Secondary hops addition (pellets)

[Aleforge]

Hi everyone!

I am brewing my first IPA ever. I have never done a secondary addition of any sort. And I have actually been brewing on and off for a long time. I think it has to do with taking so long to like IPA's.

Anyhow my current recipe has me adding several ounces of Citra (pellet) hops during the secondary phase.

So a few questions, do the pellets just dissolve and somehow sit evenly through out? Bagging hops and letting them "steep" seem in my mind to make more sense. But pellets I assume will sink and gather on the bottom? Do you have to (lightly) mix a bit before bottling? Second is it possible to dry hop in the primary? The last few batches I made I skipped the secondary as it SEEMS like some guys are doing this now and then. I always have been paranoid about infections / oxidation so it took some anxiety out of it. BUT they were not IPA's.

 

[Jag75]

They float . I used pellets and 2 shot glasses to weigh the bag down. After 4 days the bag floated to the top . Yes its possible to hop in primary . Just did a NEIPA that I dry hopped on the 2nd day of fermentation. I'm with you on the oxidation. During fermentation you dont need to worry about it , however after the fermentation process is over you need to be really careful about o2.

 

[kh54s10]

If you just dump the pellets in, the hop matter will eventually drop to the bottom. You want to leave all that undisturbed when you rack to your bottling bucket. Do Not stir it up.

I have in the past bagged the hops, I didn't worry about weighing down the bag. I did push it below the surface and made sure that all the hops got saturated.

I also don't do a secondary. I think it has gone past "some guys" skip secondary to "most guys" I haven't done one for many years, that one was adding something. The one before that was my first brew 7 1/2+ years ago. So actually I have only ever done a secondary twice.

 

[eric19312]

My pellets swim free. I only primary so they go into primary. For NEIPA some go in as soon as active fermentation starts and rest go in after fermentations stops. For west coast IPA they go in after fermentation is over. After about 2-3 days I will cold crash the fermentor which will settle out hops and yeast. I add a bit of CO2 while cold crashing to avoid sucking back through my blow off tube. With a decent cold crash most of the hop material will settle out.

When I want to double dry hop I will add the second (or third) hop addition in kegs. Normally in a bag or stainless tea ball but lately experimenting with clear beer draft system with the hop screens. Seems to work well. I used to do the fishing line trick to be able to pull the keg hops after a few days but had issues with slow leaks around and gave up removing the hops.

 

[Aleforge]

Thanks guys, I am relieved that so many are skipping secondaries these days. I have been on a pretty long hiatus and remember it starting to come up more and more a few years ago.

Direction wise it says to toss them in about 7-14 days prior to bottling. I wasn't sure if 14 was needed, how do you even tell with dry hopping?

 

[shoengine]

I secondary every beer I make, but that is merely the conditioning stage, so barrel, keg or bottle are my secondaries.

Dry hopping is definitely a concern of mine for oxygen. I used a stainless hops basket on fishing line last time, but I think that increased my oxygen volume by all the air space in the basket. I decided that for my current batch I will be putting the hops pellets in individually so that there is no excess air space.

General guidance for dry hopping time is to put them in after fermentation has slowed or ended. How long the beer stays on them is another thing up for debate. I will just wait for my hops to fall.

 

[RM-MN]

Thanks guys, I am relieved that so many are skipping secondaries these days. I have been on a pretty long hiatus and remember it starting to come up more and more a few years ago.

Direction wise it says to toss them in about 7-14 days prior to bottling. I wasn't sure if 14 was needed, how do you even tell with dry hopping?

Yooper has suggested that 3 to 7 days is all you need for dry hopping. 5 might be plenty but I usaully do 7.

 

[eric19312]

Direction wise it says to toss them in about 7-14 days prior to bottling. I wasn't sure if 14 was needed, how do you even tell with dry hopping?

Totally a matter of taste. A lot of folks feel extended time on hops is more likely to bring unwanted flavors ... astringency, grassiness, etc and that most of what you are looking for is released in just a day or three. If you are wanting beer faster I'd be satisfied with 3-4 days and then cold crash for a couple days before racking.

 

[wepeeler]

Is this the Karma Citra Session? 7 days is probably ok. 14 days would be better for clarity purposes.

