Persistent infection nightmare

[Davrosh]

Ok. Going to be a long one this. I have been getting what I assume to be some kind of lacto infection persistently for a year now, and I can't get rid. It's driving me mental and spoiling some excellent beers. Drinkable, but not as good as they should be.

My sanitation is never sloppy, and I will explain my processes later. I am 99.999999999% certain I know where this infection came from:

A starter that took 3 days to take off. I was going to brew a tripel, and I brewed a starter that showed no sign of activity whatsoever fora few days. So in the meantime I brewed up another beer. Anyway, I left the starter for a few days and it eventually took off day three. I let it ferment, crash cooled and decanted into a sterilised bottle (filled with starsan solution), which I kept in the fridge for a few days, then brewed up the tripel. I hadn't noticed any off flavours or smells in the tripel or starter, but it was my first time using 3787, so even if I had I might have just put it down to a bit of Belgian funk.

Anyway, after this beer I went on a bit of a brewing frenzy over spring/summer in anticipation of a brewing hiatus due to a new sleep/time depriving addition to the family.

I must have brewed about 8 beers in that period, and as they were all brewed quite close together I didn't notice anything was wrong until second to last; a stout that wasn't quite right (overly tart) and seemed to have developed a pelicle. Then the alarm bells started to ring!

None of my recently brewed beers seemed to be ageing very well - they would taste incredible after carbing at about 2 weeks, but then seemed to deteriorate somewhat. There was something present in every one that I couldn't put my finger on.

On closer inspection, every batch post the dodgy starter tripel had a pelicle to varying degrees, and some pretty heavy yeast deposits clinging to the sides and the necks of the bottles.

All the beers That I still had left pre tripel, including the black IPA that I brewed in between the dodgy starter and the tripel did not have a pelicle, and all seemed pretty good.

This leads me to believe the infection started in my tripel (fermented in a glass carbon) and was spread into my bottling line.

Also, none of my beers seemed to develop anything funky or strange during fermentation (both carboy and plastic bucket fermented beers - anyway, my bucket should have been fine as the tripel never touched it).

I then had a 5 month hiatus due to the new sleep depriver. In which time I replaced all my plastic (bottling bucket, autosiphon, fermenter, bottling wand).

Fast forward to this feb. I brewed my first beer since the new depriver; a ~6% porter using chocolate malt for the bulk of the dark grains. Primary for about a month, then bottled. It was amazing. Smelled like chocolate more so than any beer I have ever brewed and tasted spit on. Balanced, and the 6% was hidden very well. This was for the first 3 weeks. Then I noticed the tang. I couldn't be sure at this point though.

I brewed another. This time a cracking APA. Again, initially it was by far the best APA I had brewed. Very hoppy, backed up with a nice hint of caramel. But again. About 3 weeks in it started to taste a bit... Less good.

On inspection of the bottles, they all had at least a slight pelicle again, and the yeast deposits in the side.

At this point I was at a complete and utter ****ing loss as to how to stop this, and where it was coming from. Until u realised that although I had replaced all my plastic, I didn't replace my bottling tree. Cod this be harbouring the infection?

So. I boiled the fecker. For a good 20 minutes, and also gave it a good starsan wipe, and replaced my bottling wand before bottling my last beer (a Belgian wit).

Surely this should nail the little bastards.

Anyway. Said beer has been in the bottle about a week now, and I fear I still haven't killed it. Been in the bottle about a week, but it doesn't look good (although it could be bottle krausen at this stage). Tastes ok, but all of them have early on, and in a wit the supposed lacto would not be entirely out of place.

Anyway. My bottling process is:

Clean every bottle after or shortly after use with a bleach/water solution, rinse and store.

Day before bottling day - spray or wipe my bottling tree, rinse every bottle again a couple of times and store upside down on bottling tree.

Bottling day - rinse my bottling bucket, autosiphon, bottling wand. Then fill my bottling bucket with about 4litres of starsan solution. Shake, make sure all surface are well contacted. Dunk in my autosiphon, put the tube inside and pump through. I also spray all the surfaces as well.
I then spray the tap, and empty the bucket through the bottling wand, back into the solution bottle.

