Roguesque American Strong (Mogul Madness)

[gannawdm]

I'm not going for a clone, but something along the lines of Rogue's Mogul Madness from a couple years back. Here's a description: "Hoppy, caramel aroma, dark burgundy in color with an off white head. Intense flavors of citrus hops, and complex notes of nuts, berries and mocha. It finishes long and lingers for at least 15 seconds."

I just wanted to get some input on the balance of the specialty grain ratios and the hop schedule. Any input would be greatly appreciated.

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 5.00 gal
Estimated OG: 1.073 SG
Estimated Color: 37.6 SRM
Estimated IBU: 74.8 IBU


Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
5.00 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 50.91 %
6.00 lb Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 29.09 %
0.50 lb Special B Malt (147.0 SRM) Grain 5.45 %
0.50 lb C-120 (120.0 SRM) Grain 3.64 %
0.50 lb Carafa II SPECIAL (420.0 SRM) Grain 3.64 %
0.50 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 80L (80.0 SRM) Grain 3.64 %
0.50 lb Kilncoffee (165.0 SRM) Grain 3.64 %
0.75 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] (60 min) (FHops 35.0 IBU
0.25 oz Cascade (30 min)
0.25 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] (30 min) Hops 5.0 IBU
0.25 oz Centennial [10.00 %] (30 min) Hops 5.8 IBU
0.25 oz Centennial [10.00 %] (15 min) Hops 3.8 IBU
0.25 oz Cascade (15 min)
0.25 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] (15 min) Hops 3.2 IBU
0.50 oz Cascade (5 min)
0.50 oz Centennial [10.00 %] (5 min) Hops 3.0 IBU
0.50 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] (5 min) Hops 2.6 IBU

ROGUE'S MOGUL MADNESS INGREDIENTS: 2 Row, Munich, C120, C150, Kilncoffee, Carafa Special II; Newport Horizon, Simcoe, Centennial, Crystal 90, Amarillo, Rogue Farm Willamett Hops

 

[berebrando]

This looks/sounds great. I've put together a couple American Strong ales recently along the same lines. You probably have too much on the specialty malt side (I find that 2row, munich and special b are a great combo). Furthermore, I'd move your 30-minute additions to 20 or 15-minutes.

Good luck!

 

[gannawdm]

Thanks for the input. I realized that the Mogul ingredient list included Crystal 90 so I added Crystal 80 to the malt bill. For some reason, Crystal 90 is listed on the bottle in the middle of the hops. I know that there are Crystal hops, but "Crystal 90" sounds like malt to me.

Anyway, I'm going to get more specific with my questions.

1) My recipe currently calls for a total of 13% caramel malts total. Is that too much? Do I need more or less of any of the caramel malts?

2) Do you think the roastiness of the Kilncoffee and Carafa will balance well with the caramel malts or do you see an imbalance one way or the other.

 

[ultravista]

Let us know how it turns out.

 

[gannawdm]

I brewed this today. I made a few changes to the recipe. I shifted the base malt balance from 2-row to Munich. Everybody's out of Simcoe (I can already feel the withdrawls), so I substituted with Cascade. I also decreased the Special B by.25 lb.

In an effort to get more in touch with my grains, I made a grain tea with each one. I found that Munich makes a tasty wort, the crystal malts (80, 120) weren't as sugary as I expected, the special B was great, the kiln coffee was appropriately named but not as super roasty as I expected, and the carafa II special looks A LOT darker than it tastes -it's roasty but smooth. I blended the munich tea with the special b and now see what berebrando is talking about - they go very well together. A Munich Special B beer is on my ToDo list.

 

[applecran]

How did this turn out? I'm looking for a Mogul clone or close to. Also, what yeast did you use?

 

[berebrando]

Update? Mmm, Munich and special b. To bad you couldn't get the Simcoe - I used up my last ounce about a month ago and boy is that beer tasty!!!

 

[gannawdm]

How did this turn out? I'm looking for a Mogul clone or close to. Also, what yeast did you use?

I used Safale US-05. It's a pretty clean yeast like Pacman.

I haven't bottled this yet. I've been procrastinating. It's been sitting in the primary for 11 weeks. I fully intend to bottle sometime this week.

Just from memory of my last Mogul and my last taste from the primary, I'm thinking that I will need to mash higher, and up the caramel and roasty malts. I mashed @ 153 for 1.5 hrs. It doesn't seem to have nearly has much body as Mogul.

I have a case of Moguls, so I plan on doing a side by side tasting once the homebrew is ready. I will update this thread when I have done so.

 

[applecran]

Thanks for the info. How much higher heat would you mash at do you think? and what adjustments would you make? .25lb each caramel and kiln?

I can't get either of those yeast here and was planning on using yeast 1024.

 

[gannawdm]

I'll probably mash in the upper 150's next time. As far as the grain adjustments, I don't know. I don't have a ton of experience designing my own recipes, so I don't have a good feel for any of these grains. I definitely plan on doing another attempt once I've tried my first batch, but I won't formulate another recipe until I've tested both side by side.

 

[applecran]

Any update on how this turned out? I know it's been a while but I was thinking about this beer again...

 

[gannawdm]

It was not good. The recipe needs a major re-adjustment. I think I added WAY too much kiln coffee and/or it needed more caramal malts....not sure exactly. I choked it down, but didn't offer anybody this beer. You win some, you lose some. I haven't had time for a second attempt.