Simcoe

[iowabrew]

Down at the LHBS this weekend to pick up ingredients to brew up a cascade pale ale, as i'm running low on the pipeline. Turns out, they had tons and tons of simcoe pellets/leaf for 2.00/oz. So my cascade pale ale turned into a Simcoe pale ale. I've never used it before and looking to get the most out of it and avoid "cat pee." My original hoping thought was the following


5.5 gal batch

8lbs - 2 row
1lb - Munich 10L
1/2lb - Crystal 60l

.5 oz Columbus @ FWH (11% AA Pellets)
.5 oz Simcoe @ 15min (14.1% AA Leaf)
.5 oz Simcoe @ 5min (14.1% AA Leaf
1 oz Simcoe @ flameout/whirlpool (14.1% AA Leaf)
IBU's roughly 40


Will this get me a pretty good representation of the all mighty simcoe?

 

[Piratwolf]

The cat pee from my understanding is an effect of "excessive" myrcene developed by leaving hop cones on the bine just a few days too long. Same with the onion/garlic from Summit. A bit like over ripened fruit, perhaps? So it's not something to be avoided by your process in brewing. But if the hops at room temp don't smell like cat pee, they probably won't taste like it.

As for recipe, looks fine to me. If you're really trying to get big Simcoe effect, double your last two additions

 

[iowabrew]

Glad to hear it, sounds like the "cat pee" effect is also just some isolated cases. As far as doubling my last additions i may just do that since i bought 8oz of the stuff!! Had to do it after hearing all the hoopla surrounding it. FYI, they also had tons of citra in stock as well.

 

[JRems]

I have made a couple ipas with simcoe and have had the "cat piss" aroma on some and not on others( even using the same recipe) I think it just comes down to the hops themselves. Hit or miss.

 

[jammin]

Simcoe is great for dry hopping. I would consider adding .5 to 1 full ounce of it in the keg.

 

[bobbrews]

The cat pee from my understanding is an effect of "excessive" myrcene developed by leaving hop cones on the bine just a few days too long. Same with the onion/garlic from Summit.

That's not true. The garlic notes from "some" of the Summit supply is actually caused by concentrations of Dimethyl trisulphide as a preservative added to the hops. To avoid this, buy organic hops. Excessive myrcene is quite difficult to attain. Unlike Dimethyl trisulphide, myrcene is not added to the hops by the growers. It occurs naturally; in some varietals more than others. But if you could boost myrcene levels, you would have a more potent, aromatic, citrusy, piney, dank IPA. It would be quite favorable to have a boost of those traits. Lastly, Amarillo actually has more myrcene than all other hops, but you never get cat pee from it.

 

[Silentnoiz]

Citra is one of my favorite hops. Mikkeller did a single hop series. They took one ale, and did 19 different single hops to that same ale. Great learning experience. I took some notes, and developed my IIPA recipe off of them. My IIPA has a 90 min boil, and has Citra (pellets) additions every 10 minutes. I also dry hop with it (in leaf, along with Cascade). Good stuff!

 

[iowabrew]

Dry hop is a great idea!

 

[Yooper]

I'm a huge simcoe fan! I only have about two pounds left, but I use it often. I do prefer it with other hops, but alone it's good too. I tend to use it most with amarillo hops, as I like the piney/resiny/citrus combo that gets me. But alone it should have a slight citrus flavor with some pine notes. I think it's Weyerbacher that makes an all-simcoe IPA. I like it, but don't love it.

 

[iowabrew]

I've got lots of Columbus. Should I mix it in?

 

[itsbeeryo]

columbus / simcoe is awesome together. i'd definitely throw some more columbus late and dry hop that bad boy with both for sure.

 

[dbauer]

Sam Adams did a simcoe latitude 48 iap in there deconstructed pack ever since ive been hooked since. I love the grapefruit bite that they tend to have. I would love to brew a simcoe ipa but putting brewing on a hold till I finish my new brew rig.