Meanwhile, boil some water for a good ten minutes, spray pan. Boil sugar with water for 5-10, lid on. Cool for a bit with lid over. Pour into bottling bucket.

I then use my starsan spray thing (avinator???) to "sterilise" each bottle and store on tree.

Bottle through wand. And spray/submerge all caps in starsan prior to capping.



Anyway. Any input is much appreciated. I'm at my wits end with this. Gutted, and all out of ideas.

 

[wolves63]

Hard surfaces will be able to be cleaned up pretty easily with starsan. I would say changing out your vinyl tubing is the best option or potentially boiling them. Your soft surfaces will have small spots to harbor bugs/brett that the starsan will not be able to get to.

 

[Davrosh]

Hard surfaces will be able to be cleaned up pretty easily with starsan. I would say changing out your vinyl tubing is the best option or potentially boiling them. Your soft surfaces will have small spots to harbor bugs/brett that the starsan will not be able to get to.

Thanks for the reply. I already did that. It didn't work.

 

[Davrosh]

Hard surfaces will be able to be cleaned up pretty easily with starsan. I would say changing out your vinyl tubing is the best option or potentially boiling them. Your soft surfaces will have small spots to harbor bugs/brett that the starsan will not be able to get to.

Thanks for the reply. I already did that. It didn't work. I replaced all my plastic and have boiled my bottling tree.

 

[Paradigm]

Run boiling water through the things that can handle it (warning, bottling wants cannot handle it) and set the rest out in the sun on a nice, hot day. Bake those ****ers.

 

[Davrosh]

Run boiling water through the things that can handle it (warning, bottling wants cannot handle it) and set the rest out in the sun on a nice, hot day. Bake those ****ers.

I was thinking of filling my boiler, getting it to boil, then opening the tap whilst it boils and draining into my buckets. Not sure the autosiphon would survive though.

Would try the leaving stuff to bake in the sun but I live in Leeds (northern England). Nice hot days are few and far between haha!

 

[MaxStout]

Looks like you're doing all the right things. Which makes it all the more frustrating.

A couple minor things.

When you clean that bottling bucket tap, do you make sure Starsan gets thoroughly inside as well? I drop my valve in the Starsan (with the valve in open position, so Starsan can go through it). After a few minutes, and while keeping it submerged, I turn the valve off and on several times, to work Starsan into it. Some types of valves can be disassembled, which would be even better.

Also, do you take apart the bottling wand to clean and sanitize? If you disassemble it over a small bowl of Starsan you won't have to worry about losing the tiny parts. Also, I only connect the wand to the bottling bucket valve with a very short length of tubing, typically 5 or 6 cm long. I replace that bit of tubing often.

I also spray the bottling tree with Starsan just before I start putting sanitized bottles on it, and keep it wet throughout the loading process. I'm concerned about those little plastic prongs contaminating the insides of my freshly-vinated bottles. And when I use the vinator, I pump it 3 or 4 times for each bottle to ensure good coverage. During bottling, I spray the outside of the wand with Starsan every couple bottles or so.

This all seems a bit paranoid, but it's what I do to minimize the places germs can hide. It's a little extra work, but that's minor in comparison to the work (and expense) that goes into beer that otherwise goes bad.

I've been burned by a couple infected batches, so I feel for you. Both times, the beer tasted fine early, then got worse. I think the bottling process was the vector. It's the weak link in the sanitizing chain. Most of the yeast has flocculated and there's not much to compete with bacteria that gets in.

 

[wolves63]

I would suggest the next bottling that you do try and do it without the bottling wand. If you still get the pellicle then you know that it isn't the wand and if you don't get the pellicle then you know it is the wand.

Are you primary fermenters plastic or glass? There is a chance that you are picking it up there. You have to remember that if you primary is infected it won't initially be noticeable (the bugs are typically a little bit slower acting and your initial krausen will hide them), and would start being noticeable about the time you bottle or a little later.

