CF5 over the weekend:
View attachment 760468

Congrats, I have an older version of the same. Up to you but I would suggest swapping the thermoprobe and sample ports. Cleaner samples as there’s no downward angle and the thermoprobe ends up in nearly the same spot. Cheers!

 

[kingmatt]

Congrats, I have an older version of the same. Up to you but I would suggest swapping the thermoprobe and sample ports. Cleaner samples as there’s no downward angle and the thermoprobe ends up in nearly the same spot. Cheers!

Thanks, I'll try that next time. I don't really plan to take many samples, if at all, however, as I also use a Tilt to monitor my fermentation.

 

[Tom R]

You don't sneak "tastes" along the way (like I do)?

 

[k-daddy]

Thanks, I'll try that next time. I don't really plan to take many samples, if at all, however, as I also use a Tilt to monitor my fermentation.

I always sample, but only for taste as I also use a Tilt to monitor gravity.

 

[WesBrew]

Samples , yes for me. I’m going to make an extra gallon, maybe even bottle some before the keg. This is how I have it setup currently. Won’t be using the blowoff elbow.
***forgot to put it on the conical but have a 1.5tc gas port with a carb stone. took it off of a corny carbing lid.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

Samples?? To taste??? You all mean for quality control right?

I have a tilt, don't use it all the time, this allows for .... "hydrometer samples"

 

[Yesfan]

I envy you guys with those three port lids..............

 

[k-daddy]

I envy you guys with those three port lids..............

I almost bought one but after thinking it through, didn't see the need. The single 1-1/2" port, coupled with a butterfly valve, sight glass and Blichmann spunding attachment handles pressure fermentation, blow off and dry hop drop... less cleaning, fewer places for bacteria to hide and more $'s for brewing ingredients.

 

[Yesfan]

I almost bought one but after thinking it through, didn't see the need. The single 1-1/2" port, coupled with a butterfly valve, sight glass and Blichmann spunding attachment handles pressure fermentation, blow off and dry hop drop... less cleaning, fewer places for bacteria to hide and more $'s for brewing ingredients.

I like to have one. The biggest issue is being stuck with the old one. Part of me gets why Spike can't mod mine or take it in as a "trade in" and the other part kinda rubs me the wrong way. I like their new spunding valve they have coming out in spring. Glad I didn't splurge on the manifold when I got some good for my Flex+.

I have a 4" to 2" reducer that I've got laying around. I don't have the cooling cool, so I may just do something with that port at least.

 

[khannon]

I almost bought one but after thinking it through, didn't see the need. The single 1-1/2" port, coupled with a butterfly valve, sight glass and Blichmann spunding attachment handles pressure fermentation, blow off and dry hop drop... less cleaning, fewer places for bacteria to hide and more $'s for brewing ingredients.

Maybe it's because I don't use the internal temp controller, but I don't really see the need for more ports on the lid. I have a the CF-15, and do 10-12G batches, use a spunding valve with gauge and CO2 input on the 1.5 or just an airlock, and have the 4" the the see-through lid.

 

[k-daddy]

I like to have one. The biggest issue is being stuck with the old one. Part of me gets why Spike can't mod mine or take it in as a "trade in" and the other part kinda rubs me the wrong way. I like their new spunding valve they have coming out in spring. Glad I didn't splurge on the manifold when I got some good for my Flex+.

I have a 4" to 2" reducer that I've got laying around. I don't have the cooling cool, so I may just do something with that port at least.

This is the one I use Spunding Valve. It allows for me to purge my kegs using the fermentation gas. Looks like the new Spike all in one PRV is just a modified airlock on top and won't allow for that.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

I'm happy with my purchase of the 3 port lid. Is it necessary? Obviously not, but it is convenient. I do wish that they made the dry hop port 2 inch for the hops to drop easier but I have done the dry hop a few times now and got a process that works pretty well for me. I do wish I would have known the spunding valve was coming out before I got another pressure manifold ( 2 cf15s) but oh well, I'll get the new valve when it comes out anyhow and have a backup pressure manifold.

 

[Yesfan]

This is the one I use Spunding Valve. It allows for me to purge my kegs using the fermentation gas. Looks like the new Spike all in one PRV is just a modified airlock on top and won't allow for that.

I like that valve a lot. I also like Blichmann's aseptic sample valve too.

Spike's spunding valve looks like it will still let you purge kegs with fermentation gas. There's a gas post on the back side. It looks cool, but it's going to be about $40 higher than Blichmann's.

