I am just finishing up my 1st brew and want to try to do a partial mash. I would like to try a good quality pilsner. Nice crisp refreshing for the summer. if anyone has a great pilsner recipe please let me know.
pilsner help
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bgruis
Well-Known Member
Check out my Pilsner recipe...it's pretty simple and people really seem to like it. The recipe button is below my name under the recipes tab....look for Gruis Pils"
JohnTheBrewist
Well-Known Member
There's really no need to do a partial mash on a pilsner. And I wouldn't recommend a lager as your second beer. I'd suggest making a Kölsch. It will come out very close to a light German lager. It will also be ready to drink sooner. Sorry I don't have an extract recipe for it, but there are kits and I'm sure a couple recipes in the database.
I would really like to try to do one. I feel like I would rather get challenged doing something rather then doing the same thing I just did even if I make a mistake I still will learn more from that then doing a extract. Is there just no way to do a partial mash pilsner?
Pilsners are easy: 100% pilsner malt. Use as much German pils grain as you want to mash, use pils extract for the rest (briess makes a good one, add it late in the boil if you are not doing a full boil). Partial mash is not needed, but you certainly can make one using partial mash techniques.
You could brew a "pilsner" with kolsch yeast and you will end up with a really nice beer. But, I agree with BierHerr, a lager is more than you probably want to deal with as a second beer. The kolsch yeast will give you a very lager-like beer and will be much more forgiving in the ferment and will work well in your basement. You can use the fridge to lager it cold for a few weeks after you ferment it out.
You could brew a "pilsner" with kolsch yeast and you will end up with a really nice beer. But, I agree with BierHerr, a lager is more than you probably want to deal with as a second beer. The kolsch yeast will give you a very lager-like beer and will be much more forgiving in the ferment and will work well in your basement. You can use the fridge to lager it cold for a few weeks after you ferment it out.
JohnTheBrewist
Well-Known Member
Yes, as beerrific said you can do a partial mash. I was just pointing out that it wasn't necessary since you're using all the same malt (Pilsner). Since you're a new brewer, I need to ask this: do you know the difference between just steeping grains and a partial mash?
If you're clear on the partial mash concept, then I'd push you even more toward the Kölsch. Many brewers like to add wheat and other specialty grains to their recipe for Kölsch. I think it would be fun to do a partial mash with part Pilsner DME (maybe 2/3) and the rest with Kolsch malt, using noble hops and Kolsch yeast.
I haven't made it this way yet, but I'd be happy to help you formulate a recipe, if you're interested.
BH
If you're clear on the partial mash concept, then I'd push you even more toward the Kölsch. Many brewers like to add wheat and other specialty grains to their recipe for Kölsch. I think it would be fun to do a partial mash with part Pilsner DME (maybe 2/3) and the rest with Kolsch malt, using noble hops and Kolsch yeast.
I haven't made it this way yet, but I'd be happy to help you formulate a recipe, if you're interested.
BH
I have a pretty nice partial mash Kolsch: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f62/cinco-de-mayo-kolsch-30242/ Change the hops to something like all Saaz or Hallertau and add more late in the boil and it will get you to a really nice pilsner-liker beer.
bierherr I would love it if you would help me with that recipe and no I dont really no the complete difference between steeping grains and partial Im assuming its just the amount of grain that you need for a full AG but im not really sure? But ill try to make the Kolsch first if you could help me combine the 2 of them
JohnTheBrewist
Well-Known Member
Essentially, when doing a partial mash, your are making a mini all grain batch and adding your dme to it during the boil. So you need a means of mashing the grain (typically along the lines of BIAB).
Many beginner recipes call for steeped grains. They add mostly color and some flavor but little in the way of fermentables.
So, before we get started with a recipe, tell me about your equipment. What size pot do you have? Do you have a chiller? Do you have a spare ice chest or drink cooler? Are you cooking on a stovetop or propane burner?
By the way, Beerrific's Kolsch recipe looks pretty tasty, too.