 

[Aleforge]

So do you drop the pellets in and just wait until the sink? If so does that mean they float around for awhile until they "melt"? As mentioned I have never dry hopped before so I wasn't sure how it worked. Do you think the safest way for me

Is this the Karma Citra Session? 7 days is probably ok. 14 days would be better for clarity purposes.

Yes it’s Karma Citra! Have you made it?

 

[wepeeler]

So do you drop the pellets in and just wait until the sink? If so does that mean they float around for awhile until they "melt"? As mentioned I have never dry hopped before so I wasn't sure how it worked. Do you think the safest way for me


Yes it’s Karma Citra! Have you made it?

Just drop them in, and you're good to go. I have made that, and it was very good, but not exactly what I was going for. Everyone else seemed to like it more than I did.

 

[Aleforge]

Just drop them in, and you're good to go. I have made that, and it was very good, but not exactly what I was going for. Everyone else seemed to like it more than I did.

Thanks for the help! I would like to ask what you were looking for and what type of profile it ended up being?

 

[wepeeler]

Thanks for the help! I would like to ask what you were looking for and what type of profile it ended up being?

I was looking for a neipa, and I just straight screwed it up. I tweaked the recipe and added flaked oats and more sugar, and it ended up being a malt bomb. It was my 2nd ever brew, and I thought I knew what I was doing. I had no idea. I ended up using 1/4 of the amount of bittering hops that I actually needed. Disaster lol. My buddy has brewed it before though, and he followed the recipe, and it was great.

 

[kh54s10]

I was looking for a neipa, and I just straight screwed it up. I tweaked the recipe and added flaked oats and more sugar, and it ended up being a malt bomb. It was my 2nd ever brew, and I thought I knew what I was doing. I had no idea. I ended up using 1/4 of the amount of bittering hops that I actually needed. Disaster lol. My buddy has brewed it before though, and he followed the recipe, and it was great.

I don't know. I have seen that many are doing NEIPAs with no bittering hop additions. They rely on a little bittering from late additions and even whirlpool additions.

 

[wepeeler]

I don't know. I have seen that many are doing NEIPAs with no bittering hop additions. They rely on a little bittering from late additions and even whirlpool additions.

Trust me, it was my own fault. This was a year and a half ago, before I even knew how to calculate ibu and balance a beer. It was terrible. Once I learned about brewing software, I entered in what I made it was like 10 ibu. Just terrible.

And I know the trend of all flameout, with little to no bittering at 60, but in my own experimentation, the beer needs a bittering charge. Even if it's small. Or at least some hops in the boil (20/10/5 etc). Some guys are doing no bittering, all flameout, and I have a hard time believing that it's true to the style and/or not a malt bomb. I typically like my beer on the sweeter/less bitter side, but no bittering charge and all flameout isn't what I'm looking to make.

 

[kh54s10]

Trust me, it was my own fault. This was a year and a half ago, before I even knew how to calculate ibu and balance a beer. It was terrible. Once I learned about brewing software, I entered in what I made it was like 10 ibu. Just terrible.

And I know the trend of all flameout, with little to no bittering at 60, but in my own experimentation, the beer needs a bittering charge. Even if it's small. Or at least some hops in the boil (20/10/5 etc). Some guys are doing no bittering, all flameout, and I have a hard time believing that it's true to the style and/or not a malt bomb. I typically like my beer on the sweeter/less bitter side, but no bittering charge and all flameout isn't what I'm looking to make.

At flameout and even whirlpool or hopstand if the temperature is high enough it does add bittering. And for these NEIPAs they are adding massive amounts of hops in comparison to other styles.

 

[wepeeler]

At flameout and even whirlpool or hopstand if the temperature is high enough it does add bittering. And for these NEIPAs they are adding massive amounts of hops in comparison to other styles.

I've done it all too. Made about 30 batches of NEIPA in the past 18 months. Such a fun style. Still couldn't see adding no bittering hops. I now you pull some bitter from flameout, but it's not enough to convince me not to add 0.5 oz at 60. In comparison to say a Blonde ale, which I used 3 oz of hops total for a 10 gallon batch, I've used over a pound in a 5 gallon batch of NEIPA. Crazy!

 

[Aleforge]

I've used over a pound in a 5 gallon batch of NEIPA

My god.... lol

 

[wepeeler]

My god.... lol

LOL, that's including dry hopping. About 6-10oz in the boil/flameout/whirlpool and 6oz dry hopping, sometimes split into 2 3 x dry hops. Insanity