Safale S-05's 'what-ness'

[beatlebum]

So, Safale S-05 is totally one of my favorite yeasts. Very vigorous fermentor and performs at a nice range of temps.

My question is this: I read somewhat regularly and even the dude at my LHBS says that it is a very 'clean' yeast.

I disagree.

The LHBS guy had an IPA he just transfered out of the primary when I was there the other day and I asked to sample it (only fair as i'm always bringing them samples!). I take a whiff and right away say, "you use S-05?" And of course he did.

There is a very distinct estery quality to s-05 to my nose and tongue... great most of the time, but seemed inappropriate on that particular IPA (simcoe and admiral i think...).

Anyone else notice this? I love the yeast. THat flavor or odor is what makes it what it is, and i generally like it. Could likely be byproduct of fermenting too high too though, or any number of other things.

 

[fearwig]

It's Chico, supposedly the same as WLP001 and Wyeast 1056. Basically the classic clean yeast for American styles. Temperature makes a difference, though, so does pitch (rate and method--rehydration, and other factors). If you want to see a clean yeast get dirty, try Notty above 68. Chico is a little more forgiving, IMO, but there are all kinds of things you can do to piss off your yeast and all kinds of ways people measure temperature, thinking they're in target range when they're not.

I mean it's kind of counterintuitive, but the yeasts considered "clean" are the most distinct (and the most "off") when they get out of their ideal range, since they aren't bred for desirable esters, you know?

 

[singybrue]

If it was just out of primary it was probably still pretty green. That would affect taste/smell.

 

[beatlebum]

so neither of you guys notice a fruity ester nose and flavor when you use S-05? it's not a bad flavor, again -- one of my favorite yeasts -- just not particularly 'clean'

 

[fearwig]

Well, I mean, it's an ale yeast. It's as fruity as a distinctly unfruity ale.

 

[pricelessbrewing]

Just pitched some s05 slurry from a local brewery into bm`s black pearl porter. I have it at 18.3c=63f measured with stc1000, taped to outside of bucket about 2gallons up and insulated. Should I adjust the temp?

Only cool is hooked up atm, so really 17.8-18.3c.

 

[Calichusetts]

so neither of you guys notice a fruity ester nose and flavor when you use S-05? it's not a bad flavor, again -- one of my favorite yeasts -- just not particularly 'clean'

I think its temp based. I pick up the off note (again not bad, I don't even know if its fruit, I call it the "05") My buddy who never picks it up did in a batch a few months ago. He called it my "house" aroma. Its very subtle and not that detracting, but it can be there.

 

[Osedax]

I use US-05 all the time. Great all around yeast. I believe I know the aroma/flavor you are talking about. It is often described as "peachy". I think that is close. However, I think it is more than that. You're right, it is hard to describe. And, no, I don't think it fits in with every clean ale. Just my $.02.

 

[beatlebum]

Well, I mean, it's an ale yeast. It's as fruity as a distinctly unfruity ale.

ale yeasts very typically produce fruity esters, it's a common and often sought after quality in many.

but the sense i'm getting is that the estery quality that i regularly identify in s-05 is spotty, which is good to know.

i'm assuming that really does mean, as Calichusetts noted, it's probably a temp issue. the "hop burst" session-ish IPA i've got fermenting right now is temp controlled at about 68 so hopefully it comes out cleaner than some of the other beers i've brewed with it simply because i trust the hops and malt combo.

will see how that comes out and let y'all know if the temp is what did it. kinda doubtful it'll be gone entirely because, as the thread's titled, i identify it as the 'what-ness' of s-05... we'll see.

 

[beatlebum]

It is often described as "peachy". I think that is close.

bingo. good call on the peachy. i was thinking a more general "stonefruity" essence, but that's really just an obnoxious way of saying 'peachy'!

 

[The_Glue]

I used to get this peachy smell at all temps when i sprinkled half a pack of US05 into 2.5gal batches.

Now that i pitch a full packet of rehydrated US05 into 2.5gal batches with yeast nutrition i don't get that smell anymore. (after like 10 days of primary)

I recently tasted an initially clean smelling beer after 1 week of bottle carbing and that smell reappeared (probably because of the refermentation in the bottle) i hope it will go away at week 3.

 

[j1n]

Just pitched some s05 slurry from a local brewery into bm`s black pearl porter. I have it at 18.3c=63f measured with stc1000, taped to outside of bucket about 2gallons up and insulated. Should I adjust the temp?

Only cool is hooked up atm, so really 17.8-18.3c.

18.3* C is 65* F not 63* F. i would leave it at 65 and then raise it to 70 after fermentation is done.