Many beginner recipes call for steeped grains. They add mostly color and some flavor but little in the way of fermentables.
So, before we get started with a recipe, tell me about your equipment. What size pot do you have? Do you have a chiller? Do you have a spare ice chest or drink cooler? Are you cooking on a stovetop or propane burner?
By the way, Beerrific's Kolsch recipe looks pretty tasty, too.
I currently have a 5 gallong stainless steel brew pot. i also have a 3 gallon stainless steel pot. I have a mini fridge downstairs for cooling. i dont have a propane burner yet thats coming in the next 3 weeks or so. So just a reg stovetop.
I really just want to get away from the liquid extract. It just has a off flavor id like to get rid of
I really just want to get away from the liquid extract. It just has a off flavor id like to get rid of
JohnTheBrewist
Well-Known Member
OK, I think we can work with what you have. Take a look at the videos on this site. For a partial mash, I think you should mash a gallon with the Kolsch grains using their stove top method. Then you'll add some more water and the DME during the boil, and then add cold water to chill as you probably did in your first batch.
If you think this will work for you, then we'll start work on the recipe. Did you use distilled or RO water for your first batch? If you used tap water, that might have contributed to the off flavor you didn't like. Since this beer is basically a Pilsner, you will definately need to use all bottled water.
One more question for tonight: when you think of a pilsner you like, is there a particular one that comes to mind? Not that we're going to copy it, but I'd like to know where you'd like it on the hop bitterness scale.
BH
If you think this will work for you, then we'll start work on the recipe. Did you use distilled or RO water for your first batch? If you used tap water, that might have contributed to the off flavor you didn't like. Since this beer is basically a Pilsner, you will definately need to use all bottled water.
One more question for tonight: when you think of a pilsner you like, is there a particular one that comes to mind? Not that we're going to copy it, but I'd like to know where you'd like it on the hop bitterness scale.
BH
I used poland spring bottled water for all 5 gallons figured it would be better than tap. Is there a certain type you would suggest to use.
Also I just love all german pilsners. I like them to have a slight hop flavor just not to much. I don't really know the brands that much I just know any german one ive ever tried ive loved. I can only say thats true with german pils though not bohemian or dutch there good but certain ones I don't like. I hate amstel I like stella from a fresh keg not out of a bottle though has a slight skunky flavor.
Also I just love all german pilsners. I like them to have a slight hop flavor just not to much. I don't really know the brands that much I just know any german one ive ever tried ive loved. I can only say thats true with german pils though not bohemian or dutch there good but certain ones I don't like. I hate amstel I like stella from a fresh keg not out of a bottle though has a slight skunky flavor.
JohnTheBrewist
Well-Known Member
OK, that helps some. Oddly, American's tend to call things pilsners that aren't really a pils; Budweiser's label says "A fine pilsner beer" or something like that. But I'm guessing that what you like is a light German Lager rather than a Pils. Stella is a belgian light lager. Bitburger and Dortmunder (DAB) are the best known German Pilsners sold here. Pilsner Urquell is an original Czech pilsner. But the lagers like Paulaner, Spaten, Ayinger, and hofbrau are much more common here. I'd also group Beck's and St. Pauli Girl into the light lager category, even though Beck's calls itself a Pilsner.
The green bottles that imported beer comes in causes the skunking of the beer, and it pisses me off to no end that they mostly come that way here. If I buy any of those beers in Europe they came in a brown bottle, why the fv<k do we have to get them in green bottles!!!
So, I think you will really like a Koelsch brewed to style. I'll start working on a recipe today for you. We'll use 75% pilsner DME and 25% Kolsch grains. Primary hops will be Hallertau, but if you want it to be more like a pilsner we can add some Saaz hops for bittering.
The green bottles that imported beer comes in causes the skunking of the beer, and it pisses me off to no end that they mostly come that way here. If I buy any of those beers in Europe they came in a brown bottle, why the fv<k do we have to get them in green bottles!!!