 

[BSBrewer83]

Do you use the same carboy for all of the beers? That might need to be replaced.

Also the entire bottling tree cant be infected. You would have some bottles that weren't infected.

With how much you are brewing I would look into replacing everything on the cold side. Its worth it in the long run. I'm paranoid about hoses, tubing, or anything I can't wash with my hands because you just don't know if you are getting rid of everything.

 

[poptarts]

have you tried leaving beer in primary for an extended amount of time to eliminate everything before bottling?

 

[Davrosh]

Looks like you're doing all the right things. Which makes it all the more frustrating.



A couple minor things.



When you clean that bottling bucket tap, do you make sure Starsan gets thoroughly inside as well? I drop my valve in the Starsan (with the valve in open position, so Starsan can go through it). After a few minutes, and while keeping it submerged, I turn the valve off and on several times, to work Starsan into it. Some types of valves can be disassembled, which would be even better.



Also, do you take apart the bottling wand to clean and sanitize? If you disassemble it over a small bowl of Starsan you won't have to worry about losing the tiny parts. Also, I only connect the wand to the bottling bucket valve with a very short length of tubing, typically 5 or 6 cm long. I replace that bit of tubing often.



I also spray the bottling tree with Starsan just before I start putting sanitized bottles on it, and keep it wet throughout the loading process. I'm concerned about those little plastic prongs contaminating the insides of my freshly-vinated bottles. And when I use the vinator, I pump it 3 or 4 times for each bottle to ensure good coverage. During bottling, I spray the outside of the wand with Starsan every couple bottles or so.



This all seems a bit paranoid, but it's what I do to minimize the places germs can hide. It's a little extra work, but that's minor in comparison to the work (and expense) that goes into beer that otherwise goes bad.



I've been burned by a couple infected batches, so I feel for you. Both times, the beer tasted fine early, then got worse. I think the bottling process was the vector. It's the weak link in the sanitizing chain. Most of the yeast has flocculated and there's not much to compete with bacteria that gets in.

My tap is a plastic one that can be taken apart. I do this after bottling and wash well. I also do it to spray before bottling.

I pretty much follow your methods during bottling by the sounds of it, maybe apart from keeping the prigs wet at all times.

My bottling wand attaches straight to the tap also. I bought a new one for the last batch as well.

It really does initially seem that bottling us also my weak link, but I already swapped everything bar the tree, and it didn't work.

 

[Davrosh]

have you tried leaving beer in primary for an extended amount of time to eliminate everything before bottling?

No. I am beginning to think that might be a good idea. Everything initially told me it was post fermentation, but experience is beginning to suggest otherwise.

I have never noticed an infection in the fermenter. Howling before it would show up?

 

[poptarts]

No. I am beginning to think that might be a good idea. Everything initially told me it was post fermentation, but experience is beginning to suggest otherwise.

I have never noticed an infection in the fermenter. Howling before it would show up?

how long does it take to show up in bottles? add that time to primary, if it doesnt show up after like 5 weeks or somthing its probably some issue after or durring your beer leaving primary.

 

[Davrosh]

Do you use the same carboy for all of the beers? That might need to be replaced.



Also the entire bottling tree cant be infected. You would have some bottles that weren't infected.



With how much you are brewing I would look into replacing everything on the cold side. Its worth it in the long run. I'm paranoid about hoses, tubing, or anything I can't wash with my hands because you just don't know if you are getting rid of everything.

I have a glass carboy and a plastic bucket. The carboy was what I fermented the tripel in that I assume was the initial culprit. If that were the case, my bucket should be ok. I also thought the glass was pretty easy to clean. I have bleach bombed the ****er a few times anyway.

I already replaced everything on the cold side. I am reluctant to do it again, but I suppose once the little fecks are in there...

 

[BSBrewer83]

I have a glass carboy and a plastic bucket. The carboy was what I fermented the tripel in that I assume was the initial culprit. If that were the case, my bucket should be ok. I also thought the glass was pretty easy to clean. I have bleach bombed the ****er a few times anyway.