 

[t4tombo]

I'm about to purchase a conical. From what I've read about these is they allow you to purchase accessories for how you want to use the system, but the base model is not turn key. So coming from the world of small plastic buckets I'm not sure what I need. But what I would like is to be able to force carb and do closed transfers. So what accessories do I need? This is what I think I'll need so far

• carb stone bundle
• extra clamps and gaskets
• cip ball
• gas manifold bundle
• close transfer kit
• 1.5 sight glass
• racking arm (is it true one isn't included?)
• tc100 bundle

What else would I need to get my first batch out? I'm still up in the air about whether to get a 10 or a 15.

 

[eric19312]

I'm about to purchase a conical. From what I've read about these is they allow you to purchase accessories for how you want to use the system, but the base model is not turn key. So coming from the world of small plastic buckets I'm not sure what I need. But what I would like is to be able to force carb and do closed transfers. So what accessories do I need? This is what I think I'll need so far

• carb stone bundle
• extra clamps and gaskets
• cip ball
• gas manifold bundle
• close transfer kit
• 1.5 sight glass
• racking arm (is it true one isn't included?)
• tc100 bundle

What else would I need to get my first batch out? I'm still up in the air about whether to get a 10 or a 15.

carb stone bundle includes the gas manifold so you don't need the manifold bundle too
not sure you need the 1.5 sight glass...maybe nice to have but I don't use it so can't say
you do need the racking arm and gasket and clamp for that unit
close transfer kit seems like a good option unless you already some of the pieces, in that case you can get what you dont have from brewershardware.com

the CIP ball is debatable - do you have a pump that can drive it? most are not very happy with performance using a typical homebrew pump
tc100 bundle is debatable - you need it if you are sure you are going to control temps with glycol, in which case you need a glycol system too. you don't need it if controlling temps with a fridge or freezer...

anyway this would get you started. you may want to add something for dry hopping along the way. Also if you are not buying right away you may want to consider the new spunding valve instead of the gas manifold. Not sure if they are going to have a spunding valve carb stone bundle...

 

[k-daddy]

I'm about to purchase a conical. From what I've read about these is they allow you to purchase accessories for how you want to use the system, but the base model is not turn key. So coming from the world of small plastic buckets I'm not sure what I need. But what I would like is to be able to force carb and do closed transfers. So what accessories do I need? This is what I think I'll need so far

• carb stone bundle
• extra clamps and gaskets
• cip ball
• gas manifold bundle
• close transfer kit
• 1.5 sight glass
• racking arm (is it true one isn't included?)
• tc100 bundle

What else would I need to get my first batch out? I'm still up in the air about whether to get a 10 or a 15.

My 2 cents after years with the CF-5.
I have the carb stone... don't use it at all.
Extra clamps/gaskets... never hurts to have spares.
I have the cip ball. Not really necessary... the conical is easy to clean thanks to the lid configuration and TC ports. My BIAB kettle has a 1.5" TC on the lid and I have used it for that but again, not that often.
I have the gas manifold... no longer use it since I purchased this Spunding Valve You can adjust pressure with this one where the Spike is a set PRV.
Transfer kit - yes.
Sight glass... I have the 2" as I use it for my dry hop drop (need 2" to 1.5" TC adapters)
Racking arm... YES!
TC bundle... YES.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

^^ what they said^^

 

[OakIslandBrewery]

I'm about to purchase a conical. From what I've read about these is they allow you to purchase accessories for how you want to use the system, but the base model is not turn key. So coming from the world of small plastic buckets I'm not sure what I need. But what I would like is to be able to force carb and do closed transfers. So what accessories do I need? This is what I think I'll need so far

• carb stone bundle
• extra clamps and gaskets
• cip ball
• gas manifold bundle
• close transfer kit
• 1.5 sight glass
• racking arm (is it true one isn't included?)
• tc100 bundle

What else would I need to get my first batch out? I'm still up in the air about whether to get a 10 or a 15.

All great advice from the gang here and I understand about getting everything you need but advancing from plastic buckets to a conical is a big step. I'd try a few batches then make upgrades as you get a feel for how everything works. I don't want to deflate your sails, but you might find some upgrades you might not need right now. I'm on my second conical and some items I thought I needed I really didn't after a few batches. But, as I say great advice from the team here!

 

[auburntsts]

My 2 cents after years with the CF-5.
I have the carb stone... don't use it at all.
Extra clamps/gaskets... never hurts to have spares.
I have the cip ball. Not really necessary... the conical is easy to clean thanks to the lid configuration. My BIAB kettle has a 1.5" TC on the lid and I have used it for that but again, not that often.
I have the gas manifold... no longer use it since I purchased this Spunding Valve You can adjust pressure with this one where the Spike is a set PRV.
Transfer kit - yes.
Sight glass... I have the 2" as I use it for my dry hop drop (need 2" to 1.5" TC adapters)
Racking arm... YES!
TC bundle... YES.

