Simple Yeast Storage Procedure

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First of all, thank all of you guys for all of the expertise and experience you've posted. It has definitely helped me out.

I have a couple of questions (my first yeast harvest today).

1) I just harvested this morning (US 05) after I had my house IPA cold crashing. I left a very small amount of beer in the carboy and then added sterile water from my mason jar, swirled and poured. This picture is about 10 or 15 minutes later, am I looking OK? I dry hopped in the primary in a mesh bag so I expect there to be extra debris.

2) I wanted to brew another IPA today so I was going to run the numbers (need about 300b cells for my pitch) and leave however much slurry I need at room temp to warm up and pitch later on today when the wort is ready. Is this OK or should it refrigerate a day to separate more then decant and pitch?

Thanks!

yeast_harvest.jpg
 
After settling you'll probably end up with about 180ml compacted slurry, looking at those two smaller jars in your pic. You could use right away if you factor that in, assuming 180 ml slurry at 1.5B cells per ml. Give or take a few cells, one jar will get you that 300B amount.
 
Any reason you added the water? As long as it's viscous enough to pour, you shouldn't need to add any water.
 
Didn't leave much beer behind to get a good swirl going and I read a few guys adding water instead of using beer due to potential cell loss of higher abv.

Pitched and checked this morning to some nice activity!
 
Ok, so I have a batch of saison I brewed in August. It has been sitting at room temp in primary since then. I'd like to re-use that yeast for a batch of rye saison this weekend. I've heard that keeping the beer on the yeast cake is the best way to keep the yeast.

Given that it's been sitting on beer for about 3 months now, what would the estimated vitality be? My upcoming rye saison is about 1.055 gravity, and I was just going to scoop out about half the cake and pitch the new batch onto the remaining cake. Does that sound about right?
 
I'm estimating approximately 1.5B cells/ml in fresh slurry with 17% loss in viability per month (or 50% in 3 months). You could try those numbers for calculating amount of slurry needed. Pitching on 1/2 the yeast cake is still an over pitch. It's a good idea to pitch the smaller recommended amounts to ensure fresh cell growth rather than relying entirely on tired old yeast. If you're doing a standard 1.050 5.5 gal brew, you need approximately 200B cells. At an estimated 0.75B cells/ml you'll need only 300 ml of slurry. Add a little more if you want to make sure.
 
tgmartin000 said:
Ok, so I have a batch of saison I brewed in August. It has been sitting at room temp in primary since then. I'd like to re-use that yeast for a batch of rye saison this weekend. I've heard that keeping the beer on the yeast cake is the best way to keep the yeast.

Given that it's been sitting on beer for about 3 months now, what would the estimated vitality be? My upcoming rye saison is about 1.055 gravity, and I was just going to scoop out about half the cake and pitch the new batch onto the remaining cake. Does that sound about right?
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I would not worry too much about viability.
That yeast has barely been asleep for long, so most likely it is still plenty viable enough.
Using Brewers Friend (and assuming 5.5 gallons for a batch volume)
It says 212 Billion cells needed

So I would take a good healthy scoop of 250mL (1 cup) of slurry from the previous batch and chuck it in the new batch.

Assuming a 1B per mL ratio, that gets you plenty to get the job done.:mug:
And an even more realistic number of 1.5 Billion cells per mL will get you more than enough to get the job done.
 
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I'm going to attempt to use my 7 month old yeast this week to see what the result of older slurries is.
Since I'm dealing with a large volume of slurry (400ml +) what's the safest way to bring it to room temperature to either pitch into my new wort, or to put in my flask with a small starter for the stir plate?
Should I leave it at room temperature in the morning and use it in the evening when the temperature is close to room temp? I'm worried about shocking the yeast if the temperature isn't close

Thanks!
 
stever1000 said:
I'm going to attempt to use my 7 month old yeast this week to see what the result of older slurries is.
Since I'm dealing with a large volume of slurry (400ml +) what's the safest way to bring it to room temperature to either pitch into my new wort, or to put in my flask with a small starter for the stir plate?
Should I leave it at room temperature in the morning and use it in the evening when the temperature is close to room temp? I'm worried about shocking the yeast if the temperature isn't close

Thanks!
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I take it out of the fridge and let it warm up while I brew. If you're making a starter, I would do the same: Bring it up to temp sitting somewhere warm, then pitch into cooled wort just like you would a beer.
 