I already replaced everything on the cold side. I am reluctant to do it again, but I suppose once the little fecks are in there...

Must be so frustrating. Sounds like you are doing everything you can. I feel for ya. Get rid of airlocks. Look at where you are fermenting/bottling to see if anything could be getting there that is airborne. Doubt that is the cause but youve already eliminated so much.

 

[Davrosh]

Must be so frustrating. Sounds like you are doing everything you can. I feel for ya. Get rid of airlocks. Look at where you are fermenting/bottling to see if anything could be getting there that is airborne. Doubt that is the cause but youve already eliminated so much.

Believe me, it is infuriating beyond belief. Some of the beers that have gone south would have been excellent. That said, none have been undrinkable. On the bright side, of all the possible infections out there, these little bastards have been quite lenient. No bottle bombs, only mild gushers and no rancid flavours, just a sharp tartness and slight funk that shouldn't be there. It actually worked in a saison. Being a bit if a perfectionist I have had enough now.

Good point on the airlocks. It obviously is something that is airborne, but I brew ferment and bottle in the same room and only room that I can do in the house. Also it was never a problem until that tripel. Pretty sure that had I just taken the hit and chucked the starter and never brewed the tripel, none of this would be happening.

 

[madscientist451]

Are you still using the same yeast? Get some dry yeast and try that, maybe your yeast starting/handing is causing the problem?
How do you chill the wort? Any chance the chiller equipment is infected?
Carefully look in your bottles, any bottles with hard to clean material should be discarded.
If you are using star-san, you don't need bleach. Rinsing the bleach can be harder than you think and the bleach can lead to off flavors. Stop using the bottling tree. Fill a bucket with star-san solution, rinse each bottle and submerge in the star san. You can get 9-10 bottles in a bucket that way. Have your caps counted out and in a smaller container of star san. (You are mixing the star san at the recommended amount?)
Take a bottle out of the bucket, dump the star san from the bottle back into the bucket, fill with beer and cap right away.
Your fermentors should get the star san treatment after you empty them and them again before filling.

 

[Davrosh]

Are you still using the same yeast? Get some dry yeast and try that, maybe your yeast starting/handing is causing the problem?
How do you chill the wort? Any chance the chiller equipment is infected?
Carefully look in your bottles, any bottles with hard to clean material should be discarded.
If you are using star-san, you don't need bleach. Rinsing the bleach can be harder than you think and the bleach can lead to off flavors. Stop using the bottling tree. Fill a bucket with star-san solution, rinse each bottle and submerge in the star san. You can get 9-10 bottles in a bucket that way. Have your caps counted out and in a smaller container of star san. (You are mixing the star san at the recommended amount?)
Take a bottle out of the bucket, dump the star san from the bottle back into the bucket, fill with beer and cap right away.
Your fermentors should get the star san treatment after you empty them and them again before filling.

I actually only rarely use liquid yeast. It's not readily available where I live and I'm reluctant to get it delivered as I think that is what got me in this mess in the first place.

I chill with a spiral copper wort chiller which I submerge at least 20 minutes from the end of the boil. I'd be very surprised if that was the issue.

Good idea on the bucket and starsan idea. I might try that. I have a beer ready to bottle in a few days so I might give that a try.

I dilute my starsan to 1.8ml per litre (3.6ml in 2L bottles of water).

 

[soccerdad]

I was having some problems that I nailed down to my bottling processes and I gave everything a bleach bath .. bottle bucket, spigot, tubing, wand. It went away. There was nothing in the fermentation that was out of line .. it was after it went into bottles.

 

[IslandLizard]

Sorry to hear about that tenacious infection ruining your good beer. Good advice was given and you're on the way to fix it.

I would pay special attention to the spigot in your bottling bucket, it maybe part of the problem. Clean it well or replace it, together with the rubbery seal. Those seals can harbor bugs.

Most of those bucket spigots have 2 main barrels that rotate into one another. One has the nut and the other has the little valve at the end. They pull (or rather push) apart after heating in very hot water for a minute or so. I found a slimy layer between them that was turning black.