So, I think you will really like a Koelsch brewed to style. I'll start working on a recipe today for you. We'll use 75% pilsner DME and 25% Kolsch grains. Primary hops will be Hallertau, but if you want it to be more like a pilsner we can add some Saaz hops for bittering.
Bitburger is a perfect example of a German Pils. There is a world wide trend to make lighter less bitter beers, even in Germany,
Making one with extract is not going to work. I've never used an extract that attenuates well enough. Even mashing half of the gravity at 148 for 90 minutes may not pull off a 1.010 FG. JZ recommends adding some sugar. Besides you'd have a hard time finding a extract with a good continental pils flavor.
I'd BIAB all the German pils malt you can in your pot (and defiantly not sparge it) then add a small amout of extra light DME to get the desired OG. Use noble hops at 90, 15 and flame out.
Making one with extract is not going to work. I've never used an extract that attenuates well enough. Even mashing half of the gravity at 148 for 90 minutes may not pull off a 1.010 FG. JZ recommends adding some sugar. Besides you'd have a hard time finding a extract with a good continental pils flavor.
I'd BIAB all the German pils malt you can in your pot (and defiantly not sparge it) then add a small amout of extra light DME to get the desired OG. Use noble hops at 90, 15 and flame out.
JohnTheBrewist
Well-Known Member
Here's my first draft of a recipe for you. I'm an AG brewer, so maybe some of the PM or extract brewers will chime in here too. Remember, this isn't going to be a pilsner, but a koelsch. I've intentionally kept the hop values relatively low.
The water must be very soft, so I'm going to recommend using all RO or distilled water (6 Gals).
Ingredients:
For the mash:
2 lbs Global Kolsch malt (Milled Grain)
2 oz Acidulated malt (Milled Grain)
1/8 tsp Calcium Chloride
For the boil:
4 lbs Pilsner DME
1 oz German Hallertau Hops (as First Wort Hop, placed in pot prior to boil and left for duration of boil)
.5 oz Czech Saaz hops (30 mins)
.5 oz Czech Saaz hops (15 mins)
1/2 Whirlfloc tab (15 mins)
Directions: (Assuming mash in a pot or BIAB) Bring 3 qts water and Calcium Chloride to 150*F, then dough in your grains. Stir the grains a bit. Raise temp if necessary and hold grain temp between 144*F and 149*F for one hour (for Koelsch the mash temp will be a little lower than the usual 152-154*). Dump the mash through a strainer (or remove your grain bag) to another pot. Heat another 2 gallons of water to 168*F. and pour slowly over your grains, recirculate all the wort a few times through the grains.
Lightly press the grains (but don't squeeze) to release more water, then set the grains aside. Add the Hallertau hops to the wort, and another 3qts of water, and bring to a boil. After 30 mins add .5 oz Saaz hops. After another 15 mins add the rest of the hops, the DME and whirlfloc. Turn off heat and add 2 gallons of cold water to cool, put in an ice bath if necessary to get temp to 68f. Take a gravity reading, OG should be about 1.046. Add yeast and ferment.
If you want to do this recipe, PM me when you are ready with your address, and I'll send you the Acid malt, calcium chloride and whirlfloc so you don't need to buy them for such small amounts.
Edit: Forgot to mention which yeast. When I make Kolsch, I use whitelabs Kolsch yeast wlp029. If you use this, you will need to make a starter. But if you want to use dry yeast, I think Nottingham would work well.
Ferment the first 3 days at 68*F, then lower the temp to 60*F for at least 4 weeks. No need to ever transfer this to a secondary. Take a gravity reading before bottling. FG should be about 1.012.
The water must be very soft, so I'm going to recommend using all RO or distilled water (6 Gals).