Also US-05 is supposed to put off peachy flavors a low temps (low 60s).

 

[fearwig]

bingo. good call on the peachy. i was thinking a more general "stonefruity" essence, but that's really just an obnoxious way of saying 'peachy'!

"A drupish nose, yes"

 

[Yooper]

so neither of you guys notice a fruity ester nose and flavor when you use S-05? it's not a bad flavor, again -- one of my favorite yeasts -- just not particularly 'clean'

bingo. good call on the peachy. i was thinking a more general "stonefruity" essence, but that's really just an obnoxious way of saying 'peachy'!

I definitely get "peachy" at below 64 degrees, and above 68 degrees with that strain while I don't get it with WLP0001 at those temps.

I rarely use S05 as a result, unless I"m sure I can hold it at 66 degrees for fermentation, as even just two degrees warmer or colder makes it too weirdly estery for my taste. But, at 65 or 66 degrees, it's clean and I like it then.

I've been using WLP001 for IPAs. I know others say it's the same strain as Wyeast 1056 and S05, but for me, the WLP001 clears better and is more flocculant, is cleaner at a greater temperature range, and attenuates just as well.

I've also been using some English strains, like Wyeast 1335, once I heard that Surly uses it for my favorite IPA, Furious. And I really like it- it's definitely not underattenuative and it's nice and clean at 66 degrees.

 

[Calichusetts]

Peach is from the low temp side. Really low is awful. I'd say there is something else going on during some batches too though. Can't place it


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[Clarke]

I made an American Wheat with US-05, fermented it at 73F and got banana esters out of it.

 

[jgarretson]

I brewed a big porter with the 05 and fermented it in my basement. Ambient temp was running 65-66 and the finished beer definitely has a noticeable fruit aroma that I couldn't figure out what it was from. Now I know what it was. I used the same yeast for an IPA that's dry hopping right now so this should be interesting to see how it turns out. The next batch I do with this yeast, I'll be sure to use my ferm chamber and thermowell. Try to keep the beer right at 65 and see what happens...


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[hunter_le five]

I definitely get "peachy" at below 64 degrees.....
I rarely use S05 as a result

Damn, might want to update your Fizzy Yellow Beer recipe then.

Yeast: S-05
....
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 14 days at 62
....
Boil for 60 minutes, and rapidly chill to 62 degrees. Add yeast, and ferment at 62 for 14 days.

I fermented mine with S-05 at 62, hope I don't get too much of a fruit/peach flavor....

 

[Yooper]

Damn, might want to update your Fizzy Yellow Beer recipe then.




I fermented mine with S-05 at 62, hope I don't get too much of a fruit/peach flavor....

It's good, I promise! It turns out really nice with the noble hops and vienna malt.

 

[hunter_le five]

It's good, I promise! It turns out really nice with the noble hops and vienna malt.

Just joshing you, of course. I'm kegging it this weekend, can't wait.


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[GCPHomebrew]

I switched to dans tar bry-97 because of that taste. It starts slower but doesn't mind the temperature rise(ie no swamp cooler needed). In a 66 degree room it raises to 73 degrees no problem. Tastes clean and amazing everytime


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[beatlebum]

I definitely get "peachy" at below 64 degrees, and above 68 degrees

Peach is from the low temp side. Really low is awful.

now this is something i was not expecting to hear, and from two different accounts. interesting. i'd always figured esters were more of a higher temp byproduct than lower.

i also live in new orleans so my ground water is high, ergo, usually pitch at a kind of high temp and then put in temp control afterwards and assumed the high pitching temp is where the 'peach' was coming from.

same esters produced at high and low ends of temperature spectrum... really? interesting.

 

[Calichusetts]

now this is something i was not expecting to hear, and from two different accounts. interesting. i'd always figured esters were more of a higher temp byproduct than lower.

i also live in new orleans so my ground water is high, ergo, usually pitch at a kind of high temp and then put in temp control afterwards and assumed the high pitching temp is where the 'peach' was coming from.

same esters produced at high and low ends of temperature spectrum... really? interesting.

I experiment a lot...I did 05 at 57, 58, 59 over three batches. COMPLETELY takes over the beer. And peach would be a stretch and a compliment, borderline rotten strawberry. I picked it up a couple times from a local brewery and no I know they must be fermenting low after that experiment.

 

[vNmd]

Damn, might want to update your Fizzy Yellow Beer recipe then.

It's good, I promise! It turns out really nice with the noble hops and vienna malt.

Just joshing you, of course. I'm kegging it this weekend, can't wait.

That is next on my list and I was thinking the same thing reading through this thread as I have not used that yeast yet. Thanks for the update, I will leave the recipe as is and try to keep the temp right.