I don't know how well you clean your bottles. Just for the record, I always use a bottle brush, hot water and washing soda (or PBW) to clean the inside of bottles. Then rinse on the bottle jet sprayer and allowed to drain. When bottling they get submerged in Starsan then drained.

The infection you experience in the bottles may come from higher up in the chain, but don't rule out the bottles themselves. They need to be squeaky clean, particularly after having had an infection in them.

 

[drgonzo2k2]

I dilute my starsan to 1.8ml per litre (3.6ml in 2L bottles of water).

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but isn't that dreadfully low? Shouldn't you be using 1 oz of StarSan for 5 gallons of water, which would be about 30 ml for about 3.8 liters of water? So for your 2 liters of water you'd want more like 15 ml?

Are you using PH test strips or a PH meter on your Star San solution? Those test strips are so cheap that I just use one ever time before I use my Star San. I just mix up 5 gallons at a time and keep using it until it's gone or it test above 3.5 Ph.

 

[IslandLizard]

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but isn't that dreadfully low? Shouldn't you be using 1 oz of StarSan for 5 gallons of water, which would be about 30 ml for about 3.8 liters of water? So for your 2 liters of water you'd want more like 15 ml?

Are you using PH test strips or a PH meter on your Star San solution? Those test strips are so cheap that I just use one ever time before I use my Star San. I just mix up 5 gallons at a time and keep using it until it's gone or it test above 3.5 Ph.

Nope!
1.6ml / liter is about the same as 30ml (1oz) per 19 liter (5 US gallons).

Now measuring accurately 1.6 ml, or double that (3.2 ml), maybe a bit of a challenge.

The pH can be lowered with Phosphoric acid if it rises above 3.5. It will keep working that way.

 

[drgonzo2k2]

Nope!
1.6ml / liter is about the same as 30ml (1oz) per 19 liter (5 US gallons).

Now measuring accurately 1.6 ml, or double that (3.2 ml), maybe a bit of a challenge.

The pH can be lowered with Phosphoric acid if it rises above 3.5. It will keep working that way.

Doh! Forgot to multiply by 5 there. Sorry about that, carry on!

 

[Transamguy77]

I completely understand your frustration I went through the same thing about a year ago, I dumped about 70 gallons of beer.

I didn't read the whole thread but I saw someone posted about your environment you brew and bottle in, that WAS my problem what you are describing is exactly what I had going on but sometimes it started during fermentation or it started a few weeks in the keg or bottle.

The problem was in my basement it was a 100 year old house and the further I moved from my basement the better things got, I had fermenters in my living room and bed rooms and I was bottling/kegging in an upstairs bedroom.

I have since moved from that house and I haven't had a problem in my new house but I also used a strong bleach solution on ALL of my equipment, I let the bleach water dry and rinsed everything the next day. I put my lids and plastic stuff in the dishwasher and removed the sealing gasket from the lids because I found mold under it.

Do you have the option to brew at a friends house? Do the whole process somewhere else and see if it goes away. I know it's super frustrating to loose all that beer and the time to make it. I hope you figure it out soon.

 

[IslandLizard]

+1 ^

That got me thinking about this: Grain is covered in lactobacillus. Don't weigh grain or mill in the area you ferment, rack, or bottle. Grain is stored away from that too, and I always mill outside, even at -20F when that so happens.

 

[MaxStout]

If you don't already, consider getting some plastic storage bins with lids, to stow your gear when not in use. It will help you minimize the equipment's exposure to contaminants during storage.

 

[Kyle1111]

Have you tried getting some new bottles? I doubt it's the case, and I know lacto can remain unnoticeable and only show up long after packaging, but it sounds like it's the only thing you haven't replaced except your carboy... Maybe just get enough for a batch (or even half a batch and put them aside, so you can see if the infection shows up in the other half).

Anyway, hope you get it sorted out soon.