Mostly concur with the above. I have the carb stone and use it to oxygenate my wort prior to pitching yeast but I don’t carb in my conical. I also have the CIP but don’t use it anymore. I can clean my CF-5 out by hand way faster than using the CIP. I guess it depends on where you’re going to setup and whether cleaning in place is easier for you. However, as mentioned you do need a pump with some umph to drive it. I have the old style gas manifold but Spike is releasing a new one that’s adjustable and spunding capable so you might want to hold out for that. Finally I have a sight glass but don’t use it mainly because I don’t harvest yeast and have no other use for it as I don’t dry hop so don’t really see the point.

 

[k-daddy]

Mostly concur with the above. I have the carb stone and use it to oxygenate my wort prior to pitching yeast but I don’t carb in my conical. I also have the CIP but don’t use it anymore. I can clean my CF-5 out by hand way faster than using the CIP. I guess it depends on where you’re going to setup and whether cleaning in place is easier for you. However, as mentioned you do need a pump with some umph to drive it. I have the old style gas manifold but Spike is releasing a new one that’s adjustable and spunding capable so you might want to hold out for that. Finally I have a sight glass but don’t use it mainly because I don’t harvest yeast and have no other use for it as I don’t dry hop so don’t really see the point.

My issue with the carb stone is that, for my configuration, I would attach it to the butterfly valve in front of the racking arm (I use both the thermowell port and sample port). I did a test run with water to see if the micro bubbles would make it through to the conical after traveling through the racking arm... they didn't... it was only large bubbles at the exit to the conical. For that reason, I now simply oxygenate through the top port with a wand.

 

[OakIslandBrewery]

My issue with the carb stone is that, for my configuration, I would attach it to the butterfly valve in front of the racking arm (I use both the thermowell port and sample port). I did a test run with water to see if the micro bubbles would make it through to the conical after traveling through the racking arm... they didn't... it was only large bubbles at the exit to the conical. For that reason, I now simply oxygenate through the top port with a wand.

I oxygenate with an inline carb-stone in a tee as I transfer from the chiller to the fermenter. It's the same port I transfer to kegs after fermentation. Everything is TC fittings on the conical (Spike) and QD's so it's all easy to clean/sanitize afterwards.

 

[eric19312]

My issue with the carb stone is that, for my configuration, I would attach it to the butterfly valve in front of the racking arm (I use both the thermowell port and sample port). I did a test run with water to see if the micro bubbles would make it through to the conical after traveling through the racking arm... they didn't... it was only large bubbles at the exit to the conical. For that reason, I now simply oxygenate through the top port with a wand.

I use the carb stone the way you describe (on the racking arm) to both oxygenate and carbonate. Every batch. Works great. You do have to rotate the racking arm to above horizontal when using it.

 

[OakIslandBrewery]

I use the carb stone the way you describe (on the racking arm) to both oxygenate and carbonate. Every batch. Works great. You do have to rotate the racking arm to above horizontal when using it.

So you are carbonating the beer before you transfer to kegs at the end of fermentation? Forgive me if I'm missing something with all of the posts here.

 

[eric19312]

I forgot one...

Spike made the thermowell an option...you are going to need one...

 

[k-daddy]

I use the carb stone the way you describe (on the racking arm) to both oxygenate and carbonate. Every batch. Works great. You do have to rotate the racking arm to above horizontal when using it.

That's what I did... only got big bubbles coming out of the racking arm and they simply percolated to the surface in a straight line. As the micro bubbles passed through the racking arm, the bubbles joined together to form large bubbles before exiting the racking arm tubing. Made me ask; how effective can this be? Perhaps it does serve to oxygenate the wort but I didn't trust that it would.

 

[t4tombo]

My 2 cents after years with the CF-5.
I have the carb stone... don't use it at all.
Extra clamps/gaskets... never hurts to have spares.
I have the cip ball. Not really necessary... the conical is easy to clean thanks to the lid configuration and TC ports. My BIAB kettle has a 1.5" TC on the lid and I have used it for that but again, not that often.
I have the gas manifold... no longer use it since I purchased this Spunding Valve You can adjust pressure with this one where the Spike is a set PRV.
Transfer kit - yes.
Sight glass... I have the 2" as I use it for my dry hop drop (need 2" to 1.5" TC adapters)
Racking arm... YES!
TC bundle... YES.