 

[onthekeg]

That's not true. The garlic notes from "some" of the Summit supply is actually caused by concentrations of Dimethyl trisulphide as a preservative added to the hops. To avoid this, buy organic hops. Excessive myrcene is quite difficult to attain. Unlike Dimethyl trisulphide, myrcene is not added to the hops by the growers. It occurs naturally; in some varietals more than others. But if you could boost myrcene levels, you would have a more potent, aromatic, citrusy, piney, dank IPA. It would be quite favorable to have a boost of those traits. Lastly, Amarillo actually has more myrcene than all other hops, but you never get cat pee from it.

Do you have a link to share your proof with us?

 

[onthekeg]

Chinook and Simcoe play well together also, IMHO.

 

[Piratwolf]

That's not true. The garlic notes from "some" of the Summit supply is actually caused by concentrations of Dimethyl trisulphide as a preservative added to the hops. To avoid this, buy organic hops. Excessive myrcene is quite difficult to attain. Unlike Dimethyl trisulphide, myrcene is not added to the hops by the growers. It occurs naturally; in some varietals more than others. But if you could boost myrcene levels, you would have a more potent, aromatic, citrusy, piney, dank IPA. It would be quite favorable to have a boost of those traits. Lastly, Amarillo actually has more myrcene than all other hops, but you never get cat pee from it.

You may have better info on this, but I'm reporting what I've heard in interviews on the BN: Nate Smith's reports from Hop Union's hop school, John Palmer's research, etc. My memory may a bit fuzzy regarding the high myrcene bit (although I don't think so) but I've heard definitively and repeatedly from several sources that even slight delay in harvesting leads to these problems.

 

[BrewinHooligan]

Just brewed a Simcoe/Amarilla APA (Lake Walk Pale Ale) from a recipe here. First time I used either hop. Haven't finished fermenting yet, but this beer is a thing of beauty. My 2 new favorite hops and will be ordering some of both in bulk very soon.

 

[bobbrews]

Do you have a link to share your proof with us?

Brewing: Science and Practice, Chapter 8

http://www.amazon.com/dp/0849325471/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

 

[Piratwolf]

Brewing: Science and Practice, Chapter 8

http://www.amazon.com/Brewing-Practice-Woodhead-Publishing-Technology/dp/0849325471

Two issues come to mind: the book is older than the tests & reports I mentioned, and why, if your assertion is correct, would some Simcoe or Summit hops have the flavor problems from preservatives while others do not? Harvesting at different relative points in the maturation process seems like it would better explain the variability....

 

[bobbrews]

That book is from 2004 and is one of the most respected pieces of literature on the topic. It's not like we're talking about ancient findings here. If you want, you can google "Dimethyl trisulphide + garlic" and see the scientific reports that come up outside of brewing, then repeat that search with "Dimethyl trisulphide + hops" and compare the findings for yourself.

I have personally never experienced cat pee with Simcoe and I've used it more than any other hop. I'll either get dank pine or tropical fruit, or both from Simcoe. I got the oniony/garlic thing from Summit in a couple commercial beers, but never in a homebrew. It's mostly tangerine. The book I provided does go into detail about the most powerful hop oils and built-up compounds that affect a number of different hops... not only Summit.

 

[Piratwolf]

That book is from 2004 and is one of the most respected pieces of literature on the topic. It's not like we're talking about ancient findings here. If you want, you can google "Dimethyl trisulphide + garlic" and see the scientific reports that come up outside of brewing, then repeat that search with "Dimethyl trisulphide + hops" and compare the findings for yourself.

I have personally never experienced cat pee with Simcoe and I've used it more than any other hop. I'll either get dank pine or tropical fruit, or both from Simcoe. I got the oniony/garlic thing from Summit in a couple commercial beers, but never in a homebrew. It's mostly tangerine. The book I provided does go into detail about the most powerful hop oils and built-up compounds that affect a number of different hops... not only Summit.

Sounds like a good read--thanks for the tip!