 

[tstanonis1]

yes, I agree with the grain milling. that needs to be done in a completely separate area. also I have heard of problems in the kitchen where a wife would make home made sourdough bread in the kitchen and the husband kept getting infected batches of beer. the problem went away when the husband moved the beer operations to the garage... maybe your beer room is the problem and you should move to a different area.... never mind I've been drinking

 

[Davrosh]

I buy my grain pre milled, but I do weigh out and mash in the same room, so I suppose there is a possibility that grain dust is to blame. Never been a problem in the past though.

I could weight out in a different room, but I can't really mash anywhere else. I brew in my kitchen and it is literally the only place that I can brew. I don't have a garage and I live in a pretty small house.

I was almost certain the infection came from the tripel I brewed with the dodgy starter, and that the bugs had caught hold in my bottling line. Obviously since replacing all this and having no luck, maybe I need to re-evaluate everything.

 

[Davrosh]

Have you tried getting some new bottles? I doubt it's the case, and I know lacto can remain unnoticeable and only show up long after packaging, but it sounds like it's the only thing you haven't replaced except your carboy... Maybe just get enough for a batch (or even half a batch and put them aside, so you can see if the infection shows up in the other half).



Anyway, hope you get it sorted out soon.

I always reuse bottles, but many are new every brew, and in the last couple there have been quite a few clean "infection free" bottles (shop bought beers, cleaned and sanitised as usual).

I always thought that as long as you bleach bomb glass it should be fine?

 

[Gary_Oak]

I'm a huge fan of boiling to sanitize especially bottles and the reason for that is boiling water not only disinfects but also dissolves all microscopic residue that could still linger on the bottles and you can physically see and smell it coming out into the boiling water and It isn't like they arn't washed out because I soak them for a at least a day in a large storage crate to get the labels off now I use a full sized 6" deep steam table pan that I also use for sugaring it's nice because you can put bottles in sideways and it fits nicely across two burners, it is a little more work but I think it's worth it it when you see how clean they come out, I'm sure you already do this but avoid contact with air as much as possible. And make sure your not siphoning a lot of yeast cake

 

[Davrosh]

Ok. Thanks for all the input. Here's my current plan of action:

I'm going to look at the cleanliness of my bottles first. I'm bottling a batch of red IPA this week. It isn't showing any signs of infection at the moment nearly three weeks into primary.

I am currently soaking my bottles for this batch in an oxy type cleaner. Will rinse properly tomorrow and bottle on Friday.

I'm not going to use the bottling tree and avinator. I'm plan to fill each bottle with starsan, and transfer in batches.

I think if the infection shows up again, I need to look further back in the chain. I'll also have to (reluctantly) replace all my plastic... Again.

I am also going to dismantle my boiler tap and deep clean and boil.

For my next batch I'm going to mix and weigh my grain in a different room to where I brew and ferment.

I am also going to boil the extended siphon section that I attach to my tap to transfer rather than starsan it.


I will report back for anyone who is interested and for anyone who has any similar issues in the future.


What a fecking ball ache.

 

[aprichman]

I'm a huge fan of boiling to sanitize especially bottles and the reason for that is boiling water not only disinfects but also dissolves all microscopic residue that could still linger on the bottles and you can physically see and smell it coming out into the boiling water and It isn't like they arn't washed out because I soak them for a at least a day in a large storage crate to get the labels off now I use a full sized 6" deep steam table pan that I also use for sugaring it's nice because you can put bottles in sideways and it fits nicely across two burners, it is a little more work but I think it's worth it it when you see how clean they come out, I'm sure you already do this but avoid contact with air as much as possible. And make sure your not siphoning a lot of yeast cake

Water will not dissolve nonpolar compounds like oils.

 

[Tippsy-Turvy]

Just for the record, I always use a bottle brush

I find that just soaking the bottles overnight in PBW and rinsing does not remove well-encrusted yeast on the bottle walls. Now I ALWAYS use a bottle brush after the soak.