I forgot one...

Spike made the thermowell an option...you are going to need one...

I'm getting the TC100 package, that says the thermowell is included.

 

[t4tombo]

carb stone bundle includes the gas manifold so you don't need the manifold bundle too
not sure you need the 1.5 sight glass...maybe nice to have but I don't use it so can't say
you do need the racking arm and gasket and clamp for that unit
close transfer kit seems like a good option unless you already some of the pieces, in that case you can get what you dont have from brewershardware.com

the CIP ball is debatable - do you have a pump that can drive it? most are not very happy with performance using a typical homebrew pump
tc100 bundle is debatable - you need it if you are sure you are going to control temps with glycol, in which case you need a glycol system too. you don't need it if controlling temps with a fridge or freezer...

anyway this would get you started. you may want to add something for dry hopping along the way. Also if you are not buying right away you may want to consider the new spunding valve instead of the gas manifold. Not sure if they are going to have a spunding valve carb stone bundle...

Thanks for the reply, I didn't include on the list I was considering the glycol chiller. I saw someone post a link to a spunding valve, I'll look at that. I'll pass on the cip ball. Thanks for the advise.

 

[cbier60]

I'm getting the TC100 package, that says the thermowell is included.

Try negotiating with Spike to remove the thermometer and credit you. It is idiotic that they include this expensive accessory in the baseline and make you buy a thermowell as an addition. Any automated control needs a thermowell instead of a useless thermometer.

 

[cbier60]

Also, all those accessories add up to a lot of $$$. Consider ordering things you can wait a little time on like extra clamps and gaskets or even sight glasses from Alibaba. After I got my CF10 last fall, I ended up ordering $100+ of accessories from Spike and at least as much other more generic accessories from Alibaba. It took 4-8 weeks to get most parts, but the quality is comparable to what Spike (or other US sources) sells. Obviously, everything you have listed is probably at least as much as the fermenter.

 

[eric19312]

So you are carbonating the beer before you transfer to kegs at the end of fermentation? Forgive me if I'm missing something with all of the posts here.

yes beer is fully or at least 90% carbed before transfering into the kegs. Some of that is natural carbonation captured at end of fermentation with the rest being provided through the stone. It adds some minor complexity to the kegging operation...mainly that the purged kegs need to be pressurized during filling to prevent foaming.

 

[eric19312]

I'm getting the TC100 package, that says the thermowell is included.

gotcha...i just looked at the picture, I guess they added it to the description but kept the old picture on the website.

Try negotiating with Spike to remove the thermometer and credit you. It is idiotic that they include this expensive accessory in the baseline and make you buy a thermowell as an addition. Any automated control needs a thermowell instead of a useless thermometer.

and if that is too difficult in their packaging operation Spike should just include a cap for that port in the kit (and drop the price accordingly) and let buyers accessorize as desired. I'd be super interested to know how many conical users don't use a thermowell.

Spike used to include a thermowell with a thermometer that screwed into the thermowell. That was a nice item, I still use it but the thermometer part of it is accessorizing my HLT...

 

[WesBrew]

If it helps anyone… . I pieced together a carbonation setup cheap on amazon. $8 stone. $13 tri clamp with corny keg gas fitting , $8 clamp., $7 ss tee for co2 to run a longer line to the CF10. I already had the gas manifold and you can’t attach a stone to it.
t got he TC fitting for fermenter to keg pressure transfer. I had a stone and post in the parts bin, so set it up for carbing. Not sure which one will be more useful

 

[natmartin]

How do y'all rouse yeast in your conical? Bubble in Co2 through the dump port?

 

[cbier60]

How do y'all rouse yeast in your conical? Bubble in Co2 through the dump port?

That is what I have done for the two IPAs I have made since I got my CF10. Hop presence is far better than I ever achieved prior to this purchase.

I've not needed to rouse yeast.

If you meant rouse dry hops yep bubbling up some CO2 through the dump port works really well.

Sorry, I was referring to dry hops. CO2 would rouse the yeast, but I agree that I have never had a need to do so.

 

[eric19312]

How do y'all rouse yeast in your conical? Bubble in Co2 through the dump port?

I've not needed to rouse yeast.

If you meant rouse dry hops yep bubbling up some CO2 through the dump port works really well. But I never stop playing and have recently built a pump based recirculation system like the one described in this post: #31 by @k-daddy

my own pictures and will be added soon. but I can say it seemed to work really well for making sure the pellet hops were fully dissolved and well mixed with the beer. Also want to get a couple batches done and see what I think of the impact on the beer.