Ingredients:
For the mash:
2 lbs Global Kolsch malt (Milled Grain)
2 oz Acidulated malt (Milled Grain)
1/8 tsp Calcium Chloride
For the boil:
4 lbs Pilsner DME
1 oz German Hallertau Hops (as First Wort Hop, placed in pot prior to boil and left for duration of boil)
.5 oz Czech Saaz hops (30 mins)
.5 oz Czech Saaz hops (15 mins)
1/2 Whirlfloc tab (15 mins)
Directions: (Assuming mash in a pot or BIAB) Bring 3 qts water and Calcium Chloride to 150*F, then dough in your grains. Stir the grains a bit. Raise temp if necessary and hold grain temp between 144*F and 149*F for one hour (for Koelsch the mash temp will be a little lower than the usual 152-154*). Dump the mash through a strainer (or remove your grain bag) to another pot. Heat another 2 gallons of water to 168*F. and pour slowly over your grains, recirculate all the wort a few times through the grains.
Lightly press the grains (but don't squeeze) to release more water, then set the grains aside. Add the Hallertau hops to the wort, and another 3qts of water, and bring to a boil. After 30 mins add .5 oz Saaz hops. After another 15 mins add the rest of the hops, the DME and whirlfloc. Turn off heat and add 2 gallons of cold water to cool, put in an ice bath if necessary to get temp to 68f. Take a gravity reading, OG should be about 1.046. Add yeast and ferment.
If you want to do this recipe, PM me when you are ready with your address, and I'll send you the Acid malt, calcium chloride and whirlfloc so you don't need to buy them for such small amounts.
Edit: Forgot to mention which yeast. When I make Kolsch, I use whitelabs Kolsch yeast wlp029. If you use this, you will need to make a starter. But if you want to use dry yeast, I think Nottingham would work well.
Ferment the first 3 days at 68*F, then lower the temp to 60*F for at least 4 weeks. No need to ever transfer this to a secondary. Take a gravity reading before bottling. FG should be about 1.012.
I'm going to brew a German pils Monday. Tomorrow I'll make a Schwarzbier. I'll use Saflager 34/70 for the pills, 50:50 Wyermann and Best pils and Spalt hops. It seems like a simple beer but it's not.
I've never had a authentic Kolsch just micro brewed examples. They taste too much like light lagers to me. A pilsner is more malty and more hoppy. I think the brew pubs make them to please BMC drinkers (and because most can't brew lagers.)
I've never had a authentic Kolsch just micro brewed examples. They taste too much like light lagers to me. A pilsner is more malty and more hoppy. I think the brew pubs make them to please BMC drinkers (and because most can't brew lagers.)
you can set yourself up to do all grain, if you have an old cooler lying around, you could build your mash tun with that. i converted one (a 12 gallon igloo cube) for around $20. according to you list of equipment you have already, sounds like you just need a mash tun. then you can do anything you want except maybe triple decoction and stuff like that, i still suppose you could do decoctions, just wouldn't have a burner under the cooler (that would'nt work out too well (plastic & fire)) good luck with whatever you do, this is cool stuff.
JohnTheBrewist
Well-Known Member
He doesn't have a big enough pot to do a full boil, and he doesn't have a wort chiller. Otherwise I generally agree, If your going to take the time to do a PM then you might as well go AG. Unfortunately, pot size is the limiting factor.
Redliner, I made some minor edits to the recipe, and may continue to as I think of things you should know or do (and as anyone else adds suggestions I think should be incorporated), so if you print it out, be sure you take the most current version.
ok that sounds great i wont be doing it for a couple weeks anyways. Also I plan on getting a propane burner then getting a chiller. then a mash tun so slowly ill get there i hope to have it all in the next 3-4 months or so. I can't go to crazy or the wife gets mad lol
I imagine you could get close by using 100% pilsner malt, and kolsch yeast, fermenting in the lower 60's.
I just bottled a bmc clone using pilsner, some flakes rice, and corn sugar, fermented with kolsch as above. Tasted almost identical to any bmc, with perhaps a tad more pilsner taste.
I just bottled a bmc clone using pilsner, some flakes rice, and corn sugar, fermented with kolsch as above. Tasted almost identical to any bmc, with perhaps a tad more pilsner taste.
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