Then, to combat airborne bacteria I now routinely cover any opening with plastic wrap once the wort's been cooled and on bottling day. So, the pot gets covered in plastic wrap before I siphon to the fermenter, the fermenter mouth gets covered in plastic wrap with only the tubing going through and on bottling day, the bottling bucket gets covered whilst its filling. I have a German Shepherd and i'm constantly amazed where his hairs end up!

As an aside, just as I was writing I was pondering on an idea that might help isolate the source of an infection. If one had several sterilised small containers, one could take samples for taste-testing later from along the entire process. Say, one sample each from the cooled wort, the fermenter at FG, the primed bottling batch etc.

Anyway, good luck. We feel for you.

 

[Davrosh]

Bit of an update. Wouldn't mind a few opinions of this. Bottled my red IPA yesterday. Been in primary three weeks, dry hopped for a week. Nothing noticeably off in it but the surface of the beer suggested there could be something wrong. No big ugly pelicle or furry bits, just a little bit of a film.

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1431856594.539828.jpgView attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1431856616.743637.jpg

Anyone else think those floaters could be a sign of a mild infection in primary? First time I've noticed it to be honest, but I never really get too paranoid about the appearance of beer in the fermenter.

 

[IslandLizard]

Bit of an update. Wouldn't mind a few opinions of this. Bottled my red IPA yesterday. Been in primary three weeks, dry hopped for a week. Nothing noticeably off in it but the surface of the beer suggested there could be something wrong. No big ugly pelicle or furry bits, just a little bit of a film.

View attachment 278628View attachment 278629

Anyone else think those floaters could be a sign of a mild infection in primary? First time I've noticed it to be honest, but I never really get too paranoid about the appearance of beer in the fermenter.

Sad to say, that broken ice surface has the looks of a starting lacto infection.

Is there something in your sanitation regimen you're overlooking? Did you rack to a secondary before dry hopping or is that still the primary?

How were those dry hops packaged? Vacuum sealed pouches or loose from a bin?

On a side note, many of us find pellicles fascinating and beautiful.

 

[IslandLizard]

1. How do you make your yeast starters? From fresh yeast or reusing from stored or previous batches?
2. Do you boil the starter wort? Then chill it covered?
3. What kind of vessel do you grow the starter in?
4. Did you boil the stir bar and vessel beforehand?

 

[Davrosh]

I'm generally quite thorough in my sanitation processes.

I never get really rack to secondary. I dry hop in primary. I dry hop in a Muslim hop bag, suspended in the beer with string, weighed down with marbles.

I boil the bag and string, and steam the marbles.

The hops come vacuum packed. I pack them as tight as I can between use, squeeze the air out, tape up the lack and wrap in cling film, put in an airtight container and store in the freezer.

I almost always use dry yeast. I don't rehydrate as I genuinely don't see the point, I just sprinkle in. Never have a long lag.

 

[IslandLizard]

OK, that helps to eliminate some possible causes. I'd say it's definitely in your sanitation practices.

From the amount of pellicle it looks like it started recently or it would have been thicker, more developed, and most likely since you opened the primary for dry hopping. I asked about "bulk" hops as someone had a similar infection problem and it likely came from hops stored in open bins (yeah, really!) at the brew store, where they also milled grain.

Do you spray or mop liberally with Starsan underneath the lid's rim before removing it, and as soon as the lid is off, wipe the rim with a Starsan-soaked cloth? Bugs could cling and develop in that area during the 3-4 weeks primary phase. I hope you clean and resanitize the lid before putting it back on.

Also note, there is quite a large headspace in that bucket, which will fill with air quickly. After infection, pellicles only develop in presence of oxygen, as a weapon to prevent other organisms from entering.

 

[IslandLizard]

One thing that's not been addressed is your wort preparation. Do you use extract, if so what kind? Steeping grains? Do you boil all the extract or partially and add the rest at the end.

How do you chill? And rack to fermentor? Can anything creep in there?

Although you say you don't encounter long lag times, it's still better to rehydrate yeast before pitching, as many more cells will survive the initial dunk, and give you a much better start. Competing organisms will be crowded out faster.

How do you aerate/oxigenate?