My first saison has been going 5 days now in a warm closet, about 79F. Airlock activity has now nearly stopped, so I took a gravity reading. It's about 1.024. I know saison yeast can be finicky, does anyone rouse their yeast or anything? I want a dry saison.
Rouse Saison Yeast?
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stubbornman
Well-Known Member
What was your recipe? What was your process before pitching (starter? aeration?). Which Saison yeast are you using?
yeah, this is how 3724 and 565 work. you need to give it at least three more weeks. it's not a bad idea to rouse the yeast once a week or so until it has dried out. if you're in a hurry, pitch some neutral ale yeast.
lowtones84
Well-Known Member
Yeah, it would be good to know what yeast you used, your mash temp, and if you made a starter or not. You might want to push the temperature into the 80's if you can. Sometimes these yeasts take a while, but if your recipe and process was good, your patience will be rewarded!
5 lbs Pilsen Light DME
1.5 lbs American 2-Row
1 lb Wheat Malt
2 lbs Flaked Corn
0.5 lb Flaked Wheat
BIAB method. Mashed at 146F for 45 minutes and then 155F for 30 minutes. Sparged for 10 minutes. OG was about 1.076.
Yeast was cultured from a bottle of Tank 7 Farmhouse Ale. Started with a 1/2 cup starter, then stepped up to 1 cup, 2 cups, 1 qt, 1.5 qt, poured off a cup for storage and gave it 1.5 qt again. I chilled and decanted each time. Then, the day before brew day I gave it another 2/3 qt starter and pitched the whole starter at about 22 hours when the yeast was still active. By rough estimate of sight and comparison to other cups I’ve pulled for storage directly from smack-pack starters, I think my pich rate was probably about 240 billion cells or 12.8 million/ml. Fermentation started right away; airlock activity was visible by 3 hours.
With that said, I just got an email back from Boulevard today, after my post, and unfortunately found out that they bottle condition this with a Champaign yeast, not the Saison yeast. I had tasted each iteration of my starters and seemed to get the peppery notes so without hearing back from them by the time I was ready to brew I said F-it, I'll just use this yeast. So who knows now, I’m at 68% attenuation, maybe that’s all I’ll get from this yeast.
1.5 lbs American 2-Row
1 lb Wheat Malt
2 lbs Flaked Corn
0.5 lb Flaked Wheat
BIAB method. Mashed at 146F for 45 minutes and then 155F for 30 minutes. Sparged for 10 minutes. OG was about 1.076.
Yeast was cultured from a bottle of Tank 7 Farmhouse Ale. Started with a 1/2 cup starter, then stepped up to 1 cup, 2 cups, 1 qt, 1.5 qt, poured off a cup for storage and gave it 1.5 qt again. I chilled and decanted each time. Then, the day before brew day I gave it another 2/3 qt starter and pitched the whole starter at about 22 hours when the yeast was still active. By rough estimate of sight and comparison to other cups I’ve pulled for storage directly from smack-pack starters, I think my pich rate was probably about 240 billion cells or 12.8 million/ml. Fermentation started right away; airlock activity was visible by 3 hours.
With that said, I just got an email back from Boulevard today, after my post, and unfortunately found out that they bottle condition this with a Champaign yeast, not the Saison yeast. I had tasted each iteration of my starters and seemed to get the peppery notes so without hearing back from them by the time I was ready to brew I said F-it, I'll just use this yeast. So who knows now, I’m at 68% attenuation, maybe that’s all I’ll get from this yeast.
lowtones84
Well-Known Member
You should be able to get more than that with a champagne yeast. Rousing it may help, but I think bumping up the temp and time would do it. Check it again in a week and see where you are, 5 days is not a very long time, and it's probably just that the fastest part of fermentation is over with.
Prymal
Well-Known Member
lowtones84 said:
I disagree, champaign yeast doesn't not have the ability to properly ferment maltotrios completely so I wouldn't imagine it would ferment out much more then it has. I would suggest picking up some wyeast 3711 and pitching it, according to wyeast it can be used to restart a stuck fermentation. The other option I just heard about from the brewing network would be to buy an enzyme called convertase ag 300 which breaks maltotrios down into a monosaccharide and disaccharide which the champagne yeast can eat. After using the enzyme rouse the yeast and see what happens.
Good suggestion, I'll probably see if my LHBS has some 3711. If I buy a smack pack, I'm going to at least build a quart starter to harvest a couple cups for future use. Should I calculate my pitch based on my SG reading of 1.024 or bump it up?
My other question is temp. I have the windows in my spare bedroom open, the door shut, and the a/c vent shut to keep the temp up. That room is stable at 76-79F or so at the moment. My only other option is the attic which hits the low 90s but falls down to the upper 70's or low 80's at night. I wish I had a something better for temp control, but that's just not going to happen with this brew. So, is the stable upper 70's better or the big swings with an average of mid 80's better?
My other question is temp. I have the windows in my spare bedroom open, the door shut, and the a/c vent shut to keep the temp up. That room is stable at 76-79F or so at the moment. My only other option is the attic which hits the low 90s but falls down to the upper 70's or low 80's at night. I wish I had a something better for temp control, but that's just not going to happen with this brew. So, is the stable upper 70's better or the big swings with an average of mid 80's better?
Prymal
Well-Known Member
I think a stable temp is much more important especially since you are going to try to pitch more yeast. I would just pitch whatever you get from the quart starter.
lowtones84
Well-Known Member
Cool, I didn't know that. Thanks for the info!
jeremy0209
Well-Known Member
+1 on the 3711. That yeast rocks...it's all I use for my Saisons.....usually attenuates in the 85% range
scoutsbrew
Member
Thoughts on my attempt?
Stuck fermentation as well.
All grain
12 lbs pils 2row
1 lb vienna
1 lb munich
1 liter starter pitched belgian saison Ale
Here is the action:
[ame]http://youtu.be/NXu6lR9GXBs[/ame]
Stuck fermentation as well.
All grain
12 lbs pils 2row
1 lb vienna
1 lb munich
1 liter starter pitched belgian saison Ale
Here is the action:
[ame]http://youtu.be/NXu6lR9GXBs[/ame]
Interesting... looks like it works to rouse the yeast. My only concern would be possible oxidation. I assumed you opened up the carboy to drop the stirbar in. There would be a little bit of air exchange there, letting some O2 into the headspace, which might get picked up more easily because of the moving surface area. Were you able to purge with CO2?
Let us know how it works out. That's a great idea. Putting it off to the side makes a lot of sense too, in a carboy. I have the same stirplate myself.
phuff7129
Well-Known Member
Pitch 3711. It is a beast and will finish your fermentation. Anything temp from the 60's to the 80's will work.
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