Is there any reason I can't leave it out for 8 hours and then use it in a starter? Or likely will that starve the yeast as they wake up and become active again?
 
I probably wouldn't leave it too long after it reached room temp, but that's me. For that length, I imagine they would just remain inactive until given a food source though, without too much cell loss. Then again, I don't really care much about the science and toss cold, 5 month old yeast into warm wort without a starter. :)
 
stever1000 said:
Sorry, can you clarify: Did you pitch it directly in the wort from the fridge or did you warm it up first?
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I pulled it out of the fridge, canted the majority of the separated wort, swirled it around to suspend the slurry and dumped in.

No warming.
 
Jiffster said:
I pulled it out of the fridge, canted the majority of the separated wort, swirled it around to suspend the slurry and dumped in.
No warming.
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stever1000 said:
Excellent, that simplifies my process significantly!
Thanks:mug:
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While I agree that this simplifies the process, it is not the best scenario for the yeast.
They do not do well with a large temperature difference as it "shocks" them and stresses them out.
Just take it out the night before and give it time to warm up.
It's going to hurt them less than shocking them with large temp change
 
Okay, that is just as easy. I'll take it out the night before my brew day.
Thanks!
 
Yambor44 said:
Jiffster, how much slurry did you pitch? I used a cup per 5 gallon batch this past weekend and I only got about 1.75" of krausen.
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I didn't measure it but I'm estimating ~ 1cup. Keep in mind that I'm a new brewer. This was my second batch.

I read a discussion in another post regarding storing starters and if it's better to re-start them or pitch cold, etc. One experienced brewer stated that he never warmed or re-started the starter (paraphrasing) and had consistently good results..., so I ran with that.

I have no experience to base this on, but, perhaps your level of krausen was normal for your batch/style of beer?

Or perhaps mine produced a more active fermentation because I oxygenated with O2 before pitching my starter?
 
brewkinger said:
While I agree that this simplifies the process, it is not the best scenario for the yeast.
They do not do well with a large temperature difference as it "shocks" them and stresses them out.
Just take it out the night before and give it time to warm up.
It's going to hurt them less than shocking them with large temp change
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Lately, I've been putting my starter on the stir plate after decanting. Basically, when I start to chill my wort, I'll decant the starter, put it on the stir plate, and give it that half hour on the stir plate until I'm ready to pitch. I think this gives the yeast a last shot of oxygen and helps wake them up to go to work. I've found this seems to cut down on my lag time, from about 12 to 8 hours lag, and when the yeast start, they take off like a rocket. I'd be interested to see if any one else has tried this with similar results.
 
I believe I had read something about it in this very thread but when I needed it now of course I couldn't find it.
The advice was to keep the jars in the fridge with lids closed but not tightened. In my case I much prefer to have yeast containers airtight.
I remember there was an explanation and step by step instruction what to do and when, something like put the lids on, refrigerate for so and so time at such and such temperature, and only after than tighten the lids, all that and a bit more.
I am sorry for asking what is probably a common place but could anyone please help me in restoring those instructions or simply point me to where I can find them.
Many thanks!
 
GQT said:
I believe I had read something about it in this very thread but when I needed it now of course I couldn't find it.
The advice was to keep the jars in the fridge with lids closed but not tightened. In my case I much prefer to have yeast containers airtight.
I remember there was an explanation and step by step instruction what to do and when, something like put the lids on, refrigerate for so and so time at such and such temperature, and only after than tighten the lids, all that and a bit more.
I am sorry for asking what is probably a common place but could anyone please help me in restoring those instructions or simply point me to where I can find them.
Many thanks!
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Some people like to give a few days to let the yeast do any degassing, then tighten them. They're still airtight I would say, but not tightly so, meaning any built up pressure could seep out.
 
christyle said:
Some people like to give a few days to let the yeast do any degassing, then tighten them. They're still airtight I would say, but not tightly so, meaning any built up pressure could seep out.
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I do exactly this. Have the lids snug but not tight so that pressure can escape. Then lock them down a day or two later and leave until brew day.
 
Thanks gentlemen! Out of curiosity, will the lid pop when next time I open the jar some time later? Like, if it doesn't pop - should I discard the yeast?
 
GQT said:
Thanks gentlemen! Out of curiosity, will the lid pop when next time I open the jar some time later? Like, if it doesn't pop - should I discard the yeast?
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No and no....
You are not pressure canning the yeast, just using the mason jar as a storage vessel.
 
View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1445642832.879958.jpg View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1445642851.287664.jpg I tried this for the first time. I think my yeast sludge was pretty clean, I used a grainfather to brew it, which has a good filter built in, and then run it through a 300 micro hop spider, so I get little hope / gunk in the fermenter. The first picture is right after harvesting, the second about 12 hours after sitting in the fridge. I think I used too much beer for the swirl? Don't know. Does these look right? I think so, but first time.
 
Thank you very much for this post, I have been looking for a way to make brewing more $ efficient, and other than growing my own grain or hops this is the biggest one! I saved the slurry from an Oatmeal Stout I bottled last week and cant wait to brew a similar beer to pitch onto.

A couple questions:

1. How many times should you use the same slurry before discarding and starting with a fresh store bought pack?

2. Are there flavors imparted to the yeast from the previous beer that I need to take into consideration when deciding to pitch onto a new batch? (Example: previous batch IPA may impart to much hop flavors to a Blonde ale)

3. How much do you pitch? My 6gal of Stout got me 2 mason jars of slurry, I assume you don't want to pitch all of that though, is there a simple ratio for slurry volume: wort volume?

I appreciate all the help and wisdom.

4>---->
 
This thread is great.

I just saved my first batch of Nottingham from a cider to toss in a blonde this weekend.

It started really fast and is really chugging. So, I'm assuming it worked!

Thanks for all the good info.
 
4arrows said:
A couple questions:

1. How many times should you use the same slurry before discarding and starting with a fresh store bought pack?

2. Are there flavors imparted to the yeast from the previous beer that I need to take into consideration when deciding to pitch onto a new batch? (Example: previous batch IPA may impart to much hop flavors to a Blonde ale)

3. How much do you pitch? My 6gal of Stout got me 2 mason jars of slurry, I assume you don't want to pitch all of that though, is there a simple ratio for slurry volume: wort volume?
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1) The answer to this is debatable.
I use most of mine 5 generations but on occasion have used them as many as 7 or 8 generations.

2) Yes.
Generally speaking, you will not want to use a yeast from a dark or hoppy beer to make a light or non-hoppy one.

3) Generally, you can assume 1 to 1.5 billion cells per milliliter of recovered slurry.
Then use a calculator like brewers friend or Mr malty to figure out the correct number of cells and then pitch an adequate amount of slurry.
 
Very informative... I have been looking into saving yeast for awhile and the whole washing process has kept me from doing it.

That being said, I brew 2.5G AG batches in Mr Beer kegs. I typically pour the wort into the containers through a hop sack so that filters the majority of the protein/trub out of the beer prior to fermentation so it sounds like I have a relatively clean yeast cake. The yeast usually fills the entire flattened portion at the bottom of the keg.

If I transfer my beer out of the keg, swirl to loosen, pour into glass jars, all I should have to do at start of my next batch is bring it up to room temp, decant the old liquid, mix in some new chilled wort, shake, and add to new wort.

This sounds waaaay to easy...
 
It does, because it is :)

Also, you don't need the new wort before pitching unless making a starter, but I may be misunderstanding your description...
 
christyle said:
It does, because it is :)

Also, you don't need the new wort before pitching unless making a starter, but I may be misunderstanding your description...
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Im talking about simply dumping off the old water, and adding some wort from the new batch simply to loosen things up (closing and shaking the jar) and make sure the temps match before dumping it into the batch.
 
skitter said:
Im talking about simply dumping off the old water, and adding some wort from the new batch simply to loosen things up (closing and shaking the jar) and make sure the temps match before dumping it into the batch.
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Don't think that's necessary. When decanting the overlaying liquid from a cold jar of saved yeast or from a cooled starter, I simply leave just enough liquid to loosen up the cake when swirled and pour that in my fermenter of fresh wort. I wouldn't bother adding fresh wort from the fermenter so as to minimize risk of contamination.
 
I finally found time to brew another batch of beer, this time using my 7 month old yeast slurry that I kept in the fridge. It is a partial experiment to see how viable the yeast is after sitting so long.

I ended up pitching around 400ml of slurry into a ~5gallon batch at 1.052.
I will take notes for the next few days and see how it works (and how well/how poor)

rhys333 said:
I've never stored slurry that long, but others on here have and just direct pitched it. Probably wise to do a starter though. As a wild ass guess maybe its 15-25% viable after 7 months. Could be way higher or lower. Couple suggestions: (1) you could just pitch all of it without a starter in the name of science and see what happens (then tell us), or (2) add some of it to a starter to proof it and build new cells. Perhaps pitch 200ml into a 1.5 L starter (i.e.: 1.5L water + 150g DME).
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brewkinger said:
Exactly what I was thinking.
Woodland Brews blog suggests that viability decay is less than we once thought it to be. I cannot remember the exact number though.
So I concur with the same 2 options above.
I am inclined to lean towards the latter though.
Split it in half and treat each as though they were a single smack pack and then make a 1.5L starter.
(If you are making a normal 1.050-ish beer.)
If it works well then you have a second freebie.
If it does not work then you can still experiment and build the 2nd one up even larger next time.

The downside to pitching the whole 400mL in a single batch is that it may be an overpitch and then you possibly make a bad beer in addition to wasting a perfectly good second opportunity to pitch the 2nd half.

Just my thoughts
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christyle said:
To me, the downsides of overpitching are minimal and not to be afraid of. I would dump the whole deal into a 2L starter to see what happens, if viable, decant and pitch, then harvest the new, viable yeast for next time rather than continuing to save a partial jar of 7 month old yeast.
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stever1000 said:
I finally found time to brew another batch of beer, this time using my 7 month old yeast slurry that I kept in the fridge. It is a partial experiment to see how viable the yeast is after sitting so long.

I ended up pitching around 400ml of slurry into a ~5gallon batch at 1.052.
I will take notes for the next few days and see how it works (and how well/how poor)
Click to expand...

Awesome. It should kick off it a day or 2. Interested to know what happens.
 
Less than 24hrs later, I'm very glad I fitted a blow off tube. Its a hefeweizen using 3056 yeast and it is chewing through the sugar :mug:
I'm Very very very relieved the old slurry worked!

20151027_153747-01.jpeg
 
stever1000 said:
Less than 24hrs later, I'm very glad I fitted a blow off tube. Its a hefeweizen using 3056 yeast and it is chewing through the sugar :mug:
I'm Very very very relieved the old slurry worked!

20151027_153747-01.jpeg
Click to expand...

Good news! Btw, 3056 is a monster. Mega krausen producer and a perfect strain for top cropping if you ever want to try.

EDIT: wait... I mean 3068. Oh well, its probably similar ;). Shoot me down somebody.
 

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